Ira Senoff

Percy,

Couple of questions:
1. In your GS, where are your front speakers mounted - kicks, factory, where??
2. Which head unit are you using
3. Are you running rear speakers (if so, which ones and where)
4. What processing are you using and what level of flexibility does it afford you
5. Did you upgrade you battery and/or alternator

Percy

Ira,

The speakers are mounted in the factory locations. One of my system goals was for a "stealth" installation. No kick pods or anything else (speaker wise) that would give it away at a first glance.

2. Head unit for now is the stock Pioneer/Premium. BUT, if I ever get the time (and away from all the healthy college ladies), the unit that is going in is a MODDED Sony C90. This thing wasted my Krell on sound quality in an direct a/b/a comparison. (after mods of course) Maybe I should get one of the tiny ladies to help me in the trunk?

3. Rear speakers are in the stock location. Dynaudio (what else) MW160's.

4. McIntosh MEN456 with the McIntosh MEQ452. Extremely flexible unit offering 6 band parametric and variable crossover. Selectable 12 or 24 db/oct. Allows me to run everything active. Modifed, of course.

5. Battery is upgraded to a red top Optima. I rarely exceed 70dbA (averaged) during listening sessions so an aftermarket alternator wouldn't really be needed with my level of listening. I can stand 90dBA for a bit, but that's a bit too loud for me!

Brief components list...
McIntosh amps (mc4000m/mc440m...modded)
McIntosh processor, eq, crossover and parametric (modded)
Dynaudio speakers
Velodyne DF12sc subwoofer (will probably mod out controller box)
Sony C90 head unit (modded)

Just wish I had enough time to hook everything up!

Percy

Kyle Harty

iTrader: (17)

I've got the same problem; my mids and tweeters are on baffles on the unfinished kickpanels (aiming stage) the doors are deadened in expectation of midbasses, the RDAT to the Symmetry is in the visor with no trim panel, the amps are sitting on a board in the trunk with wires all over. It's been hell finding time to make any real progress, and I can at least listen to it the way it is now so I don't have the motivation of not having music. One of these days I'm gonna finish it, just keep telling myself that.

Ira Senoff

Percy,

I understand the necessity and desire to remain stealth; after all, that was the entire theme of my install in the Grand Cherokee I competed with from 97 - 00. To date, I don't think anyone has done anything remotely close in IASCA.

Question - what kind of imaging and staging are you experiencing from that set up? Since you are using stock location, I would imagine that if you optimize things for your position, the passenger is getting horrible imaging and staging information. Did you optimize for you or leave it alone? If left alone for both seats, where are you imaging and staging? I am sure tonal accuracy is fine however

Ira

Percy

Ira,

This is one of the times where I wish I had the F#1 processor. Imaging is, surprisingly, not too bad for using the stock locations. Though it won't compare with a home audio (properly setup for room size, etc) system. The Dyn dispersion characteristics help quite a bit, so there's more of a sweet spot to them.

The only car that I know of that imaged perfectly was Kirk Perry's Pontiac Lemans. Literally tore apart everything to resemble a home audio setup...no front seats.

Percy

Ira Senoff

I remember the Lemans. It had something like 10 foot pathlengths. They banned that thing from competition due to the modifications made to retain its "driveability". Talk about your back seat drivers......


Who needs an F1Status?!? Get the Pioneer P9 and save enough money for a new set of wheels

Rico's Revenge

Percy, how are your crossovers points set?

I also elected to retain the factory positions. I score well with image height and width which is inherent for door speakers, but the draw back is a bit of side bias. I can get a decent center image, but it tends to wander when the freq. goes lower. I really don't want to do kicks, but it may come to that before USACi finals.

Todd

Percy

RR,

Since I'm still relagated to using the stock head unit (for now until I get some install time), the crossover that I'm using for the Dyn tweet is 3khz at 18db/oct. Midwoofer is running full range (about 100hz to 4khz...if that) and the Vel is running passively (didn't install the controller yet...) at 100hz and below.

Image height is, surprisingly, good at 3khz. It's a "touch" below eye level, but it's not "frowning" due to kick pods, something which I have YET to hear done properly. I'd usually try to stick with 24db/oct, but I'm using a different xover (leftover quart stuff) due to space considerations. I took the xover out of a 160.03 set and gutted it.

Have you RTA'd the vehicle yet? I had lots of problems (old MBQ stuff/160.03/218.03/hx25's) at the 800 to 1.25k range. Used two parametric bands, one set at -15db at 1khz and another set at -10db for the same frequency. With the Dyns, I didn't have to use the extra band and the one band that I used was at -4db, 1khz.

Percy

Rico's Revenge

I have not RTA'd yet, although the team has one. USACi is weird, they place less emphasis on the RTA than other organizations.

My height is right where you described as well. Another problem with USACi is that they want the image on the reaview mirror, which IMO is WAY too high (unless you like to be in the front row at a concert with a high stage).

I'll RTA the car this weekend (after the Club Lexus Meet ) and get back with you.

Thanks!

Percy

RR,

They want the image height just at the mirror?!?! That's like looking UP the performers nose! Quite objectionable, imo, unless you're at a Brittney Spears (or some other very fit/good looking young lady) concert. Ehhh...you'd just be staring at navel and other goodies at that stage height.... Maybe USAC is onto something?

The last few concerts have always been a few rows up, just right in the "sweet spot". For the Lexus, it's about at the right height in these circumstances, and the image space isn't too bad either.

I wonder what IASCA says about image height. Now I can see why USAC and kickpods will get along...it's probably the only way to project the image height to the mirror level.

Percy

Kyle Harty

iTrader: (17)

Rear view mirror? That's not right IMHO. Percy put it pretty well, I think I'll keep mine around eye level. I probably couldn't get it to much higher anyway, but I don't see why you'd want it that high for listening. The image height track on the USAC disc does seem to be a little higher than most music you'd listen to, so maybe you can get a good balance, or at least decent scores with things set up the way you like them.

Rico's Revenge

I agree that it is WAY too high. I just set it where I like it and leave it alone.

Todd

retrodrive

Stage height and width are the hardest parts...the higher the better. Judges look at the hard-to-get spots first and they better be impressed. I can move my stage from dash to above the mirror by changing cutoff points of my front stage...pretty neat. I am going with P9 also btw.

DoubleWhoosh

That LeMans wasn't all that great. It got smoked at Stone Mountain by quite a few cars...

When I listened to it I didn't think it was anything special considering what he did to the car.

Percy

The only thing that was unique about the lemans was the staging. I don't know what type of components Kirk was using...have the article buried somewhere.

Doublewhoosh,

What are your opinions of his car? I only read the writeup...never listened to it.

Percy