The great question for us Ls400 drivers. the 430....
11-23-18, 05:37 AM
#16
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
these are the reason i really dont like the 430 and never have.
bland BLAND styling. the 400 was slick sleek and expensive looking. hell it still is.
the 400 still looks pretty modern and has aged amazingly well. the 430 has not and looks older then a 400.
it looks scrunched up. like someone took a w140 benz and smashed it shorter
the ride quality is meh. yes its dead flat and quiet as it should be, but its TOO dead and quiet. the 400 is still quiet and flat, but still has enough feedback to be fun to drive and has charm and soul
the driving stance on the 430, sucks. i feel like im sitting in a bathtub or something when driving it.
the 430 is just too soft and cuddly for me. meh.
the dashboard layout sucks
the red needles on the dash make it look cheap. they went back to white in the refresh in 04, but still, not a fan.
the ML sound system is awful in the 430. the Nak in the 400 absolutley kills it
the early rims are hideous
i could go on and on but the early 430s represent everything that was wrong with early-mid 00s luxury cars. i absolutley hate it. i hate it almost as much as i hate the 500.
the 400 was faster than the 430. 0-60 not so much, but on the highway the 400 rapes the 430.
the 400 still feels sporty. the 430 does not.
bland BLAND styling. the 400 was slick sleek and expensive looking. hell it still is.
the 400 still looks pretty modern and has aged amazingly well. the 430 has not and looks older then a 400.
it looks scrunched up. like someone took a w140 benz and smashed it shorter
the ride quality is meh. yes its dead flat and quiet as it should be, but its TOO dead and quiet. the 400 is still quiet and flat, but still has enough feedback to be fun to drive and has charm and soul
the driving stance on the 430, sucks. i feel like im sitting in a bathtub or something when driving it.
the 430 is just too soft and cuddly for me. meh.
the dashboard layout sucks
the red needles on the dash make it look cheap. they went back to white in the refresh in 04, but still, not a fan.
the ML sound system is awful in the 430. the Nak in the 400 absolutley kills it
the early rims are hideous
i could go on and on but the early 430s represent everything that was wrong with early-mid 00s luxury cars. i absolutley hate it. i hate it almost as much as i hate the 500.
the 400 was faster than the 430. 0-60 not so much, but on the highway the 400 rapes the 430.
the 400 still feels sporty. the 430 does not.
11-23-18, 08:40 AM
#17
Damn Rob, I had no idea you hated the car that much! I kinda agree but I don't think it's a bad car. It looks OK from the front but to me the 430 looks like a Camry or something from the back. They're OK I suppose. I think the 1UZFE is probably more reliable too but I'm not sure. What do you guys think?
11-23-18, 10:25 AM
#18
Pole Position
I enjoy reading everyone's opinions here as I often think about this same thing myself.
I do not agree with the opinions that the LS430 is an ugly car. I think it looks fantastic. Sure it's not as sleek as the 400, but it makes up for that in so many other ways. It looks... grand. The 400 is a big car, the 430 took it to the next level. Plus, as with any car I suppose, a mild ride height drop and some choice wheel/tire combo, MAN does that set the 430 off! A 430 that is styled right can stop me in my tracks.
Bottom line I will NEVER trade out my 400 for a 430. Broken record here, but the LS400 (specifically 98-00) is the Lexus. Always has been, always will be. But I would love to have a 430 (04-06) parked next to my 400 sometime in the near-ish future.
I think all generations of LS look outstanding. When 460's (especially 2013-2017) eventually drop down near the current 430 price range, I'd like to put one of those next to my 400 and hopeful 430 as well. Much of this stems from being a Toyota fanboy I'll admit.
Realistically I'll have a JZX100 before an LS460. But that's a whole different discussion, not to mention apples to oranges.
No hate for the 430 here. I wouldn't pick up a '01-'03 these days as its just as easy and practically just as affordable to find an '04-'06. I'm glad I'm behind the wheel of my 400 when I see a 430 on the road, but I'm still looking at it wishing it was mine as well!
I do not agree with the opinions that the LS430 is an ugly car. I think it looks fantastic. Sure it's not as sleek as the 400, but it makes up for that in so many other ways. It looks... grand. The 400 is a big car, the 430 took it to the next level. Plus, as with any car I suppose, a mild ride height drop and some choice wheel/tire combo, MAN does that set the 430 off! A 430 that is styled right can stop me in my tracks.
Bottom line I will NEVER trade out my 400 for a 430. Broken record here, but the LS400 (specifically 98-00) is the Lexus. Always has been, always will be. But I would love to have a 430 (04-06) parked next to my 400 sometime in the near-ish future.
I think all generations of LS look outstanding. When 460's (especially 2013-2017) eventually drop down near the current 430 price range, I'd like to put one of those next to my 400 and hopeful 430 as well. Much of this stems from being a Toyota fanboy I'll admit.
Realistically I'll have a JZX100 before an LS460. But that's a whole different discussion, not to mention apples to oranges.
No hate for the 430 here. I wouldn't pick up a '01-'03 these days as its just as easy and practically just as affordable to find an '04-'06. I'm glad I'm behind the wheel of my 400 when I see a 430 on the road, but I'm still looking at it wishing it was mine as well!
11-23-18, 03:23 PM
#19
Lexus Test Driver
Thread Starter
well, i think we will see who is a true Ls400 loyalist and who isnt now that the early 430s are down in the $2500 craigslist bracket with the late 400s. i know a few that have jumped ship already.
i guess i shouldn't say i HATE the 430 cause i dont. i just have a dislike for it. when the day comes that all 400s are used up -which is getting closer and closer sadly, ill be making the jump to the 460 as my primary car bypassing the 430 all together.
i choose my main Ls400 always on a 5 year plan. my 90 lasted 8, but 5 years is the standard lifespan of a 400 before it cant be trusted anymore for everyday use. i got 5 years out of my 95 which im currently restoring (on another thread), and i got my 2000 with the 5 year plan in mind.
in 5 years the early 460s will be 15+ years old and in the $3000-5000 range hopefully.
i will never own a 500. yes they are beautiful but i just cant get past the fact it lost 2 cylinders
i guess i shouldn't say i HATE the 430 cause i dont. i just have a dislike for it. when the day comes that all 400s are used up -which is getting closer and closer sadly, ill be making the jump to the 460 as my primary car bypassing the 430 all together.
i choose my main Ls400 always on a 5 year plan. my 90 lasted 8, but 5 years is the standard lifespan of a 400 before it cant be trusted anymore for everyday use. i got 5 years out of my 95 which im currently restoring (on another thread), and i got my 2000 with the 5 year plan in mind.
in 5 years the early 460s will be 15+ years old and in the $3000-5000 range hopefully.
i will never own a 500. yes they are beautiful but i just cant get past the fact it lost 2 cylinders
11-25-18, 05:48 PM
#21
Some people.
Who comes up with this sht.
"Rapes" is a 500hp car vs. a 250hp car.
If there is ANY truth to the 400 being faster at all on the highway, I can see it maybe getting a length or two which is FAR from "rapes".
Doesn't the 430 have one of the lowest coefficients of drag of ANY production car period? And with the better geared 6spd, I just don't see where you come up with your comment. Neither car is fast by any means, they are both slow pigs but if I noticed anything, it's actually more impressive how it pulls north of 60mph.
My buddy is getting a 2000 LS400 in two days and driving it back to Chicago. I'll make sure to "race" him to see who rapes who.
11-25-18, 06:08 PM
#22
11-25-18, 06:11 PM
#23
Hey man, I am just telling you what I have personally been told. I got an 05 Sienna XLE in that same gold metallic color. Maybe the paint codes are different, but it looks close. And all I've ever been told is how ugly gold cars are since buying that van. Same story when I owned a 97 gold Avalon for about ten years.
I don't mind it myself. I prefer it to a black car that shows every finger print, swirl and scratch. But based on what I've heard, people just don't like gold or tan, especially the automotive crowd.
I don't mind it myself. I prefer it to a black car that shows every finger print, swirl and scratch. But based on what I've heard, people just don't like gold or tan, especially the automotive crowd.
11-25-18, 06:39 PM
#24
Hey man, I am just telling you what I have personally been told. I got an 05 Sienna XLE in that same gold metallic color. Maybe the paint codes are different, but it looks close. And all I've ever been told is how ugly gold cars are since buying that van. Same story when I owned a 97 gold Avalon for about ten years.
I don't mind it myself. I prefer it to a black car that shows every finger print, swirl and scratch. But based on what I've heard, people just don't like gold or tan, especially the automotive crowd.
I don't mind it myself. I prefer it to a black car that shows every finger print, swirl and scratch. But based on what I've heard, people just don't like gold or tan, especially the automotive crowd.
11-25-18, 06:39 PM
#25
Racer
11-25-18, 11:10 PM
#26
Lexus Test Driver
precisely... my E55 completely "rapes" my crown vic lol, and they each happen to be exactly those power figures, at least ford claims about 250hp but it wouldn't surprise me if it's a bit less
and btw, feel free to talk about how underwhelming the crown vic performance is, but i can't sit idly by while you call the LS 400 (98-00 at least) a "slow pig" when it can do 0-60 in 6 seconds flat with a 1/4 mile trap speed of over 100 mph
come on lol that's not "slow pig" territory, and on the highway especially it really pulls and closes long gaps with ease
i know you're just making use of a bit of hyperbole but i had to defend the honor of the LS haha
and btw, feel free to talk about how underwhelming the crown vic performance is, but i can't sit idly by while you call the LS 400 (98-00 at least) a "slow pig" when it can do 0-60 in 6 seconds flat with a 1/4 mile trap speed of over 100 mph
come on lol that's not "slow pig" territory, and on the highway especially it really pulls and closes long gaps with ease
i know you're just making use of a bit of hyperbole but i had to defend the honor of the LS haha
11-25-18, 11:41 PM
#27
Racer
I’d say while the 430 has better tech, 6 spd tranny and more powerful engine. The looks between the two always make me take the 400. That said if a good deal on a 430 comes up I wouldn’t pass it by.
11-26-18, 08:11 AM
#28
Racer
11-27-18, 10:25 AM
#29
curious to see if those who like the 400 are at the youngest in their early thirties today.
my point is that folks in this age generation grew up with the late 90-early and 2000s styling when they started looking at cars to desire, which "anchored" their tastes to liking it.
same goes with the baby boomers who love their classic 50-60s chevy's since they grew up with them when new.
to my observation, this is why the classic car industry is "booming" as the desires are high for these now that the folks who only dreamed of them now have money to acquire.
this is why I see the 1st gen NSX holding its value due to being very desirable to people with more means nowadays. MKIV Supra, integra type-R, civic SI, 300ZX, 3000GT, E30 M3, etc all somewhat fall in this category.
this leads me to believe that the even younger generation out there will desire the new toyota/lexus styling cues as their "anchor"...prius prime for instance!
my point is that folks in this age generation grew up with the late 90-early and 2000s styling when they started looking at cars to desire, which "anchored" their tastes to liking it.
same goes with the baby boomers who love their classic 50-60s chevy's since they grew up with them when new.
to my observation, this is why the classic car industry is "booming" as the desires are high for these now that the folks who only dreamed of them now have money to acquire.
this is why I see the 1st gen NSX holding its value due to being very desirable to people with more means nowadays. MKIV Supra, integra type-R, civic SI, 300ZX, 3000GT, E30 M3, etc all somewhat fall in this category.
this leads me to believe that the even younger generation out there will desire the new toyota/lexus styling cues as their "anchor"...prius prime for instance!
11-27-18, 01:45 PM
#30
Lexus Test Driver
curious to see if those who like the 400 are at the youngest in their early thirties today.
my point is that folks in this age generation grew up with the late 90-early and 2000s styling when they started looking at cars to desire, which "anchored" their tastes to liking it.
same goes with the baby boomers who love their classic 50-60s chevy's since they grew up with them when new.
to my observation, this is why the classic car industry is "booming" as the desires are high for these now that the folks who only dreamed of them now have money to acquire.
this is why I see the 1st gen NSX holding its value due to being very desirable to people with more means nowadays. MKIV Supra, integra type-R, civic SI, 300ZX, 3000GT, E30 M3, etc all somewhat fall in this category.
this leads me to believe that the even younger generation out there will desire the new toyota/lexus styling cues as their "anchor"...prius prime for instance!
my point is that folks in this age generation grew up with the late 90-early and 2000s styling when they started looking at cars to desire, which "anchored" their tastes to liking it.
same goes with the baby boomers who love their classic 50-60s chevy's since they grew up with them when new.
to my observation, this is why the classic car industry is "booming" as the desires are high for these now that the folks who only dreamed of them now have money to acquire.
this is why I see the 1st gen NSX holding its value due to being very desirable to people with more means nowadays. MKIV Supra, integra type-R, civic SI, 300ZX, 3000GT, E30 M3, etc all somewhat fall in this category.
this leads me to believe that the even younger generation out there will desire the new toyota/lexus styling cues as their "anchor"...prius prime for instance!
, so i've also grown up with things like the 3rd gen ford taurus but i think that's hideous lol. i like seeing them for nostalgia's sake, but just a gross blob of a design. same with like every other american car from that period, but i think the camry and accord from that era look perfectly fine. certainly not exciting, but it's a camry or accord so it doesn't need to be as long as it's not off-putting and still very good at just being a car, which is all they really need to be.idk something about the LS seems like they did a perfect job of balancing upscale-ness with a sense of reserve and purpose. i've always described it as being the minimum amount of car required to achieve that level of awesomeness. and especially in profile it looks so sleek and lacking any excess fat. same for the interior design. the proportions of the windows and door panels also just work perfectly, not like the current 6th gen taurus which is a massive car but has tiny (especially in the rear) windows. i think there's honestly some angles where the LS looks kinda boring and not even particularly special, but for any of those angles (and then some) there's another that's like damn that is a sexy elegant vehicle right there...
it particularly helps to have a period press shot from when everything was new and the photo has a more 90s look to it:
i also don't really like the look of the prius prime, but it's an awesome car though, probably the first prius to actually make me consider getting one lol
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