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Driveshaft assembly guibo differs from separately purchased guibo
While sorting out balancing driveshaft components, observed the guibo on the new rear section of the driveshaft differs from the new Toyota guibo purchased separately for the front section of original driveshaft.
Guibo provided with driveshaft assembly
Side one of Toyota guibo Side two of Toyota guibo.
Replacement guibos are not shown as a superceding part number....
Perhaps there was a P.N. change on driveshaft guibos used in production between 1995-1997 , 1998-2000 vs. replacement part ?
These flex discs see lots of torque so do yourself a big favor by do not buy any cheap aftermarket but OEM flex discs. About 3 years ago, I bought a pair of cheap Chinese made on eBay for about $60 for my 97 LS but within 3 months they were completely cracked at multiple places. The OEM flex discs are expensive but they're made to last so bite the bullet & spend the money so you won't have to replace them again for another 20 years.
A very fine driveshaft, released to the wilds of dealer mechanics and now any ol' shade tree mechanic, none of whom follow the directions.
I just finished a 16-hour 800 mile round trip from Pensacola FL to Atlanta GA and back @ an average speed of 80 mph. Underway, it took time for me to tune into the imbalance periods. 50/72/93, and more noticeable over time as I acclimated to the ambient sounds and feeling. There is a wheel imbalance now coming through the steering wheel that takes the focus off the driveshaft. At exactly 87 mph, imbalance is imperceptible. I say good nuff for now.
Colin
Hi Amskeptic, off topic I just want to commend you on your awesome looking LS, is that the original paint? Nice machine!
LS400 and LS430 are very complex driveshafts when it comes time for balancing...
Images of 1999 LS400 driveshaft undergoing fixturing on balancing machine at B & T Driveshaft & Gear in Milford, Ohio.
THIS IS the go-to Stateside for LS400 or LS430 driveshaft balancing who has taken the time to sort this out and invest in modern equipment and correct fixturing.
Several images of fixturing work still in progress:
Jeff Brill at B & T Shaft & Gear, Inc. had good news...1999 LS400 driveshaft balanced!
3 months in process...
Fixturing required some research and machining effort, but finally achieved.
As far as I know, this is the only driveshaft shop with purpose-built fixturing for an LS400 driveshaft...even Toyota North America was unable to sort it out...or recommend a vendor.
Spun up to 2000 RPM without issue....video attached
8 grams required for the front shaft and behind the carrier also required 8 grams.
The clicking sound (in video) are studs that help rotate the assembly as it is basically free floating on the bushing and stud on the fixture.
Painting is offered.
Fixturing designed to work with Lexus style driveshaft with centering pins. First balancing weight attached...and before painting. Second balancing weight attached.
Noticeable improvement in shift quality by replacing original (180,000 miles) rubber guibos with new OEM parts. 22 year old rubber had hardened somewhat and was exhibiting cracks.
Professional balancing also contributed to the end result.
No imbalance through 100 MPH+.
Hi, i am following this thread because of the interest in the balancing process involved.
Id like to know more about the factory weighted bolts and the posisbility that the DS are balanced on the car from factory...
i am making my own balancing jig/machine to learn whats wrong with so many cars once DS are played with...
Noticeable improvement in shift quality by replacing original (180,000 miles) rubber guibos with new OEM parts. 22 year old rubber had hardened somewhat and was exhibiting cracks.
Professional balancing also contributed to the end result.
No imbalance through 100 MPH+.
Could you please do me a favor and list the symptoms that caused you to investigate this imbalance? I took a look through your thread and you didn't mention much about diagnosis that you did (forgive me if you did write it up and I missed it).
What defined you to say it felt imbalanced by how the car drove?
Okay, I called this shop up in Ohio and he flat out refused to balance another one of these driveshafts again. He said it was one of the biggest pains in his side and took way too much time to figure out. He was very vocal about how difficult these are to balance and he doesn't understand why that is.
A local drivetrain shop I tried also gave up after a few months of attempting to balance.
If anyone runs into issues with these driveshafts I would recommend finding a good used shaft in one piece.
Andy Vrilikas can provide correct fixturing to your driveshaft shop. B & T elected to be difficult...
A link to Andy's new video on fixturing incorporating hole pattern for LS400 driveshaft.... https://youtu.be/RoTDms-_UBY
Huh, that was ironically posted today. Good stuff, seems like a step in the right direction.
What I dont understand is Andy says not to use the rubber guibos. Also, the video you posted shows the driveshaft spinning at ~2000 RPM, apparantly balanced, also with no rubber guibos. So what do you do with the three bolts that are apparantly "balancing bolts" that connect the guibo to the driveshaft?
Install them in whatever configuration? Order the same bolts that are used on the trans/diff flange so they all weigh the same? This is the one part I don't understand as I would like to be able to relay the proper info to the local shop. I told him the shaft needed to be balanced with both guibos attached as one whole assembly and that doesn't appear to be the case.....
Huh, that was ironically posted today. Good stuff, seems like a step in the right direction.
What I dont understand is Andy says not to use the rubber guibos. Also, the video you posted shows the driveshaft spinning at ~2000 RPM, apparantly balanced, also with no rubber guibos. So what do you do with the three bolts that are apparantly "balancing bolts" that connect the guibo to the driveshaft?
Install them in whatever configuration? Order the same bolts that are used on the trans/diff flange so they all weigh the same? This is the one part I don't understand as I would like to be able to relay the proper info to the local shop. I told him the shaft needed to be balanced with both guibos attached as one whole assembly and that doesn't appear to be the case.....
Unsure if 1990-1994 North American model year LS400 use balancing bolts.
North American model year 1995-1997 LS400 Shop Manual discusses balancing bolts...if used, number are stamped on heads..
North American model year1998-2000 LS400 shop manual does not discuss balancing bolts...not does the dealer parts list.
As to balancing, Toyota probably employs some fairly sophisticated equipment.
Perhaps someone can expand on exactly how it is done...
On earlier models perhaps the guibos are balanced with the drive shaft?
Toyota support was incredibly poor on this one, so had to make my way and took it as far as I could.with resources uncovered.
A bit disconcerting to learn the attitude B & T has taken.
Someone said along the way that quitters never win and winners never quit.
Unsure if 1990-1994 North American model year LS400 use balancing bolts.
North American model year 1995-1997 LS400 Shop Manual discusses balancing bolts...if used, number are stamped on heads..
North American model year1998-2000 LS400 shop manual does not discuss balancing bolts...not does the dealer parts list.
As to balancing, Toyota probably employs some fairly sophisticated equipment.
Perhaps someone can expand on exactly how it is done...
On earlier models perhaps the guibos are balanced with the drive shaft?
Toyota support was incredibly poor on this one, so had to make my way and took it as far as I could.with resources uncovered.
A bit disconcerting to learn the attitude B & T has taken.
Someone said along the way that quitters never win and winners never quit.
The shop manual for 1994 states not to remove the bolts attaching the shaft to the guibo and if the guibos are damaged to replace the whole DS assembly. According to the dealer parts diagram there are not different weighted bolts available for purchase.
I took the time to weigh the bolts and all 12 weighed 67 grams. So with that info I can safely assume they were not balanced with the guibos attached from the factory. Possibly one reason my local guy could not get it to balance, since I told him it has to be balanced with guibos attached due to the balancing bolts...
The manual also states the companion flanges on each end are to be 180 degress opposed to each other. IIRC that is technically "out of phase". From your video it seems the flanges for the 98-00 are aligned "in phase" at each 120 degree bolt hole on either end. Other pictures of used 98-00 driveshafts confirm this. Would be nice if toyota could give us more details on why there are such subtle differences between the model years.
As for B&T, he was not interested in taking on another one. He did recommend someone that can make a new shaft from end to end but made it seem like balancing the original would take months to achieve even with proper fixturing... oh well.
Anyways, this info reveals there is hope in finding a solution.
08-31-20, 10:03 PM
Driveshaft assembly guibo differs from separately purchased guibo
