I looked, but, maybe not hard enough for the stock Naka's wattage. Are the fronts and rears the same in wattage? And is the stock speakers considered crappy because of that reason? Or is it the stock setup itself just bad and that's why everything else is just bad? Call me crazy, but, I happened to like my stock system, at least the mids. Ever since I "upgraded" them it just doesn't sound as good. According to some suggestions on the boards, I think my fronts are the problem to SQ. They are 4" Diamond Audio coaxials, and they get drowned out by the rears, which are also 4" Diamond Audio coaxials. I've been told that I need to get larger fronts - 6 1/2" and also make sure they're components. But, by enlarging the fronts, how will this affect my rears now? Should I keep the rears the same size or should I enlarge them to match the fronts to produce an equal distribution of sound?

 

It doesn't matter what size or wattage rating your speakers are, right now you don't have it set up correctly. Fade the sound to the front. The rears should be used as fill or not at all.

-Robert

 

I am assuming you are still using the Nak amp to power the new setup. That would be problem #1. Your speakers want more power.
#2 - I would not consider Diamond Audio to be a higher end speaker. IMO they are a low end speaker and the original Nak's performed better (when trhey were new).

The Nak amp has equal output of power to the fronts and rears (forget how much offhand).

I agree with Robert J to an extent. The rears are fill, but I do not agree that they are not needed at all. Rear mid range and high's are always needed for proper staging and imaging. Without them you will always "see" the music from the front and never as a surround.

Upgrade your amp first. If not satisfied, upgrade the speakers. Cost effective solutions are out there if $$ is a concern.

I was able to outfit my SC with MB Quart seperates and a JL Audio 10" sub for less than $400.

 

If I'm listening to stereo, then I want sound coming from the front. Since I don't have multi-channel capability in my car, I don't want sound coming from behind me to simulate "surround sound". If I want real surround sound, I have a nice 7.1 system in my home theater.

-Robert

 

I didn't mean to sound offensive. If I did I apologize.

I wasn't referring to "surround sound". I was referring to proper fill. It is necessary to have rear fill to properly "view" the sound in front of you.

Although mid & high range frequencies are directional, the absence of rear fill focuses the imaging directly in front of you as opposed to allowing the sound to "move" as it was recorded.

 

If you are looking for suggestions...

1) Replace your stock amp. I also think the stock speakers had a pretty decent quality sound, but I believe that the speakers, amp, and head unit all were designed to work together as a package.
2) Lose the rear speakers. Fill in a car should be mids to lows not highs. That being said I found that just my sub created the fill that was need for our cars.
3) If you decide to replace your front speakers then go with some good quality 4" separates like FOCAL 100KPs. Our cars cars came with very well sealed and well damped doors. The same set of speakers will sound different in your door as it will in the rear deck. I tried two different sets of 6.5s in the doors and they didn't sound anything like the were supposed to. The midbass was incredible, but the midbass and midvoice would muddle or drown out other sounds. I didnt try 5.25s...they might be better balanced.

My end result was...
Kenwood headunit, 4" Kicker Coaxial doors, factory sub, RF Punch 450.4. 2 channels for the fronts and the other two bridged to the sub. This setup was the best sounding for imaging and the best for the $$. The fronts have plenty of power and are clear and powerful. The sub sounds ok depending on the music, but it is still limited by free-air, impedance, and it inablility to handle all the power that my amp has. I only have the gain turned up about half way for the fronts and the sub. I hope some of my experince helps.

Good luck dude!

 

The Diamonds are fine ---

The factory's are even better if used in the orig. enclosure-- BUT- you may use a better tweet with an outboard or hand built crossover for them--

The amp should be upgraded for sure-- and ANY speaker will be much quieter or louder and/or have a much different response when played freeair reflecting directly off glass vs. playing in an enclosure not even designed for them and firing through a very oddly shaped hole that blocks a good deal of the on-axis (front center) sound from the speaker itself--

 

No need to apologize. I just think we have different opinions on how things should sound.

I've played with rear fill and no-rear fill and I like none. I've run my cars like this all the way back to my '87 CRX. This past weekend, I had people in the back of our ES-350 so I adjusted the radio for "all passengers". I could hear the back speakers and I didn't like it.

I want the image focused directly in front of me. It should be like going to a concert where all of the sound is coming from the stage.

Don't get me wrong, I don't want it to sound like there's a single mono speaker in the middle of the dash. A quality recording on a good system will use stereo separation and phase to give the sound a wide "sound stage". The sub should be crossed over low enough so it doesn't sound like it is in the trunk. It should blend seamlessly into the mids and and they all should cover the frequency range of all of the instruments being listened to.

-Robert

 

Guys, my apologies. I failed to mention that this system is hooked up with an Aftermarket Amp (Phoenix Gold 5.0;4). I just glanced over the posts real quick to get a general consensus. I'm going to reread it again later when I have more time. Thanks for the responses though.

 

i see you live in NY, i know a guy by the name of Jose that can give u some audio tips.

 

You have an interesting setup. I've heard about the no-rears idea, and I just don't think I can do without them. Just so I understand you correctly, you want the subs to not be crossed over too low, but, just enough so that it sounds natural and mixed in with the fronts? I thought it would sound more "complete" if all speakers were in use. Maybe it's because I've become predisposed to think that 4 mids are the only way to go, but, I thought at the very least the rears would be as, mkorsu mentioned, serve as fillers. What do you think of this idea, MJHSC400?

 

Thanks. I just went to bestbuy yesterday, not to look for a bargain, but, to sample some mids, just to get an idea of what sound I want for my car and tried out the Alpine Type-R 6 1/2"s as well as the Infinity Kappa 5 1/4"s. Then listened to some of the smaller ones (4") and I noticed that as you go up in size, the midbass starts to sound incredible, but, the vocals do seem to overshadowed by it. As I went down the sizes, the midbass started to make pop-like sounds that just weren't pleasant for the ears, while the vocals started to become more clear. Is this the unfortunate truth for all mids, or did I just sample some of the worst?

 

Best Buy is not a place to go to sample quality speakers. Did you listen to coaxials or components? A good set of component 6.5" mids/tweeters from CDT, DLS or ED should sound incredible compared to anything from BB. From what I've heard, even the component set from the Cadence Audio outlet site is a steal compared to the sound you get from it.

-Robert

 

That Cadence set was originally sold for 2 years at $250 retail--- just a note--

 

I listened to components, but, it didn't seem like the tweeters were hooked up. CDT, DLS? Are those abbreviations or is it that what they're really called. I know ED = Elemental Design. I'll check these babies out. Thanks.