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There's been a few crank/starting problem here the past 6 months or so. Hopefully, this will be of some help to others. I've been having an intermittent problem starting the engine in the LS for a few months now.
Sometimes you turn the key to start - starts normally (with authority).
Sometimes you turn the key to start - nothing happens.
Sometimes you turn the key to start and it "grunts" once and stops.
After 2 or 3, cycling the key between lock and start, it will sometimes crank normally and start.
There was a time when once the engine was started, it would be trouble-free the rest of the day. No longer is this the case.
I finally got around to replacing the ignition switch:
Dropped the column to get access to the ignition switch.
Upon removal from the lock mechanism, the switch came out in pieces.
Started the engine a few times, used the car all day running errands and all appeared good. Until the next morning, it was back to same old, same old....
Purchased and received a new starter relay from an Amazon seller (J-P Carparts). Yes, there's a risk of counterfeit parts when buying parts on Amazon - fake denso, NGK, etc. However, it appears legit.
Starter Relay - as received packaging.
New replacement on left, original on right.
I removed the cover from the old relay and examined the relay contacts. I'm pretty sure the condition of the contacts is what was causing the problem. Time will tell, but so far, so good. Hopefully, there's not high resistance somewhere downstream that's causing a high current draw thru the contacts.
Last edited by paulo57509; 03-20-23 at 08:11 PM.
Reason: Corrected format and grammar
Went out to start the car on 3/31/23 and all I got was one click with every attempt. I'm pretty sure it's the contacts in the starter solenoid that are worn.
I have a rebuilt Denso starter with all the gaskets necessary for replacement, on order. I did have to buy the pinche cooling tube o-ring from Lexus; my betting that this is not a standard sized o-ring.
I was thinking of just replacing the solenoid but even an aftermarket solenoid is $100 more than the Denso rebuilt unit (Rock Auto).
Still not done after 8 hours (4hrs/day) to expose the starter.
The rebuilt starter has been mounted. Before beginning re-assembly, I'm going to pull the fuel pump relay and test the starter. I'm thinking of replacing the knock sensors while they're exposed.
Because the engine sits so far back and the intake weighs ~41 lbs (yes, I weighed it), it's hard to lift it over the mounting studs (and clear the vacuum tank mounted on the underside of the manifold) while leaning over the radiator support (I'm short and have no arm strength). I removed the fan and radiator exposing the frame brackets; I climbed into the engine compartment, stood on the brackets and lifted the manifold up and out. Normally, lifting is probably a two-person job. Removing the rear coolant cross over was another adventure - Toyota provides zero slack in the wire harness.
Inspecting the solenoid in the old starter, they show the typical worn out Denso contacts.
I'm thinking of replacing the knock sensors while they're exposed.
the intake weighs ~41 lbs (yes, I weighed it), it's hard to lift it over the mounting studs (I'm short and have no arm strength). I removed the fan and radiator exposing the frame brackets; I climbed into the engine compartment, Normally, lifting is probably a two-person job. Removing the rear coolant cross over was another adventure -
As for the knock sensors, If it was me, I'd change them cuz it's a big job to get back in there and only a couple minutes now, unless you're on a tight budget. (I've been there)
The lifting--back in the old days we always stood in the engine compartment. (but we didn't have to remove anything to get in there) (those were good days )
Being short and no strength; as ya do this work over and over that strength just comes to ya. My father was 5' 4", - 112 lbs. and I seen him stand in the engine compartment of an old 1971 Datsun 510 and lift out the engine by himself. Strength builds up in different parts of the body (wrist, fingertips) being a mechanic and doing the same thing every day.
On the rear crossover make sure you use OEM gaskets when reinstalling it, you don't want to go back in there again to fix the leaks you'll have. I don't remember if the front crossover is exposed while doing the starter but it's worth it to change those gaskets also. I had to replace my front crossover last year due to a crack and it was not a fun job at all.
As for the knock sensors, If it was me, I'd change them cuz it's a big job to get back in there and only a couple minutes now, unless you're on a tight budget. (I've been there)
The lifting--back in the old days we always stood in the engine compartment. (but we didn't have to remove anything to get in there) (those were good days )
Being short and no strength; as ya do this work over and over that strength just comes to ya. My father was 5' 4", - 112 lbs. and I seen him stand in the engine compartment of an old 1971 Datsun 510 and lift out the engine by himself. Strength builds up in different parts of the body (wrist, fingertips) being a mechanic and doing the same thing every day.
On the rear crossover make sure you use OEM gaskets when reinstalling it, you don't want to go back in there again to fix the leaks you'll have. I don't remember if the front crossover is exposed while doing the starter but it's worth it to change those gaskets also. I had to replace my front crossover last year due to a crack and it was not a fun job at all.
I don't like lifting with just my arms. It's a good way to wreck your back. Used to be that you could get into the engine compartments of 1/2T Chevy 3100's. GM could have probably fit two, 216's side-by-side under those hoods.
I find it's easier to get the manifold to clear its mounting studs and the ACIS vacuum reservoir if the front crossover is removed. Removing the manifold nuts/bolts, lifting the front of the manifold with a pry bar will give enough room to access the crossover nuts.
Replacement gaskets, Fel-Pro or Victor-Reinz gaskets have been working fine for me. I think a lot of cooling system gasket failure can be traced to improper or lack of cooling system maintenance (GM cooling system and gaskets not withstanding).
yeah I kind of was thinking starter after your first post. Mine went out at 108k, thankfully done by the previous owner at the Lexus dealer in 2008 to a tune of $1000, with a discount.
I will definitely get the knock sensors done. It is not worth saving that money, I did replace only one and the one I didnt replace went out shortly after. Be gentle on the harness, you do get the connectors alone separately.
I concur with the others on doing the knock sensors since you are already in there. I also recommend replacing all the injector seals, they are basically plastic instead of rubber now after decades of heat cycling and can cause unmetered air to enter the engine.
Still not done after 8 hours (4hrs/day) to expose the starter.
The rebuilt starter has been mounted. Before beginning re-assembly, I'm going to pull the fuel pump relay and test the starter. I'm thinking of replacing the knock sensors while they're exposed.
Because the engine sits so far back and the intake weighs ~41 lbs (yes, I weighed it), it's hard to lift it over the mounting studs (and clear the vacuum tank mounted on the underside of the manifold) while leaning over the radiator support (I'm short and have no arm strength). I removed the fan and radiator exposing the frame brackets; I climbed into the engine compartment, stood on the brackets and lifted the manifold up and out. Normally, lifting is probably a two-person job. Removing the rear coolant cross over was another adventure - Toyota provides zero slack in the wire harness.
Inspecting the solenoid in the old starter, they show the typical worn out Denso contacts.
Did you have any chance to see those two contacts carefully?
Starter's contacts wear like this below. The contact connected to the battery wears much faster than the other side which is connected to brushes due to the attack of electrons. This causes the intermittent non staring problem when aged and Toyota asked Denso to use a bigger contact for the battery side for 1UZ engines and other engines that have starters located where not easy to access.
Did you have any chance to see those two contacts carefully?
Starter's contacts wear like this below. The contact connected to the battery wears much faster than the other side which is connected to brushes due to the attack of electrons. This causes the intermittent non staring problem when aged and Toyota asked Denso to use a bigger contact for the battery side for 1UZ engines and other engines that have starters located where not easy to access.
Hello Yamae, yes, the contacts are worn as shown in your image. The side opposite the battery also has a worn circular area just not as bad as the battery side as you stated. It's kind of hard to photograph with the contacts still assembled in the solenoid. I didn't want to disassemble the stater any further as I need to send this back to the seller as a rebuildable core.
I'm finding out that there are more than a handful of "V" engine designs that locate the starter between the cylinder banks; GM Northstar for one; which is no longer in production.
I still had to pour slowly but it was one continuous pour. The ridges on the inside of the funnel created a fluid vortex that helped greatly in getting the coolant into the engine. Took more time to dilute the coolant 50/50 with distilled water than it took to fill the cooling system.
03-20-23, 04:05 PM
Intermittent Crank Condition
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