Hello gentlemen (and maybe ladies?)...first official visit to ClubLexus for me. I do not own a Lexus, but called your phone number, and I believe Ethan is who I spoke with. He said you were willing to try and help me out.

First of all...whoever did the write up on the HID kits did a great job. I'm a member of www.dodgetrucks.org, and we have mentioned that write-up quite a few times, and given you guys credit with great work (so if the moderator has seen that page accessed a LOT lately, there's your explanation).

Let me tell you why I think somebody here might be able to help. Somewhere down the line, Lexus and Toyota are linked, right? Well, the Toyota Truck/SUV/Sequoia/Sienna (2001 and up) have a problem that is also a problem with my 2002 Dodge Ram 1500. Or at least thats what Jen at www.suvlights.com has deduced.

It seems the wiring for the headlights (which use 9007 bulbs) is a positive ground system, which means power is always there, and the switch just provides connectivity through the ground.

If you wire up a HID conversion kit, or even a heavy duty wiring harness, it will not work. The relays just click away...and the lights look like strobes, blinking about every second or less. Jen seems to think a 5-pin relay instead of the 4-pin relay will fix this.

I have the CATZ 9007 hi/lo beam combo (plus the 9006 kit for my fog lights), and would love to get them working. If anybody here has a solution as to how to wire them correctly, I would really appreciate your help.

Thanks.
Greg

By the way...if my user name, truck or signature seems "redneck", please forgive me. The truck got "named" by my wife, and I just copied the stuff over from my account at www.dodgetrucks.org to make it easy. Also, if any of you also on a Dodge Ram/Dakota/Durango...make sure you stop by.

 

thanks for the compliment on the DIY. i am not 100% sure if i can help in any way to solve the problem but it's definitely worth it to see how it's setup.

the hid kit i installed (same one that's shown in the DIY) has a relay of 4 pins as well, so from what you said that doesn't work? do you have any diagram or information on how the relay wiring diagram is? that would be very useful in figuring out how to debug the issue

one thing i don't really sure is, the truck you have is already using 9007 right? so basically that bulb is plug and play? is it possible for you to take a picture of the connector? not sure how much that will help.

you also said that you have the conversion kit ready already, is it a directly plug and play? i am not talking about the bulb but also the wiring, including the one that connect from the stock power connector to the ballasts. basically the kit i have, it's direct plug and play including the power connector. so i don't even have to run a wire directly from the ballasts to the battery, something that i have seen in other hid kit setup. not sure if that has anything to do with it?

and last of all, the kit you have, the relay is also 4-pin?

 

The current kit is a plug and play (meaning no splicing in anywhere), but also connects to the battery. It has 4-pin connectors in them, which supposedly work fine for everything but the Toyota trucks/vans/SUVs, and now the Dodge trucks. I have the wiring diagram, and will try to post it up later. I'm going to cat FET-CATZ on Monday and see if they have a solution...I can't be the first one to try to install these.

The CATZ kits get the "signal" from the stock connector, but the power from the battery. I have seen kits both ways. These work similar to the HD wiring harness that suvlights sells.

I'll try to post more specific info later today...I've got a nephew's 5-year-old birthday party (fun, fun, fun) to get to.

Thanks.
Greg

 

rominl - I am still trying to figure the problem out, not sure I understand it yet. Where I am coming from is that all auto makers are using standardized bulbs with standardized wiring, otherwise things won't work with the standard bulbs. Now, this comment about "positive ground" and the voltage always being there have me confused. Is this a problem with a DRL setup? If that is the case, such as the high beams on our GS's, you are really just out of luck in replacing them with HIDs (if anyone has figured this out, let me know, I want to put HIDs in my highs but the DRL setup would have to be seriously rewired). I may be entirely off base here but is there a DRL circuit on the bulbs you are trying to replace with the HIDs?

 

Here's the wiring diagram...no DRL's on my truck (I took an educated guess that you mean Daytime Running Lights?).

I just went back outside and checked. I assume you know a 9007 is a single bulb with high and low beams. Right now, with the light switch off, there is ~10.5V between low beam wire and ground and also ~10.5V between high beam wire and ground, when no bulb is present. When standard bulb is connected, the proper ~12V or so is present only on low when light switch is on, and only on high when high beams are turned on. Like I said, I have no idea where else this occurs except the Toyota trucks. It seems as if they've done the Dodge Rams starting in '02. I've tried a heavy duty wiring harness, a HID-Plus kit (low beam 9007 only) and my current CATZ hi/lo kit. All have given me nothing but the relays clicking away, and the headlights blinking like strobes.

Any other ideas?

Thanks.
Greg

 

umm...... this is complicated..... i guess the problem kicks in coz' the high beam is together.... did you try to measure the voltage between the low beam and high beam when the high beam is on, and the same thing when the low beam is on? or that when the low beam is on the high beam is zero compared to gnd?

the diagram you posted, it's for the hid? damn that's complicated, much more complicated than the one i have.... some more questions, so basically with hid you are SUPPOSED to lose your high beam?

i asked these coz' if there is a voltage difference between the high and low beam when the low is on, have you tried hard gnd the high beam wire with the hid kit installed?

 

What is the function of the "HID Control Unit" in your wiring diagram? Is it another relay? Toyota electronics use a switched ground system. If Dodge electronics are the same, then perhaps your wiring is inverted and the aftermarket relay is signaling your stock relay to signal back to the aftermarket relay, which creates an indefinite loop of switching.

BTW, thanks for the compliment on the article, the more up-to-date version is located on my site: http://www.intellexual.net/hidframes.html

 

i guess the ultimate guru is here

 

lex400sc - Sounds like you have been through this. I cannot say I am familiar with either the Toyota or Dodge setups but if it is a true ground switched system, it seems like the voltage on the light isn't high enough, should be darn near full battery voltage. I haven't looked at the wiring diagram but it sounds very similar to a circuit where instead of using a mechanical relay for a switch, with a hard on and off, there is some sort of solid state device that isn't giving a hard off but leaking voltage through, hence the 10.5V. Not enough current to light the lights, particularly in the absence of a ground, but enough to drive the supplemental switching of the aftermarket HID crazy. Also don't know how the aftermarket HID setup works. Starting to wonder if a pull up isn't required somewhere in here.

 

I'll try to answer some of these first...the indefinite loop is exactly what I think I have...the HID control unit is what control hi/lo. This CATZ kit has a single beam that actually moves up and down for high and low, instead of dual elements like the OEM 9007.

So, for this kit, I will not lose high beam function, which is why I'm interested in getting it figured out. But, I've had the same problem with the low-beam only kit that I have installed right now.

I think I'm gonna just install a few more switches, and run power directly from the battery to the "signal" connector, and see how that works. I'll be sure to let you guys know.

Greg

 

sounds like a plan. so you saying that the kit in the diagram you showed us is NOT the kit you have right, and that's the diagram of the correct setup? i would definitely try to give it more swtiches and see how it goes

 

no...I have the kit that is pictured...but it is not installed. I have a low-beam only kit that is installed, but will come out this week.

I bought my new switches today, and did a test hookup, and they work perfect.

1 on/off switch for fogs, with the output going to the HID kit
1 on/off switch for headlights, with the output going to 1 on/on switch to go between high/low...

I'll post a pic when I'm done...but it probably won't be til the weekend that I have time to get around to it (cause you all know you need to do it right the first time, not some sloppy hurried up install!!).

Thanks.
Greg

 

hey congrats! so you did it and the hid doesn't flashes like a strobe light anymore? that's great!

 

yep...no more stobin' (is that a word?)...

I got a chance to install the fogs today, as well as mount the switches. I have not run any power to them, but the fogs actually work on the stock setup. I'm going to run a new switch anyway, just so they'll be the same.

Here's a pic of the setup...the two switches on the right will be the on/off for fogs and headlights. They have a small green light you can see that comes on when the lights are on. You cannot really see them (which is good) while you're driving.

The toggle switch will switch between hi/lo. The green LED will come on when brights are on...since my normal "bright light indicator" will no longer be used. Plus, this way, with independent switches, I can actually run high beams and fog lights at the same time, which you cannot normal do. The toggle switch doesn't stand out as bad as the picture shows, as far as color goes. It's black and the interior is dark graphite, but the flash reflected off the shiny dark grey and not the black of the switch. You can see both the switch and the LED through the steering wheel when you're in the driver's seat...which is good.

I'm also posting a pic of my gauge pod, which has an air/fuel and vac/boost gauge in it (tied into the dimmer switch). I installed the gauges, and painted and installed the pod. FYI...the pillars and the headliner are that lighter grey/beige color...and the one I painted matches perfect.

Hope you like both. I'll try to get a pic of the HID's once they're installed. The fogs look GREAT!!

Greg

 

yeah definitely post some pics on the final installation, and also pics on the headlight and fogs. that would look awesome! glad that you figure out how to wire the whole thing. so now you are the only one over at the toyota truck board to have hid headlight huh?