Controversial MHP thread on another forum
02-09-09, 10:38 PM
#1
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Controversial MHP thread on another forum
Theyre has been some issues with MHP on mbworld.com and before any of you go and buy theyre software take a look at this thread. BTW Andy was banned of mbworld.com
http://www.mbworld.org/forums/c63-am...ml#post3339768
http://www.mbworld.org/forums/c63-am...ml#post3339768
02-10-09, 02:34 AM
#7
Ya, I was waiting for the day, I saw one of these links.
Guess I'll just stick with
And after reading that thread.
I think the issues was with the TCU tune, in which that guy stated, "
."
Guess I'll just stick with
And after reading that thread.
I think the issues was with the TCU tune, in which that guy stated, "
Andy is STEALING from all of you. He cannot tune the TCU!! Plain and simple. I said that I do work for many companies. I do not promote anyone for Merc. tuning. Do I tune myself, yes I do, my race car, which is a Ford that makes more RWHP at 3500 than a whole line of C63's all strapped to one dyno. If you guys would open your eyes and really learn in in's and out's you would see the writing on the wall that you are getting robbed. But it is your hard earned cash that you throw away for TCU tuning that never finds it's way form your ECU to the TCU inside the transmission. Yes there are a few things in the ECU that is shift related, but if Mr Andy is really tuning the TCU, lets see him change the shift points by a lot (not 100-300 RPM), or lets see him change the torque conv. lockup. Let have the conv. lock in all gears at 100% at full throttle. He can't do that, that can only be done via a TCU flash, not a "MHP TCU flash"
Last edited by t0e; 02-10-09 at 03:11 AM.
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02-10-09, 02:53 AM
#8
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"MHP compared the LET tune for the C32 the "Holiday Inn" and their tune the "Four Seasons" Needless to say LET Motorsports did not take to that comment well at all. "
ECU tuning has always been shady!
Last edited by valgs350; 02-10-09 at 02:58 AM.
02-10-09, 07:14 AM
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Wow this is one post from the person who is CALLING Andy out, appears that he is contesting the whole ECU/TCU and will provide evidence contrary to what Andy has been saying/selling. Here is the original post:
Tim Milliken
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 6
What does Andy @ MPH really know or do?
Andy,
You can fool some of the people all of the time, you can also fool all of the people some of the time, but you cannot fool all of the people all of the time.
You have dragged my name and information through the mud enough; it has come time to call you out. This will be my only post, so there is no need to reply with anything to attempt to save face, I will not respond.
I have probably been reverse engineering automotive pcms longer than you knew what they are. I am not new to this at all. You have regurgitated information that you have gotten from Dave Kasper, and Dave Kasper has got from me during a phone conversation about providing Dave with a flash device, so that his customers would not be required to send their pcm in. I had told Dave about reflash protection that ONLY Bosch can generate. Dave told you , you told a potential customer and that customer repeated back to me. Some of the details were wrong as a result of going through three people before it got back to me but the fundamental story was the same. Dave Kasper boasts having the ability to generate the necessary key to pass the protection method. If this were true, he would have a capability not intrusted to Mercedes, AMG or GM. Yes, GM is using the ME97 ecu as well. Bosch supplies development ecus to the manufactures for calibration development but the final files that are distributed to dealers are all protected and ONLY Bosch can provide the protection key. Dave is not generating these keys. If he were, there would be no need for customers to send him ecus. It is literally that simple.
Now my friend has dynode his car stock today and a car with an ecu tuned by you. The difference was 31 RWHP. What happened to the 80+ RWHP you have promised?? The 407 RWHP he got from your “Stage III” tune is exactly what a stock E63 gets so I suspect Dave has simply placed an E63 or similar file on the C63 as they have the throttle fully opened where the C63 is throttle limited. I think the rest of the world needs to know that there is a lot more in the ecu than just opening the throttle and real tuners use this to generate more power.
You and Dave are now on notice; we will get some of your flashed ecu’s. We will read them in an attempt to prove our theory that your customers are buying nothing more than a stock Mercedes file. Either way, we will post the results. Now as to what you might say about copyrighted information. Calibration data is not copyrightable, If you think it is, sue me and see who wins. I have already been down this road a few times, and I know the directions quite well.
As an alternative, customers need only log OBDii data from their cars and compare mixture, timing and throttle angle between a stock C63, stock E or S63 and your product. If the only difference is throttle opening then they will know that no real effort was put into the “tune”. Yes, they even have the popcorn icon rollingopcorn:
Now for the TCU being inside the ECU. That is entirely false and an outright LIE. You will notice in the attached pictures that even the factory Mercedes repair information shows the TCU inside the transmission, just as I have told my friend. You told him that I was basically a fool. Who is the real fool?? There are some shift timers and desired shift times in the ECU, but this is relayed via the CAN bus. So unless the customer is shipping the entire transmission to you, how are you giving them a TCU reflash?? Sounds to me like you owe some refunds to your customers. You might want to refer to the documentation before letting the bile spill from your mouth. I have seen many like you before, you get a little bit of information, and you spread it and attempt to make yourself appear as “The Man”. I have news for you, I have ran across your type many times before, and I am still in business long after they have went bankrupt.
Tim Milliken
Newbie
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 6
What does Andy @ MPH really know or do?
Andy,
You can fool some of the people all of the time, you can also fool all of the people some of the time, but you cannot fool all of the people all of the time.
You have dragged my name and information through the mud enough; it has come time to call you out. This will be my only post, so there is no need to reply with anything to attempt to save face, I will not respond.
I have probably been reverse engineering automotive pcms longer than you knew what they are. I am not new to this at all. You have regurgitated information that you have gotten from Dave Kasper, and Dave Kasper has got from me during a phone conversation about providing Dave with a flash device, so that his customers would not be required to send their pcm in. I had told Dave about reflash protection that ONLY Bosch can generate. Dave told you , you told a potential customer and that customer repeated back to me. Some of the details were wrong as a result of going through three people before it got back to me but the fundamental story was the same. Dave Kasper boasts having the ability to generate the necessary key to pass the protection method. If this were true, he would have a capability not intrusted to Mercedes, AMG or GM. Yes, GM is using the ME97 ecu as well. Bosch supplies development ecus to the manufactures for calibration development but the final files that are distributed to dealers are all protected and ONLY Bosch can provide the protection key. Dave is not generating these keys. If he were, there would be no need for customers to send him ecus. It is literally that simple.
Now my friend has dynode his car stock today and a car with an ecu tuned by you. The difference was 31 RWHP. What happened to the 80+ RWHP you have promised?? The 407 RWHP he got from your “Stage III” tune is exactly what a stock E63 gets so I suspect Dave has simply placed an E63 or similar file on the C63 as they have the throttle fully opened where the C63 is throttle limited. I think the rest of the world needs to know that there is a lot more in the ecu than just opening the throttle and real tuners use this to generate more power.
You and Dave are now on notice; we will get some of your flashed ecu’s. We will read them in an attempt to prove our theory that your customers are buying nothing more than a stock Mercedes file. Either way, we will post the results. Now as to what you might say about copyrighted information. Calibration data is not copyrightable, If you think it is, sue me and see who wins. I have already been down this road a few times, and I know the directions quite well.
As an alternative, customers need only log OBDii data from their cars and compare mixture, timing and throttle angle between a stock C63, stock E or S63 and your product. If the only difference is throttle opening then they will know that no real effort was put into the “tune”. Yes, they even have the popcorn icon rolling
opcorn:Now for the TCU being inside the ECU. That is entirely false and an outright LIE. You will notice in the attached pictures that even the factory Mercedes repair information shows the TCU inside the transmission, just as I have told my friend. You told him that I was basically a fool. Who is the real fool?? There are some shift timers and desired shift times in the ECU, but this is relayed via the CAN bus. So unless the customer is shipping the entire transmission to you, how are you giving them a TCU reflash?? Sounds to me like you owe some refunds to your customers. You might want to refer to the documentation before letting the bile spill from your mouth. I have seen many like you before, you get a little bit of information, and you spread it and attempt to make yourself appear as “The Man”. I have news for you, I have ran across your type many times before, and I am still in business long after they have went bankrupt.
02-10-09, 08:01 AM
#11
Did you guys read the whole thread? I did, and most MBWorld members are supporting Andy's ECU tune, and according to them the numbers are not only great but are the highest ones (compared to other tuners, and that's why Andy got banned on the forum, for comparing his business with the competitors). On the TCU side the story is different, and basically the complain is that the unit is inside the tranny and can't be fully tuned from the ECU (only partially). There is one post though that points to Andy's promises in terms of TCU tune, and after reading the whole thread it looks to me like he promised only what can be partially tuned through the ECU (without saying it's a partial tune though).
I feel the same way as some MBWorld member, this Tim is posting a direct attack against Andy for something personal, just because "a friend told him that Andy talked trash about him". As those members said, Andy's cell phone number is posted everywhere, why didn't he call Andy directly and settle this down privately? BTW, Tim created the account just so he could start the thread, how ethical is that? Also you can see how Tim shifts his point, on the first post he basically bashes the ECU tune and after many members show proof of the great results he moves to the TCU and never mentions the ECU tune again.
I can speak for myself, my experience dealing with Andy has been great, he's been honest and helpful, and he's provided lots of information for all of us. The numbers speak for themselves, his tune showed around 20WHP of improvement on my car, isn't that what we all wanted? If the TCU tune is something that doesn't interest you, the ECU tune alone is still an option.
I feel the same way as some MBWorld member, this Tim is posting a direct attack against Andy for something personal, just because "a friend told him that Andy talked trash about him". As those members said, Andy's cell phone number is posted everywhere, why didn't he call Andy directly and settle this down privately? BTW, Tim created the account just so he could start the thread, how ethical is that? Also you can see how Tim shifts his point, on the first post he basically bashes the ECU tune and after many members show proof of the great results he moves to the TCU and never mentions the ECU tune again.
I can speak for myself, my experience dealing with Andy has been great, he's been honest and helpful, and he's provided lots of information for all of us. The numbers speak for themselves, his tune showed around 20WHP of improvement on my car, isn't that what we all wanted? If the TCU tune is something that doesn't interest you, the ECU tune alone is still an option.
Last edited by Juanca; 02-10-09 at 08:05 AM.
02-10-09, 08:32 AM
#13
I'm still not convinced about the 20+whp gain of the ECU tune but would like to be proven otherwise with some more independent dynos.
Juanca, have you compared your baseline dyno to mine, peters and others? Between 5250 and 6000 rpm, all the IS-Fs gain about 25-30 hp but yours stayed flat on your baseline. Speaking with some other enthusiasts and from what you have posted, your car was probably pulling timing or something on your baseline and now with the ECU tune dyno it "appears" as if there could be 20-25hp gain in the higher rpms since the car was probably not pulling timing. Remember you even stated that you had to drive hard to get to the shop for your baseline pull and did not have a chance to let the car cool down.
So in a nutshell there could be a chance that your baseline was not a very good one. Your ECU tune dyno runs were pretty good, but nothing extraordinary. With the car not pulling timing combined with the MHP tune your car showed the large gains in the top end only which is exactly where timing would have been pulled on WOT for your baseline. No doubt your car is now running strong and you probably did pick up a few hp, but the 20-25 probably isn't realistic until we have more independent tests.
And to the OP I have to agree with Juanca that the thread on the MB forum is very personal in nature and is moot for the Lexus thus far. Lets see what MHP can do before we jump to conclusions with more testing.
Juanca, have you compared your baseline dyno to mine, peters and others? Between 5250 and 6000 rpm, all the IS-Fs gain about 25-30 hp but yours stayed flat on your baseline. Speaking with some other enthusiasts and from what you have posted, your car was probably pulling timing or something on your baseline and now with the ECU tune dyno it "appears" as if there could be 20-25hp gain in the higher rpms since the car was probably not pulling timing. Remember you even stated that you had to drive hard to get to the shop for your baseline pull and did not have a chance to let the car cool down.
So in a nutshell there could be a chance that your baseline was not a very good one. Your ECU tune dyno runs were pretty good, but nothing extraordinary. With the car not pulling timing combined with the MHP tune your car showed the large gains in the top end only which is exactly where timing would have been pulled on WOT for your baseline. No doubt your car is now running strong and you probably did pick up a few hp, but the 20-25 probably isn't realistic until we have more independent tests.
And to the OP I have to agree with Juanca that the thread on the MB forum is very personal in nature and is moot for the Lexus thus far. Lets see what MHP can do before we jump to conclusions with more testing.
02-10-09, 10:01 AM
#15
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Simple, theyre is some shady stuff going on. If you have not had any problems and believe him than good for you. But for the rest of this makes people think twice about forking over 2k for a ecu tune and a tcu tune without actualy getting the tcu tune done. I do not think the title is misleading I believe its apropriate for this situation.