Need Help - ‘98 Car Battery Drain, Intermittent Remote Key & Windshield Wiper Problem
08-16-22, 09:47 PM
#1
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
Need Help - ‘98 Car Battery Drain, Intermittent Remote Key & Windshield Wiper Problem
I have a 1998 Lexus LS400 that has low mileage (about 80,000) on it. It started having some issues in the last couple of years:
- Battery Drain: Two batteries were drained while left connected overnight.
- I used to have a burned tail lamp bulb which was recently replaced and the corresponding dashboard alert “tail lamp failure” went away. I’m not sure whether the burned tail lamp could cause the quick battery drain.
- I currently have two alerts on the dashboard: a) low washer fluid and b) brake wear. I know the brake wear is true but the low washer fluid is not true. Maybe the washer fluid sensor is bad.
- Intermittent remote key problem: Since the second battery drained overnight, I have been disconnecting the negative on the battery each time after I used the car. Every time after I reconnect the battery before going out, the remote key initially works fine but fails to work after I drive the car for a short trip.
- Intermittent windshield wiper problem: Similar to the remote key, each time when I reconnect the battery, the windshield wiper works fine, but it fails to work seemingly at the same time when the remote key stops working. However, it doesn’t fail completely. When it fails, it still works at the highest speed but all other settings fail to work.
- My latest test on the remote key and windshield wiper issues was to turn the headlight switch to OFF position and it seems both the remote key and the windshield wiper lasted a little longer without problems but the issues eventually all came back.
- What might have caused the battery drain?
- What might be causing the remote key to fail intermittently?
- What might be causing the windshield wiper to fail (partially) intermittently?
- Are any of the issues interrelated somehow?
- How should I go about diagnosing the causes for these issues?
08-16-22, 11:47 PM
#2
Intermittent sporadic electrical issues across a wide variety of seemingly unconnected systems. I'm suspicious of ECU problems. While rare, your 98 is still vulnerable.
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-...capacitor.html
However, subsystem problems combined with no reports of engine issues combined with it being a 98 indicate that the ECU, while possible, is unlikely. More testing should be done before going that route.
Your solution to the battery drain problem is to disconnect the battery every night. This, or the drain itself, may be causing stability issues of various electrical subsystems, potentially even the ECU.
Suggest diagnosing the battery drain issue first to stabilize the electrical system. Get a multimeter and run a parasitic drain test. Find out where the power is going.
Interior fuse box location. Driver side, above the foot rest. Look waaaay up. It's above the kickpanel carpet and has a black cover over the box. The cover has a diagram of which fuse does what.
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-...capacitor.html
However, subsystem problems combined with no reports of engine issues combined with it being a 98 indicate that the ECU, while possible, is unlikely. More testing should be done before going that route.
Your solution to the battery drain problem is to disconnect the battery every night. This, or the drain itself, may be causing stability issues of various electrical subsystems, potentially even the ECU.
Suggest diagnosing the battery drain issue first to stabilize the electrical system. Get a multimeter and run a parasitic drain test. Find out where the power is going.
Interior fuse box location. Driver side, above the foot rest. Look waaaay up. It's above the kickpanel carpet and has a black cover over the box. The cover has a diagram of which fuse does what.
Last edited by 400fanboy; 08-16-22 at 11:54 PM.
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SteveGXLS (08-18-22)
08-17-22, 09:03 AM
#3
Three methods of determining parasitic draw and which method is the best. Long video but worth the time.
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SteveGXLS (08-18-22)
08-17-22, 11:34 PM
#4
My Ls400 used to drain the battery pretty often, I would have to take it to AutoZone once a week and charge it overnight (so pretty bad). I replaced the alternator and I haven't had to recharge it since. It has a lot of electronic features (many of which can have a parasitic drain) and if the alternator isn't working correctly just starting the car can drain the battery a lot because it isn't recharging while the engine is running. Not 100% but if all else fails it's worth a try and isn't too difficult to do yourself.
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SteveGXLS (08-18-22)
09-20-22, 11:01 AM
#5
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
Intermittent sporadic electrical issues across a wide variety of seemingly unconnected systems. I'm suspicious of ECU problems. While rare, your 98 is still vulnerable.
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-...capacitor.html
However, subsystem problems combined with no reports of engine issues combined with it being a 98 indicate that the ECU, while possible, is unlikely. More testing should be done before going that route.
Your solution to the battery drain problem is to disconnect the battery every night. This, or the drain itself, may be causing stability issues of various electrical subsystems, potentially even the ECU.
Suggest diagnosing the battery drain issue first to stabilize the electrical system. Get a multimeter and run a parasitic drain test. Find out where the power is going.
Interior fuse box location. Driver side, above the foot rest. Look waaaay up. It's above the kickpanel carpet and has a black cover over the box. The cover has a diagram of which fuse does what.
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-...capacitor.html
However, subsystem problems combined with no reports of engine issues combined with it being a 98 indicate that the ECU, while possible, is unlikely. More testing should be done before going that route.
Your solution to the battery drain problem is to disconnect the battery every night. This, or the drain itself, may be causing stability issues of various electrical subsystems, potentially even the ECU.
Suggest diagnosing the battery drain issue first to stabilize the electrical system. Get a multimeter and run a parasitic drain test. Find out where the power is going.
Interior fuse box location. Driver side, above the foot rest. Look waaaay up. It's above the kickpanel carpet and has a black cover over the box. The cover has a diagram of which fuse does what.
Thank you for your suggestions! Sorry for the delay getting back since I was too busy to work on this issue. I was finally able to do a parasitic test with the vehicle a couple of days ago but surprisingly the current draw was only at 0.020 - 0.025 amps and it was fairly stable. So now I can't confidently say that the dead batteries I had were due to a parasitic drain any more. I'm not sure how to proceed at this point. Any additional suggestions would be appreciated!
09-20-22, 11:04 AM
#6
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
Three methods of determining parasitic draw and which method is the best. Long video but worth the time.
https://youtu.be/6xFo_oHFF48
https://youtu.be/6xFo_oHFF48
Thanks for your reply. I watched this video and a few others. Very helpful for me in doing a parasitic draw test. Please see my reply to @400fanboy above. My test shows that there's probably no parasitic draw and I'm not sure what my next step should be...
09-20-22, 11:07 AM
#7
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
My Ls400 used to drain the battery pretty often, I would have to take it to AutoZone once a week and charge it overnight (so pretty bad). I replaced the alternator and I haven't had to recharge it since. It has a lot of electronic features (many of which can have a parasitic drain) and if the alternator isn't working correctly just starting the car can drain the battery a lot because it isn't recharging while the engine is running. Not 100% but if all else fails it's worth a try and isn't too difficult to do yourself.
Thanks for your reply. I did a parasitic test and it shows that car doesn't seem to have a parasitic draw so I'm not sure how to proceed at this point...
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09-20-22, 11:14 AM
#8
I mean it's just standard electrical tests from this point. Need to establish causality right? I don't want to say just park the car for a month and repair the ECU. Might not be the problem.
Is the battery able to provide power and healthy? Is the alternator\serpentine belt providing enough power?
But are you still killing batteries overnight?
BTW fully discharging a battery to actually zero is enough to kill an otherwise healthy car battery. Unlikely, but possible it's been damaged from the previous two events.
All of your problems sound like they have started after the 2nd time the battery was fully drained overnight and you pull the main power lead overnight. We gotta solve that before we can do anything else.
Is the battery able to provide power and healthy? Is the alternator\serpentine belt providing enough power?
but surprisingly the current draw was only at 0.020 - 0.025 amps and it was fairly stable. So now I can't confidently say that the dead batteries I had were due to a parasitic drain any more.
But are you still killing batteries overnight?
BTW fully discharging a battery to actually zero is enough to kill an otherwise healthy car battery. Unlikely, but possible it's been damaged from the previous two events.
All of your problems sound like they have started after the 2nd time the battery was fully drained overnight and you pull the main power lead overnight. We gotta solve that before we can do anything else.
09-20-22, 11:31 AM
#9
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
I mean it's just standard electrical tests from this point. Need to establish causality right? I don't want to say just park the car for a month and repair the ECU. Might not be the problem.
Is the battery able to provide power and healthy? Is the alternator\serpentine belt providing enough power?
But are you still killing batteries overnight?
BTW fully discharging a battery to actually zero is enough to kill an otherwise healthy car battery. Unlikely, but possible it's been damaged from the previous two events.
All of your problems sound like they have started after the 2nd time the battery was fully drained overnight and you pull the main power lead overnight. We gotta solve that before we can do anything else.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YC--MLNIbik
Is the battery able to provide power and healthy? Is the alternator\serpentine belt providing enough power?
But are you still killing batteries overnight?
BTW fully discharging a battery to actually zero is enough to kill an otherwise healthy car battery. Unlikely, but possible it's been damaged from the previous two events.
All of your problems sound like they have started after the 2nd time the battery was fully drained overnight and you pull the main power lead overnight. We gotta solve that before we can do anything else.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YC--MLNIbik
Is the battery able to provide power and healthy? Is the alternator\serpentine belt providing enough power? - I would answer Yes to both questions.
But are you still killing batteries overnight? - Even though the parasitic test shows a low drainage that's normal according to some videos I watched (<50ma), I'm still not comfortable to leave the battery connected so I have been disconnecting the battery after each trip. Perhaps I should just bite the bullet and leave the battery connected overnight to see what happens?
09-20-22, 04:36 PM
#10
I mean unless someone else jumps in here with a magic bullet or maybe I'm an idiot and going about this the wrong way.
Yes your drain you measured appears to be normal. If that actually is the drain rate, then there should be no need to disconnect the battery. It should easily last for weeks.
If you come out tomorrow and find the car is dead, then either your battery is not healthy or your parasitic draw test was incorrect. You would then re-run the parasitic draw test... and if that tests fine, then replace the battery. If there actually is a drain, you need to go fuse by fuse to determine what is causing the drain.
If the car is still charged tomorrow, continue to drive and diagnose problems. Do the electrical gremlins go away now that you aren't disconnecting the battery all the time?
And now we have more information. Though it's still not solved the issue in the first place - something is probably broken which caused you to make this thread in the first place. So I think your car will probably die on you at some point trying to test this. Stuff like this doesn't magically fix itself.
How old is your battery? How many volts did it test to? I'm sorry I keep honing in on this because it's what I suspect. It could be your ECU, but normally that presents in engine problems, transmission problems, running rough, not starting or other weird intermittent behavior issues. Not simple electrical stuff like this like windshield wipers or key fobs. Another issue could be a problem with a fuse or wiring getting chewed on by a rodent - though that is pretty unlikely and would hard-short and kill the whole system right?
& we're also approaching the limits of my knowledge. Perhaps some other people have better advice to offer. Best of luck.
Yes your drain you measured appears to be normal. If that actually is the drain rate, then there should be no need to disconnect the battery. It should easily last for weeks.
If you come out tomorrow and find the car is dead, then either your battery is not healthy or your parasitic draw test was incorrect. You would then re-run the parasitic draw test... and if that tests fine, then replace the battery. If there actually is a drain, you need to go fuse by fuse to determine what is causing the drain.
If the car is still charged tomorrow, continue to drive and diagnose problems. Do the electrical gremlins go away now that you aren't disconnecting the battery all the time?
And now we have more information. Though it's still not solved the issue in the first place - something is probably broken which caused you to make this thread in the first place. So I think your car will probably die on you at some point trying to test this. Stuff like this doesn't magically fix itself.
How old is your battery? How many volts did it test to? I'm sorry I keep honing in on this because it's what I suspect. It could be your ECU, but normally that presents in engine problems, transmission problems, running rough, not starting or other weird intermittent behavior issues. Not simple electrical stuff like this like windshield wipers or key fobs. Another issue could be a problem with a fuse or wiring getting chewed on by a rodent - though that is pretty unlikely and would hard-short and kill the whole system right?
& we're also approaching the limits of my knowledge. Perhaps some other people have better advice to offer. Best of luck.
Last edited by 400fanboy; 09-20-22 at 04:47 PM.
09-20-22, 05:34 PM
#11
What tests for the alternator have been done? Is the battery voltage somewhere around 14 Volts when the car is idling?
If the battery voltage is less than 13 Volts, it may not trigger the charging warning light, but the alternator won't be charging the battery enough to keep it alive.
If the battery voltage is less than 13 Volts, it may not trigger the charging warning light, but the alternator won't be charging the battery enough to keep it alive.
09-20-22, 07:57 PM
#12
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
I mean unless someone else jumps in here with a magic bullet or maybe I'm an idiot and going about this the wrong way.
Yes your drain you measured appears to be normal. If that actually is the drain rate, then there should be no need to disconnect the battery. It should easily last for weeks.
If you come out tomorrow and find the car is dead, then either your battery is not healthy or your parasitic draw test was incorrect. You would then re-run the parasitic draw test... and if that tests fine, then replace the battery. If there actually is a drain, you need to go fuse by fuse to determine what is causing the drain.
If the car is still charged tomorrow, continue to drive and diagnose problems. Do the electrical gremlins go away now that you aren't disconnecting the battery all the time?
And now we have more information. Though it's still not solved the issue in the first place - something is probably broken which caused you to make this thread in the first place. So I think your car will probably die on you at some point trying to test this. Stuff like this doesn't magically fix itself.
How old is your battery? How many volts did it test to? I'm sorry I keep honing in on this because it's what I suspect. It could be your ECU, but normally that presents in engine problems, transmission problems, running rough, not starting or other weird intermittent behavior issues. Not simple electrical stuff like this like windshield wipers or key fobs. Another issue could be a problem with a fuse or wiring getting chewed on by a rodent - though that is pretty unlikely and would hard-short and kill the whole system right?
& we're also approaching the limits of my knowledge. Perhaps some other people have better advice to offer. Best of luck.
Yes your drain you measured appears to be normal. If that actually is the drain rate, then there should be no need to disconnect the battery. It should easily last for weeks.
If you come out tomorrow and find the car is dead, then either your battery is not healthy or your parasitic draw test was incorrect. You would then re-run the parasitic draw test... and if that tests fine, then replace the battery. If there actually is a drain, you need to go fuse by fuse to determine what is causing the drain.
If the car is still charged tomorrow, continue to drive and diagnose problems. Do the electrical gremlins go away now that you aren't disconnecting the battery all the time?
And now we have more information. Though it's still not solved the issue in the first place - something is probably broken which caused you to make this thread in the first place. So I think your car will probably die on you at some point trying to test this. Stuff like this doesn't magically fix itself.
How old is your battery? How many volts did it test to? I'm sorry I keep honing in on this because it's what I suspect. It could be your ECU, but normally that presents in engine problems, transmission problems, running rough, not starting or other weird intermittent behavior issues. Not simple electrical stuff like this like windshield wipers or key fobs. Another issue could be a problem with a fuse or wiring getting chewed on by a rodent - though that is pretty unlikely and would hard-short and kill the whole system right?
& we're also approaching the limits of my knowledge. Perhaps some other people have better advice to offer. Best of luck.
I agree with your thought process. I think I want to do the parasitic draw test one more time to make sure my test was valid before leaving the battery connected overnight. The battery was replaced in July of 2021 so it is only a little more than one year old. I'll test the voltages and report back.
09-20-22, 08:00 PM
#13
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
What tests for the alternator have been done? Is the battery voltage somewhere around 14 Volts when the car is idling?
If the battery voltage is less than 13 Volts, it may not trigger the charging warning light, but the alternator won't be charging the battery enough to keep it alive.
If the battery voltage is less than 13 Volts, it may not trigger the charging warning light, but the alternator won't be charging the battery enough to keep it alive.
09-20-22, 08:25 PM
#14
I killed a 2-year old battery by leaving my door slightly ajar for 48hr. It's possible.
The video I posted above at 16:00 starts talking about testing alternators and parasitic draw. That's not the only method nor the only video - plenty of information about how to perform these tasks on Youtube with instructions of how to accomplish it.
The video I posted above at 16:00 starts talking about testing alternators and parasitic draw. That's not the only method nor the only video - plenty of information about how to perform these tasks on Youtube with instructions of how to accomplish it.
09-22-22, 08:40 PM
#15
Driver School Candidate
Thread Starter
I mean unless someone else jumps in here with a magic bullet or maybe I'm an idiot and going about this the wrong way.
Yes your drain you measured appears to be normal. If that actually is the drain rate, then there should be no need to disconnect the battery. It should easily last for weeks.
If you come out tomorrow and find the car is dead, then either your battery is not healthy or your parasitic draw test was incorrect. You would then re-run the parasitic draw test... and if that tests fine, then replace the battery. If there actually is a drain, you need to go fuse by fuse to determine what is causing the drain.
If the car is still charged tomorrow, continue to drive and diagnose problems. Do the electrical gremlins go away now that you aren't disconnecting the battery all the time?
And now we have more information. Though it's still not solved the issue in the first place - something is probably broken which caused you to make this thread in the first place. So I think your car will probably die on you at some point trying to test this. Stuff like this doesn't magically fix itself.
How old is your battery? How many volts did it test to? I'm sorry I keep honing in on this because it's what I suspect. It could be your ECU, but normally that presents in engine problems, transmission problems, running rough, not starting or other weird intermittent behavior issues. Not simple electrical stuff like this like windshield wipers or key fobs. Another issue could be a problem with a fuse or wiring getting chewed on by a rodent - though that is pretty unlikely and would hard-short and kill the whole system right?
& we're also approaching the limits of my knowledge. Perhaps some other people have better advice to offer. Best of luck.
Yes your drain you measured appears to be normal. If that actually is the drain rate, then there should be no need to disconnect the battery. It should easily last for weeks.
If you come out tomorrow and find the car is dead, then either your battery is not healthy or your parasitic draw test was incorrect. You would then re-run the parasitic draw test... and if that tests fine, then replace the battery. If there actually is a drain, you need to go fuse by fuse to determine what is causing the drain.
If the car is still charged tomorrow, continue to drive and diagnose problems. Do the electrical gremlins go away now that you aren't disconnecting the battery all the time?
And now we have more information. Though it's still not solved the issue in the first place - something is probably broken which caused you to make this thread in the first place. So I think your car will probably die on you at some point trying to test this. Stuff like this doesn't magically fix itself.
How old is your battery? How many volts did it test to? I'm sorry I keep honing in on this because it's what I suspect. It could be your ECU, but normally that presents in engine problems, transmission problems, running rough, not starting or other weird intermittent behavior issues. Not simple electrical stuff like this like windshield wipers or key fobs. Another issue could be a problem with a fuse or wiring getting chewed on by a rodent - though that is pretty unlikely and would hard-short and kill the whole system right?
& we're also approaching the limits of my knowledge. Perhaps some other people have better advice to offer. Best of luck.
1. Before I started the car, the voltage of the battery was at 12.76v.
2. I then started the car and tested the voltage of the battery. It was at 14.96v.
3. I then noticed the voltage was going down steadily so I kept the multimeter on it. It took probably between 5 - 10 minutes for the voltage to go down to 12.44v.
4. At this point, I seemed to hear the alternator kicking in. The voltage of the battery went steadily back up to 13.60v and it stayed there.
5. I shut down the car but found the remote key not working anymore as it occurred before.
It seems both my battery and my alternator are good. I highly suspect the problem is an electrical issue related to the security receiver unit in the car but I'm not sure how to proceed to diagnose it. I believe it is located behind the driver side panel inside the trunk. Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!