High Altitude + Tune = Think again (bye KCLV)
05-30-16, 05:40 PM
#46
Update:
Liquidtek pulled the KCLV values of a local member here with a stock tune (like me) and his numbers were also low they were 11.5/13 IIRC............
So what does that say about KCLV numbers when they are low with a stock tune?!?! My numbers were considerably higher when he pulled mine at 17.8/19.5.........
Opinions?
Liquidtek pulled the KCLV values of a local member here with a stock tune (like me) and his numbers were also low they were 11.5/13 IIRC............
So what does that say about KCLV numbers when they are low with a stock tune?!?! My numbers were considerably higher when he pulled mine at 17.8/19.5.........
Opinions?
05-30-16, 06:55 PM
#47
Pole Position
^^^^^^^^^Don't know but this is confusing to say the least?!................ So basically he put down the same KCLV values as the guys here with BOTH RR & TTFS tunes, the numbers are almost identical.
Like you said it's either we have some ****ty gas here or something's amiss and no one has come up with a solution to the tunes yet and now the low numbers with the stock tune?
So timing is being pulled just as much with the stock tune in this instance anyway as with the tuned cars here at altitude........
Like you said it's either we have some ****ty gas here or something's amiss and no one has come up with a solution to the tunes yet and now the low numbers with the stock tune?
So timing is being pulled just as much with the stock tune in this instance anyway as with the tuned cars here at altitude........
05-31-16, 07:33 AM
#49
Pole Position
I would assume richer AF ratio only if the ECU doesn't compensate for the lack of oxygen......
05-31-16, 08:10 AM
#51
Pole Position
I think we, in general, know very little about how the KCLV algorithm works. It's possible factors other than knock activity play into this. MAF, load, IAT, are likely candidates. Low air density = lower MAF readings which could be affecting KCLV values at altitude. Until we know exactly how it works all we can do is test empirically. Keep logging and sharing... I'm sure the tuners will figure this out.
06-18-16, 08:56 AM
#52
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I have been lurking in the shadows on the tune as I also suffer from altitude sickness here in Utah. I appreciate all the info the CO guys have brought forth in regards to the tune at higher elevations. From my experience of only having one car tuned here in UT elevation made a difference on how an off the shelve tune have to be changed. How it was done I cannot elaborate other then, speaking to the tuner, was a lot of math. I was fortunate enough to purchase an F with I/H/E already in place and I am happy with the car and sure like anyone I want more power but I have had to face the facts.....Higher altitude just plain sucks on an N/A car. Keep up the great work guys and I am sure you will find a sweet spot in your tune, if anything I would he happy with the rev limiter banging off 7200 opposed to 6800 
.
JC
.JC
06-18-16, 04:39 PM
#53
Pole Position
^^^^Thx, we're currently data logging for Rafi me and DCguy and a couple others here in the metro area and are sending Rafi logs within the last week or so. He has been really responsive to the logs we have been sending back and is working with the tuner to try and figure something out for us at altitude!
Like you said, and my experience before with my NSX was that it took a guy in Albuquerque to fly the tuner out to re-tune the off the shelf tune available for the NSX and tune for altitude and he ended up getting some decent gains, but only tuning in person. Mind you this was tuning a OBD I ECU, so no e-mailing back in forth with a portable device that we have now with the my genius handheld that has been shipping lately!
Lucky you! You got I/H/E already with the purchase, what headers were put on the car and exhaust? Have you dynoed yet to see your numbers?
Like you said, and my experience before with my NSX was that it took a guy in Albuquerque to fly the tuner out to re-tune the off the shelf tune available for the NSX and tune for altitude and he ended up getting some decent gains, but only tuning in person. Mind you this was tuning a OBD I ECU, so no e-mailing back in forth with a portable device that we have now with the my genius handheld that has been shipping lately!
Lucky you! You got I/H/E already with the purchase, what headers were put on the car and exhaust? Have you dynoed yet to see your numbers?
06-18-16, 08:05 PM
#54
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^^^^Thx, we're currently data logging for Rafi me and DCguy and a couple others here in the metro area and are sending Rafi logs within the last week or so. He has been really responsive to the logs we have been sending back and is working with the tuner to try and figure something out for us at altitude!
Like you said, and my experience before with my NSX was that it took a guy in Albuquerque to fly the tuner out to re-tune the off the shelf tune available for the NSX and tune for altitude and he ended up getting some decent gains, but only tuning in person. Mind you this was tuning a OBD I ECU, so no e-mailing back in forth with a portable device that we have now with the my genius handheld that has been shipping lately!
Lucky you! You got I/H/E already with the purchase, what headers were put on the car and exhaust? Have you dynoed yet to see your numbers?
Like you said, and my experience before with my NSX was that it took a guy in Albuquerque to fly the tuner out to re-tune the off the shelf tune available for the NSX and tune for altitude and he ended up getting some decent gains, but only tuning in person. Mind you this was tuning a OBD I ECU, so no e-mailing back in forth with a portable device that we have now with the my genius handheld that has been shipping lately!
Lucky you! You got I/H/E already with the purchase, what headers were put on the car and exhaust? Have you dynoed yet to see your numbers?
06-20-16, 05:46 PM
#55
Update for you all. MileHiFcar seems to keep you all well informed lol I don't clublexus much, A fellow club member here in CO has loaded up techstream on my laptop to use to monitor values. We've gathered 4 F's so far all with different mods (stock/tuned/mods etc) and have been data logging them to send to rafi to analyze. More F's in the mix log soon BTW. It's such a widespead crapshoot of different values from all. Not just KCLV but the degrees of ignition timing advance degrees at specific RPMs. I've been testing a few maps that rafi has sent me, slightly detuned ect. KCLV is a very strange animal we have picked a fight with. I received my stock map back to test out/datalog and have been gaining on timing up into the easy 16s within a few minutes and eventually up into 18s and have peaked at 19.9, but limp mode kicks in after about 2 hrs (no primaries). To say the least the tune map isn't doing so well kclv wise... feels good, throttle response etc, but the knock correction disagrees. Cant say it enough... Rafi is extremely eager to work with us, engaged, and has been very responsive to any on the fly questions. Will keep everyone updated on the progress that is being made (MileHiFcar, liquidtek, or me), Going to take some time and some frustration to crack this on both sides TTFS and RR... but hey, in the long run there will be a better understanding and knowledge of the F that I think we can all agree on.
06-20-16, 07:33 PM
#56
Thanks guys for all your work on this! I don't have a Windows laptop or the software, but can offer another F to log data on if needed.
Hoping Rafi can get this dialed in us.
Hoping Rafi can get this dialed in us.
07-01-16, 04:01 PM
#57
Update: Please note this is only after one day of testing and observing on techstream for a few hours... will check back in after a week or so.
Received a high altitude map from RR and to say the least if feels great, responsive and powerful. Car is more aggressive particularly in the high end. Definitely bringing in more air than stock tune. KCLV Values were up in the mid 18's on 91 octane plus some octane boost, 92-94 estimated.....
Refilled with 91 oct and the values dropped slightly but the aggressive top end seems to be here to stay. Ignition timing is far more advanced than the stock map (from what I am told that is what really matters over KCLV) Waiting for an additional map with some slight changes but looks like we are slowly reaching a solution to the high altitude dilemma. Looking forward to getting the RR tuned intake in the future to see if we can squeeze a little bit more air into the motor.
Received a high altitude map from RR and to say the least if feels great, responsive and powerful. Car is more aggressive particularly in the high end. Definitely bringing in more air than stock tune. KCLV Values were up in the mid 18's on 91 octane plus some octane boost, 92-94 estimated.....
Refilled with 91 oct and the values dropped slightly but the aggressive top end seems to be here to stay. Ignition timing is far more advanced than the stock map (from what I am told that is what really matters over KCLV) Waiting for an additional map with some slight changes but looks like we are slowly reaching a solution to the high altitude dilemma. Looking forward to getting the RR tuned intake in the future to see if we can squeeze a little bit more air into the motor.
07-01-16, 04:06 PM
#58
Pole Position
I can vouch
I was with him when we were testing it last night ending the lives of hundreds of bugs at triple digit speeds
It does feel a lot better on the top end, so guessing more tweaking will be done to the tune and the high altitude portion might be taken care of
Like DC guy said more testing will ensue tonight and over the next week so stay tuned!
I was with him when we were testing it last night ending the lives of hundreds of bugs at triple digit speedsIt does feel a lot better on the top end, so guessing more tweaking will be done to the tune and the high altitude portion might be taken care of
Like DC guy said more testing will ensue tonight and over the next week so stay tuned!
07-01-16, 04:41 PM
#60
Pole Position
Lol.........