primecut

iTrader: (1)

ha ha... Except that if you manage a lambo, there are very few cars above it that you can harass.. maybe you can harass a Veyron? ha ha

Isfast

iTrader: (13)

*SIGH* These threads can go on for ever comparing apples to oranges......so let me add some fuel to the fire here.
It's time for the boys with the Supras to come out and play.......we can compare quarter mile times with any bimmer if you would like......

gs400tx

I figured I would drop in here for a bit. Until 5 months ago, I had a 98gs400. It was replaced with a 335.

Some info on mods and 135s/335s

Factory boost is like 8.5 psi. Most aftermaket kits (piggybacks in the 300-700 range and complete ECUs - which start at about 1500) kick that up from 11 to 14psi (edit YES 15peak for the JB3) depending on who you select.

The dinan 2 is like 13 in the midrange but tapers to about 7 at peak hp. It is generally one of the more conservative tunes - and consists of an ECU flash - basically the same as a chip. The JB* (juicebox from burgertuning.com) raise it about 11 psi (at peak torque) but has much less taper at peak HP. They generally provide about 320hp at the tires with about the same torque. If that is combined with the open air-intake your looking at about 330 (and about 10 less on the 135 due to single exhaust). It is not a chip - it is known as a piggy back and alters signals to the ECM basically accomplishing the same thing - Airfuel ratio changes in addition to boost increase.

Lexus certainly holds the advantage in reliability (which is of minimal importance bc BMWs have a 4year/50K bumper to bumper warranty that includes all maintenance) but the driving dynamics are the BMW advantage. If you want isolation from the road lexus will provide that more than any BMW (even when comparing a ISF to a softer sprung 135/335)


To the poster in update 37. NO N54 do not overheat (early ones were running the oil temps as high as 300degrees when driven like hell by magazines or on the track - Iv hammermeed on mine and its never gone about 245 degrees) High pressure fuel pump failures are more rare than to seem to indicate. They generally dont fail and strand someone - just cause longer startups and maybe a reduced boost pressure which is rapidly diagnosed.

There are people who have been R&Ding boost mods (other than dinan) for close to 2 years now with weekly trips to the track (and running upper 11s at 116 while making 400hp/torque at the tires) getting hammered on pass after pass and these have not failed. Most these boost kits DO NOT run the motor at max boost for more than a few seconds out of the day (if not you would either be dead, or in jail) so the additional stress on the motor is minimal.

BMW is stringent about modding cars bc it could damage the drive train, but these events have not been happening to modded cars anymore than unmodded ones. Not to mention the most recent versions (of the mods) are not detected by the various ECMs (or service departments) and for that reason, they dont make warranty revocation an issue.

And lastly, there is NO pully kit for the 135/335. Its all done with boost increase/intake,exhaust (maybe 10hp at the most) and finally intercoolers (minimal Hp increases but keeps hp up better for multiple pulls/runs) combined (normally) with catless downpipes right after the turbos (usually worth about 20hp)

And the 135 is advertised at about 180lbs less than a 335.
Some BMW drivers have big heads but for about 600-700dollars in boltons the n54-335motor will make 30 percent more hp than factory (easy 350 with a little more torque) and do it with very good reliability and not to mention fuel economy (30 at 70 to 72mph).
I do not believe the 335 is gods own race car and generally most owners on e90post.com or n54tech.com (the site for the developer of the Juicebox piggybacks) dont either. They get spanked by other cars all the time - I got pulled on by an LS1 with heads and cam pretty the other day. They run good for minimal mods and thats satisfactory for most.

AND yes a unmodded 5liter V8 in a 3800lb car will outperform an unmodded 3.0 liter 6cylinder in a 3500lb car - no real rocket-science there...
there, now that's been acknowledged, let it go


Now regarding the CTS-V it will be very close to Supercharger max speed in factory form. It is driven faster than the SC in the vette - http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/...omparison.html

They already run 12flats at about 120, if you need more speed than that then I guess a z06/zr1 is for you.

edit
Now to be completely fair, the http://www.vishnutuning.com/products.htm is working on a air-intake and ECU update for the for the ISF and its expected to produce over 30hp extra at the tires. So the 10 percent weight difference when compared to a 335 should make it very close again. And in the end - IMO, its not about who can throw the most $$ at it, its about getting good performance for your dollar - regardless if its stock or modded

335i Beast

I have the JB3 and it runs 15 psi........

Lexus999

well bro as the OP of this thread it all comes down to this... without mods your car will lose to the ISF straight up. you slap any bolt on uprgrade any turbo and before you know it sooner or later artisan, trd, HKS, etc will develop more parts for 8 cyl toyota engine than a BMW and parts will be cheaper last longer and it will blow the doors off of that inline 6 you call a sports car. hell!!! i can even call up some buddys with 2jz turboed is300's that has 100K on the motor and it will spank your 335.

i can **** on about cost wise truth for the matter i found out exactly what my buddy paid for in mods and tuning he paid 43K for the car and 7 grand in mods and labor.

i rather spend the 10K to a car that looks more refined than a **** box. so now i look back on my first post and realized i made such a dumb statement out of anger...

go ahead and keep the apple and ill hold on to my orange.... just check back with me in a few monthes and youll see my own TT breathing under my hood

smokyis350

iTrader: (21)

lol not another one of these threads. X vs 335

why does every forum have to compare their cars to the 335?

LOL @ whoever said put a twin turbo in a IS-F will get 600 HP.

btwanky

there website...... said over 600

gs400tx

I dont think he was doubting the possibility of the results - just that someone felt they had to validate the supremacy of the ISF bc of an AVAILABLE TT option.

SilverBull

The same reason you won't see a forced induction IS350 is the reason there won't be that many IS-F's. The high compression ratio means massive work to be done to the engine for tuning. That car is far from a cheap tune. The reason the 335 is popular is due to the ease of upgrading. I have driven both and had the oppurtunity for the IS-F. I made my decision since I wanted more sport and less luxury and reliability.

I don't know any other tune that upgrades your car to 400hp and and 429 lb*ft of torque but still keeps the warranty. Say what you will but that mod rules based off of that.

nuttybar08

A well-reasoned post for the most part. I'm the one who used the word "overheat". My bad...poor thermal management is the actual fundamental issue and it will make itself known in good time. One other comment deserves a counter:

"AND yes a unmodded 5liter V8 in a 3800lb car will outperform an unmodded 3.0 liter 6cylinder in a 3500lb car - no real rocket-science there...there, now that's been acknowledged, let it go "

...what really needs to go are the trolls (not you) who insist on comparing modded to stock cars. A sad fact: M3post is littered with threads either started or enflamed by e90post trolls who apparently feel that an M3 owner has to justify his entire existence simply because he wasn't "savvy" enough (in their mind) to buy a 335i and mod it. And when eating their own isn't satisfying enough they come over here to talk smack? Ummm, no. Again, we're not the ones who need to "let it go", especially since this is an IS-F forum. If I trolled M3post in such a manner I would fully expect the ban hammer.

I'm not a hater...I've cruised BMW boards for quite a while because I was considering the 335i, then 135i, then M3 before finally going over to Lexus. It was close with the M but I opted for an easier daily driver over the track car and I'm very happy with it. I'm also expecting longer service life from the Lexus with fewer problems, but I realize that isn't a priority for everyone.

Other notes...the IS-F's warranty on big money parts is longer than BMW's, and IMHO BMW's "free" maintenance is designed to get a car through the warranty period and nothing more. As the owner of a turbo car myself, I would never submit to that minimal schedule. BMW may still hold a handling advantage but the unavoidable fact is the 335i and 135i (and IS-F, M3, C63, S5, G37 etc etc etc) are heavy cars...you can feel every bit of that weight when cornering. As a matter of fact the 328i is arguably better balanced in the twisties but with ***** length now defined by 0-60 and 1/4 mile times it is described solely...and inaccurately...as "the slow one".

We do agree on this...the CTS-V will be an absolute beast. I have a GTO-driving buddy at work that I'm trying to convince to trade up.

SilverBull

I do want to agree with some issues here. The fuel pumps do suck and the early model 335's overheat. There is no doubt the Lexus is a more reliable car. I had one before and depending on what mood I am in for my next car I may get one again. My general feeling is 15 pounds is pushing it on these cars and the engine will start to fade with overboost. Hence why I took the conservative route. My beef with the IS-f was more about the auto transmission and the docile feel under 3k rpms. If it wasn't in sport/manual mode than it was very quiet also. I love the interiors of the ISX cars. My IS350 was much more comfortable for long trips and such. They have ventilated seats(not in ISF) and backup cameras. I miss both of those now. Anyway, I am sorry some of the Bimmer owners are such morons around here. It simply keeps up the stereotype that I saw before I bought one of these cars.

smokyis350

iTrader: (21)

Thats what I was thinking. Lexus make their cars too restrictive. The most HP you can squeeze out from a is350 is probably 330 WHP with boost. Not sure how it is on the IS-F.

I have to admit. BMW 335i/135i has the best bang for the best buck. The only reason why alot of cars are failing right now is because of the 335i. Even the new m3 sales are affected because of the 335. They have so much sitting in the dealership right now with no mark ups and discount. Even the IS-F is failing. I was talking to one of the SA at my local Lexus dealership and they told me they only sold about 10 IS-F.

gs400tx

Well, the jurys still out on the longevity of modded (or unmodded N54s which are now being used in all kinds of BMW products). You can say I told you so when they begin to blow like some thermonuclear device - until then we have to assume that BMW did the appropriate development to make them durable/survive - they are the experts and we have to conclude that experience provides them the ability to make durable drivetrains.

Yes, some owners do need a little ego stroking to reassure themselves that the 335 was the obvious choice over a M3. But, they have other insecurities than just the obvious ones.
If for some reason the extended service does not cover the visits for repair, I have no qualms about spending 1.95$ for a forsale sign and bidding fairwell to the BMW 335.

PS, mine was an MY07 335 built in Aug - pretty early I would say, and again, its never had an overheat condition (or even close) - even before the Oil cooler was installed.

Take care

suislide

shoulda gotten a GT-R

CDNROCKIES

I'll start with an apology to the moderators.

That out of the way, who are these BMW loving idiots who think the 335 is the end all and be all of the sports sedan? If I had wanted a piece of crap that spent more time in the shop than on the road, with service techs that think they are doing you a favor by working on your car at outrageous prices, I would have picked a 335. They are not even in the same universe as far as luxury (iDrive...are you kidding me?) and all around quality. (My family has owned 3 BMW's so I am first hand familiar with their garbage).

If you want to talk stock against stock our IS F's will smoke you're ****ty 335. How is the 335 even in this conversation? I'm guessing that most IS F owners would have been shopping M3's, C63 AMG's or CTS-V's in the same segment. The M3 is a different conversation, and at least one worth having, as opposed to the 335.

What a joke this 335i Beast is!