Now thats what im talking about. IS-F vs CTS-V.
03-02-09, 12:45 PM
#17
Lexus Connoisseur
The CTS-V is a whole different monster. The F and the CTS are definitely in different categories...they really can't be compared together.
03-02-09, 12:51 PM
#18
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03-02-09, 07:18 PM
#19
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yes the 09' CTS-V is really in the M5 and Merc AMG E class. Almost 500 lbs. heavier than our Fs but with 556 H.P. and 551 torque a real monster and not to be taken lightly!! Actuallly had a black 09' pull up along side me yesterday at traffic light. Was kind of cool, we both gave each other a momentary glance of recognition then he turned left and I went straight. Not much of a first encounter but I must say the car looked mean and I will be looking for him in the future!!
03-02-09, 07:38 PM
#20
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2009 cts-v
Yep the new 2009 CTS-V is literally in a different class than the IS-F . I drove both and the caddy is simply amazing , starting from the interior all the way to the new LS9 supercharged motor ! If I had to sell my 07 Z06 vette , I would definitely buy the caddy; incidently I also drove the new C63 merc and feel the cadillac is top dog here as well , proving the yanks can build top notch vehicles .
B D HEMI
B D HEMI
03-02-09, 10:04 PM
#21
both will cost the same retail give or take 3-5k (55k vs. 58k) (not 85k like the m5)
both are after that 4 door sports market.
both their little brothers compete in their same classes.
isf-f / 350 as cts-v is to cts which is in the same market and price as the 350.
I def. put them in the same class in everything other than the fact the new cts-v will run circles around the isf. oh and it also even spanks cars that are 25k more.... like the m5.
gm is on top of the performance figures by leaps and bounds with the ls3,7 and 9. What cracks me up even more is its still pushrod technology. I don't care how they get it done, they are doing it and doing it well. Hell the vette/ctsv even getter better mpg than most cars in classes way below.
03-02-09, 10:10 PM
#22
Tech Info Resource
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And sadly the high performance division where the CTS-V was born and developed is no more. Get it now, there won't be many, and there won't be more. Same with the ACR Viper. If you ever wanted a new one, you'd better pony up now because a year from now they won't exist. Both are awesome cars. I just couldn't buy a GM knowing the condition they're in financially and knowing if I have problems in a few years I'll likely be very much on my own to solve them. Not so Lexus.
AFA fuel mileage - yeah, GM seems to be the real mileage king even with the big power engines. No sports car gets Corvette mileage, and Corvettes kill the F for fuel economy. Gotta love having your cake and eating it too. FWIW, my F is giving me right at 20 mpg on a commute that averages 40 mph over 19 miles. Not bad (definitely better than the Benz), but not GM good either.
AFA fuel mileage - yeah, GM seems to be the real mileage king even with the big power engines. No sports car gets Corvette mileage, and Corvettes kill the F for fuel economy. Gotta love having your cake and eating it too. FWIW, my F is giving me right at 20 mpg on a commute that averages 40 mph over 19 miles. Not bad (definitely better than the Benz), but not GM good either.
03-02-09, 10:57 PM
#23
Lexus Test Driver
both are 4 doors.
both will cost the same retail give or take 3-5k (55k vs. 58k) (not 85k like the m5)
both are after that 4 door sports market.
both their little brothers compete in their same classes.
isf-f / 350 as cts-v is to cts which is in the same market and price as the 350.
I def. put them in the same class in everything other than the fact the new cts-v will run circles around the isf. oh and it also even spanks cars that are 25k more.... like the m5.
gm is on top of the performance figures by leaps and bounds with the ls3,7 and 9. What cracks me up even more is its still pushrod technology. I don't care how they get it done, they are doing it and doing it well. Hell the vette/ctsv even getter better mpg than most cars in classes way below.
both will cost the same retail give or take 3-5k (55k vs. 58k) (not 85k like the m5)
both are after that 4 door sports market.
both their little brothers compete in their same classes.
isf-f / 350 as cts-v is to cts which is in the same market and price as the 350.
I def. put them in the same class in everything other than the fact the new cts-v will run circles around the isf. oh and it also even spanks cars that are 25k more.... like the m5.
gm is on top of the performance figures by leaps and bounds with the ls3,7 and 9. What cracks me up even more is its still pushrod technology. I don't care how they get it done, they are doing it and doing it well. Hell the vette/ctsv even getter better mpg than most cars in classes way below.
New IS-F's can be had for 45k out the door, CTS-V's can't even come close and by GM's own admission (see below), the new CTS-V was built exclusively to challenge the M5 because they are both in the same class (not the C63 or M3) as in 500+hp four door sub 8 minute nurburgring uber sedans that are tanks, and GM knew they had to be better than the likes of the IS-F and RS4.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QCgQljQ7W44
03-03-09, 06:41 AM
#24
The IS F and CTS-V may start around the same price, but Cadillac asks dearly for options like leather and sunroof. By the time you're done configuring it to compete in all categores (let's not forget these are luxury vehicles) it approaches discounted M5 territory.
That said, I like it.
That said, I like it.
03-03-09, 01:17 PM
#25
Lexus Connoisseur
both are 4 doors.
both will cost the same retail give or take 3-5k (55k vs. 58k) (not 85k like the m5)
both are after that 4 door sports market.
both their little brothers compete in their same classes.
isf-f / 350 as cts-v is to cts which is in the same market and price as the 350.
I def. put them in the same class in everything other than the fact the new cts-v will run circles around the isf. oh and it also even spanks cars that are 25k more.... like the m5.
both will cost the same retail give or take 3-5k (55k vs. 58k) (not 85k like the m5)
both are after that 4 door sports market.
both their little brothers compete in their same classes.
isf-f / 350 as cts-v is to cts which is in the same market and price as the 350.
I def. put them in the same class in everything other than the fact the new cts-v will run circles around the isf. oh and it also even spanks cars that are 25k more.... like the m5.
gm is on top of the performance figures by leaps and bounds with the ls3,7 and 9. What cracks me up even more is its still pushrod technology. I don't care how they get it done, they are doing it and doing it well. Hell the vette/ctsv even getter better mpg than most cars in classes way below.
Last edited by flipside909; 03-03-09 at 01:27 PM.
03-03-09, 01:39 PM
#26
Lexus Test Driver
There are a rew things the CTS-V is at a disadvantage currently. 1) A future considering the market conditions for GM as of present. 2) Reliability...and it's a given the Lexus runs circles around GM's reliability. 3) Given we have $85k to spend on a performance sedan, most of us are going to opt for the M5 hands down. I know I would.
Sure they maybe yielding those great numbers, but if it's so great, why are so many sitting in front of GM dealerships on the verge of closing? Lets face it, no one is buying these cars to save gas, plus you arent going to get 24+MPG when you're trying to get the fastest lap on the track. Don't get me wrong, I love the ZR1 and CTS-V, but in the overall picture, GM is ftl at this point.
Sure they maybe yielding those great numbers, but if it's so great, why are so many sitting in front of GM dealerships on the verge of closing? Lets face it, no one is buying these cars to save gas, plus you arent going to get 24+MPG when you're trying to get the fastest lap on the track. Don't get me wrong, I love the ZR1 and CTS-V, but in the overall picture, GM is ftl at this point.
+1
GM= Fail
03-03-09, 02:20 PM
#27
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Yup, if the F ran a new CTS-V than the results would be much different...
People should never compare a price of the car based on MSRP. That's what the manufacturers want the consumer to do, but it's almost certain that it's not reflective of the actual asking price after options and features. The F is a prime example. Even though its base MSRP is very close to M3/C63, after similar options the M3/C63 is usually 5-10k more in price.
With that said, it looks like the CTS-V is priced like the M3/C63, but its size is a lot larger (8 in. longer than the IS) and nearly identical to the M5/E63. So you could compare it to cars from either class, depending on whether you classify by size or price. IMO both are valid.
My preference is to lean towards compact, nimble, and sporty, so the size is a difference maker to me. As such, I would not consider the CTS-V, just like I wouldn't consider an M5 or an E63, regardless of how fast it is on the track or how much power it makes.
Lastly, the Caddy styling just doesn't appeal to me at all. Again it's pure preference, but it just looks... old. And it doesn't help that I never see anyone under 75 driving it.
People should never compare a price of the car based on MSRP. That's what the manufacturers want the consumer to do, but it's almost certain that it's not reflective of the actual asking price after options and features. The F is a prime example. Even though its base MSRP is very close to M3/C63, after similar options the M3/C63 is usually 5-10k more in price.
With that said, it looks like the CTS-V is priced like the M3/C63, but its size is a lot larger (8 in. longer than the IS) and nearly identical to the M5/E63. So you could compare it to cars from either class, depending on whether you classify by size or price. IMO both are valid.
My preference is to lean towards compact, nimble, and sporty, so the size is a difference maker to me. As such, I would not consider the CTS-V, just like I wouldn't consider an M5 or an E63, regardless of how fast it is on the track or how much power it makes.
Lastly, the Caddy styling just doesn't appeal to me at all. Again it's pure preference, but it just looks... old. And it doesn't help that I never see anyone under 75 driving it.
03-03-09, 04:12 PM
#28
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Wow i hate to burst any bubbles but i went to see the NEW cts-v the other day and i could have walked out the door with the keys for a decent amount less than i got my f. Take in mind that i have a nieman Marcus...
P.s. the isf in this vid needed an oil change lol
P.s. the isf in this vid needed an oil change lol
03-03-09, 04:54 PM
#29
Lexus Test Driver
People should never compare a price of the car based on MSRP. That's what the manufacturers want the consumer to do, but it's almost certain that it's not reflective of the actual asking price after options and features. The F is a prime example. Even though its base MSRP is very close to M3/C63, after similar options the M3/C63 is usually 5-10k more in price.
Read above...........this issue has been discussed ad nauseam
03-04-09, 09:26 AM
#30
Lexus Test Driver
