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Those are not the same Magnaflow hi-flow cats that RR Racing sells. I just received mine the other week and the catalyst is spun metal rather than the typical ceramic in your average catalytic converter.
^^^^The MPN is 99675 and does have a Metallic substrate.
Not trying to start an argument, but posted just outlining my experiences with the product and with Magnaflow customer service. Also as a precaution to anyone contemplating the purchase of Magnaflow products.
Not trying to start an argument, but posted just outlining my experiences with the product and with Magnaflow customer service. Also as a precaution to anyone contemplating the purchase of Magnaflow products.
Lou
Yeah you are correct. I did read it but it was awhile ago. I just looked at the photo and assumes it was ceramic. The substrate looks different from what I got from RR but I can't really tell if that's because it melted. I agree though about Magnaflows quality going down over the years. I see issues with their products pop up every now and then in other car forums.
I'll take a look at the part number I got and post it when I get the chance. I haven't installed it yet but I'll report from time to time to keep everyone updated on it's longevity. Mainly got it to reduce the exhaust smell.
@ChpEng At these prices you are better off with a set of headers..
But if thats not your direction of choice, if your passenger is cracked like mine was, a quick tig weld job will fix that right up.
Or you can phone Tommy @ MusicBox to see if he has any OEM repaired ones ready for a swap job.. The labor, time & effort is what makes this job a piggy bank killer.
To properly repair the one on your car is more time consuming and way more down time. Your OEM CATs are fine, just hairline crack at manifold pipe flange, which will never throw a CEL or cause a FAILED SMOG.
SMOG recently had some CA LAW Changes.. (some 2012) 2013+ still don't need SMOG. I think its now full 8 years from original sale date if original owner.
Also, the OBDII plug in smog tests are now for 2000 MY and newer cars. 1999 and older will still need the sniffer tests.. (and maybe rollers)
Joe Z
Is the TIG weld repair typically to join the #8 cylinder tube to the "floating" RH flange? Is this what Tommy does with his used OEM collection? From the photos posted on several threads here, this seems to be a classic fatigue failure mode. I am no expert, but concerned about the weld repair simply moving the stress concentration down the tube a bit, eventually leading to another failure adjacent to the weld.
Did both your RH and LH sides fail at their flanges? Were you able to find out if the LH and RH replacement parts had the same design as the originals?
I would like to keep the car CARB-compliant, but if the replacement OEM parts are susceptible to the same failure in the future, then at some point the math for getting the car refereed in might start making sense for someone planning to keep the car for a while.
This is probably humorous to long-time owners, but my naive, grotesquely optimistic new-owner cost accounting goes something like this:
+ PPE or Sikky EL Headers
+ custom catted header-back exhaust
- credit from recycling OEM cats
- hypothetical credit from not ever experiencing OEM weld/tube failure again
- intangible credit from performance and acoustic benefits
+ fees, aggravation, and time of CARB refereeing (never done this myself, but friends have)
> or < replacing OEM headers ???
The flange isn't fully floating. One tube is welded, the other floats. The flanges work in pairs, so the one that usually breaks is the welded one. Rewelding it basically returns it to its original condition. I also have a theory the break is a result of the engine mount going bad and allowing too much stress on the header when the engine flexes under acceleration, but there's not enough evidence to make this theory anything more than a guess.
Last edited by lobuxracer; 07-21-20 at 01:16 AM.
Reason: Accident
The flange isn't fully floating. One tube is welded, the other floats. The flanges work in pairs, so the one that usually breaks is the welded one. Rewelding it basically returns it to its original condition. I also have a theory the break is a result of the engine mount going bad and allowing too much stress on the header when the engine flexes under acceleration, but there's not enough evidence to make this theory anything more than a guess.
The OEM engine mounts suck, so your theory is educated.
Just had my UEL installed. At 135k miles my engine mounts were fine, unless I'm totally missing the damage. The passenger side flange was indeed broken though, swings/rotates around the opening (was having that cold start tapping) Replaced starter too and man a new starter makes such a difference, and finally - I really don't know why I waited 10 years to install headers. Along with some maintenance stuff, car feels like a new car. I am finding that I am getting too old for the gas smell. I will be installing cats if we ever find ourselves in the area again.
Just had my UEL installed. At 135k miles my engine mounts were fine, unless I'm totally missing the damage. The passenger side flange was indeed broken though, swings/rotates around the opening (was having that cold start tapping) Replaced starter too and man a new starter makes such a difference, and finally - I really don't know why I waited 10 years to install headers. Along with some maintenance stuff, car feels like a new car. I am finding that I am getting too old for the gas smell. I will be installing cats if we ever find ourselves in the area again.
It's usually the driver's side mount, and the easy check is to try to rotate it with the bottom unbolted and no vertical load. If it rotates at all and doesn't instantly rebound to the original position, it's junk. Mine spun freely. I know it's junk.
Thanks Lance, and another thank you for the heads up on the plastic connector and the black plastic cover for the starter install. The gray connector did just crack and fall apart.
The flange isn't fully floating. One tube is welded, the other floats. The flanges work in pairs, so the one that usually breaks is the welded one. Rewelding it basically returns it to its original condition. I also have a theory the break is a result of the engine mount going bad and allowing too much stress on the header when the engine flexes under acceleration, but there's not enough evidence to make this theory anything more than a guess.
Thank you Lance, very helpful for my understanding how to proceed here. Next step = confirm diagnosis @ dealer.
Thank you Lance, very helpful for my understanding how to proceed here. Next step = confirm diagnosis @ dealer.
Unless they know some secret I would avoid the dealership & diagnosis fee @ChpEng
They will not find or see any crack unless removed like the 99% of us.. If you are up to the task you can remove the manifold shield and look for your answer for free.. Black soot on the inside of shield. Exactly where the last rear port is that leaks.
Use the money towards a set of headers or the repaired manifold swap process.
Unless they know some secret I would avoid the dealership & diagnosis fee @ChpEng
They will not find or see any crack unless removed like the 99% of us.. If you are up to the task you can remove the manifold shield and look for your answer for free.. Black soot on the inside of shield. Exactly where the last rear port is that leaks.
Use the money towards a set of headers or the repaired manifold swap process.
Joe Z
So...cold, hard reality has hit...I have neither the time nor the patience for the CARB referee route. I was hoping to obtain at least partial Lexus reimbursement for replacement part(s) since it is emissions-related and specifically mentioned in the warranty description...even though the car is outside the 8yr/80k mi window. To do that, I was under impression that a dealer would need to confirm diagnosis. I thought they might be able do this via borescope. Was Longo able to diagnose both your headers back in the day, or did you have to remove them to prove the failure and get reimbursed under extended warranty? It seems borescopes under the heat shields have proven ineffective?
I was planning to call Lexus corporate tomorrow and at least start the discussion. I appreciate your advice. I am probably naive here but hopefully will learn quickly.
Unless they know some secret I would avoid the dealership & diagnosis fee @ChpEng
They will not find or see any crack unless removed like the 99% of us.. If you are up to the task you can remove the manifold shield and look for your answer for free.. Black soot on the inside of shield. Exactly where the last rear port is that leaks.
I requested an inspection during my appointment at Longo Lexus this weekend for other service. They confirmed both RH and LH headers are cracked, and recommend replacement.
The adventure continues... Building my parts list now...
I requested an inspection during my appointment at Longo Lexus this weekend for other service. They confirmed both RH and LH headers are cracked, and recommend replacement.
The adventure continues... Building my parts list now...
If they gave you a quote I'm sure it was upwards of $5k with OEM parts & labor ??
I'm just spit balling, I didn't look up the MSRP on the parts and labor rates..
And no, Lexus has not released any redesign or change the part numbers on the OEM manifolds..
I understand your intention, but I only had mine replaced with OEM parts because my extended warranty covered them fully... Personally I would not pay out of pocket to replace same parts that will fail again in time.
If they gave you a quote I'm sure it was upwards of $5k with OEM parts & labor ??
I'm just spit balling, I didn't look up the MSRP on the parts and labor rates..
And no, Lexus has not released any redesign or change the part numbers on the OEM manifolds..
I understand your intention, but I only had mine replaced with OEM parts because my extended warranty covered them fully... Personally I would not pay out of pocket to replace same parts that will fail again in time.
That is an accurate estimate.
I was quoted $4k parts and $3k labor (17hrs @ $175/hr). An eye-watering sum.
There are at least four caveats.
In order of decreasing certainty:
1) Parts cost quoted is list, not online/wholesale. (High-certainty -$1k.)
2) Old catalytic converters can be sold for scrap. (High-certainty -$TBD)
3) Dealers are exceedingly careful to under-promise and over-deliver. The 17hrs for labor is a spec value, and may be conservative by ~30%. (Potential up to -$1k)
4) Remote possibility of Lexus goodwill reimbursement for what has been manifested to be a common failure. (Remotely possible -$TBD)
The logic of replacing with OEM parts rests entirely on an assessment of root cause of the failure. I tend to think Lobuxracer is onto something in suggesting the motor mounts may been the root cause. Would the replacement headers last longer if motor mounts were replaced every ~5yrs? Only one way to find out...
Overall, a sobering decision. I bought a higher-mileage example with eyes wide open, allocating ~$10k for maintenance/upgrade items in the first few years of ownership. I did not expect to get in so deep so soon, but knew it was a possibility. And now here we are. And the world has changed a bit in the past few months...
PS. Loaner car was a ~$35k cute-ute with profoundly terrifying driving dynamics, bizarre ergonomics, intrusive "driver aids", over-styled HVAC controls, robo-brakes and robo-throttle, LFA-wannabe IP paired with a mighty rubber-band CVT, and uncomfortable seats. The blasted thing fought me and yelped in alarm when I steered to the edge of my lane to avoid debris on the freeway. It was unstable in at least four axes. I am thankful for the ride home, but that experience pretty much validates the strategy of buying well-engineered used cars and keeping them as long as possible.
Last edited by ChpEng; 07-26-20 at 11:52 PM.
Reason: added postscript
07-18-20, 02:59 PM
