View Poll Results: Which one?
2003 745
29
16.02%
2004 LS 430
152
83.98%
Voters: 181. You may not vote on this poll
2003 745 or 04 Lexusls43o
07-12-07, 11:50 AM
#62
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There is only one thing I disagree with in this entire thread. The costly repair bills. Granted the LS is an awesome car that has infrequent if not nonexistant repairs. Buuut I just had a DOOR LOCK ACTUATOR go out on my LS430 UL and it was to the tune of $700 dollars to fix. That was absolutely ridiculous!!!! I couldnt beleive it, I was almost disappointed with Lexus for the $593 dollar part that was required to fix it. This is an 85 dollar part on any domestic car or Toyota. And before anyone thinks I got ripped off I did my research and called 4 Lexus dealerships to find out pricing on the part. Point is dont think you are completely immune to ridiculous repair bills just because it isnt European.
07-12-07, 01:37 PM
#63
There is only one thing I disagree with in this entire thread. The costly repair bills. Granted the LS is an awesome car that has infrequent if not nonexistant repairs. Buuut I just had a DOOR LOCK ACTUATOR go out on my LS430 UL and it was to the tune of $700 dollars to fix. That was absolutely ridiculous!!!! I couldnt beleive it, I was almost disappointed with Lexus for the $593 dollar part that was required to fix it. This is an 85 dollar part on any domestic car or Toyota. And before anyone thinks I got ripped off I did my research and called 4 Lexus dealerships to find out pricing on the part. Point is dont think you are completely immune to ridiculous repair bills just because it isnt European.
This is how the dealer afford to give you free java, bagles and loaner car.
07-13-07, 04:30 AM
#64
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bb430,
I did not even do the work at the dealer and it was 700 dollars. The dealer wanted 1k to fix the door lock. Also they wanted 1,100 for the 60k service which i performed at 55k miles. I got it done for 300 dollars. I get all my work done at LEXAUTO in Miami. They are a very honest, knowledgeable,and reputable shop and they charge extremely fair for their time.
I did not even do the work at the dealer and it was 700 dollars. The dealer wanted 1k to fix the door lock. Also they wanted 1,100 for the 60k service which i performed at 55k miles. I got it done for 300 dollars. I get all my work done at LEXAUTO in Miami. They are a very honest, knowledgeable,and reputable shop and they charge extremely fair for their time.
10-31-07, 12:06 AM
#69
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i had an 02 745i as much as it was fun to drive it was a handful of problem i was taking it to bmw one month it had a lot of software problem and other thing that went wrong i don't think i would ever buy a bmw agian.
05-26-08, 07:11 AM
#70
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I just bought an LS430 to go along with my LS400 that has been almost trouble free for many years, This is to replace a BMW that was nothing but headaches! The handling in BMW's is awesome, they have unique front suspension layouts that are more firmly tuned as well as firmer bushings in the rear too, this adds up to a lightly less refined ride but the responsiveness is second to none! I just can't live with all the BMW's problems. Anyone want a slightly used V-12 750IL?
05-27-08, 03:30 AM
#72
I had both and here's my 2 cents...
I cast my vote for the LS430 as better "ALL AROUND" car as luxury sedan, as well as something of a daily use car.
However, I have owned a 2001 "big 7" prior to this LS430, and I must say, I do miss it often as well. For starters, the BMW felt much more docile and defying of it's weight driving around in town as well as on Willow Springs Raceway where I occasionally go to drive my other contraptions. What I mean by this is BMW does feel so much more predictable when being tossed about. This is not to say the LS is slower, it is not. In actuality, given same tires, LS is faster. But the amount of work and general precision you get from a BMW, to post the same lap time, you'd have a relaxed time in the 745 than a LS. But, aside from this driver input and feel department, LS430 can match almost all performance specs to where differences are negligible.
LS430 offers a very long list of "useful" features. Things like shift-matic in very native and intuitive side shift lever with +/- is much better than awkward BMW paddle that needs a long list of programming parameters to figure out exactly how it will go in and out of it's gears. Both have very elaborate HVAC systems but Toyota systems work faster, and is smarter for all the areas that count. Even the seats get warmer and colder (yes LS430 can COOL your seat too) faster and more comfortably.
If you OPT for the "Li" version BMW, the rear seat would be MUCH more roomy than the LS, but in all reality I'm the guy in front with the wheel...but... I do miss the "WOW! IT'S SO ROOMY BACK HERE" comment I used to have in the BIG SEVEN.
Warning about the 745Li though... Don't throw anything you need while driving into the back seat. Jackets, drinks, etc.. Because that extra 4" in floor makes it far enough you need to pull over and get out of the car and open rear doors to get to it... Can't just reach back like in most 4 doors.
745Li's cabin is somehow just as silent in the front seats... however, in the rear seat area, there's much more noise, coming from rear suspnsion and drivetrain... Perhaps not as much insulation? Some like that, others prefer vault-dead silence of the LS back seats. (especially for folks planning a rear entertainment system... LS 430 is THE choice here)
For guys with DUB sized wheel fetish (20's), the BMW does fit larger wheels easier with more dynamic clearance (that is lack of need to roll, hammer etc to clear them in the wells at dropped heights) and suspension does not suffer much change in feel or comfort. That's the inherent goodness of the BMW, trailing arms and struts, done to perfection.
ON the LS430, going to lower profile tires makes the double wishbone suspension motions more apparent, and tracking on uneven roads are pronounced much more. And, dead silent cabin of the LS becomes more obviously compromised with tire noise than in the BMW which was noisier in there to begin with.
So those are some of the major Pro and Cons…that I would say worth mentioning.
Rest are a matter of personal tastes and both matchup well in every area if one feels and smells differently… visually, BMW has advantage of classier interior worthy of a $80K car. LS430, is opulent and loaded, but you still see traces of Camry and Corolla heritage in there if you look around. Namely more use of plastics where German competitors would trim with chrome or aluminum looking pieces.
I got over that part though, about the plastic… Since the sun-chasing AC vents and rain sensing wipers, headlights that look left and right, and a million other features that WORK reliably…where in the BMW I’d be worried to have because they stop working after a while. BMW isn't as terribly unreliable as most people claim... Just that they do have issues from time to time. Mostly small things that stop working that can be fixed with a day trip to the dealer. But that's a Eurpean car-life style. Go visit a service bay few times a year, talk to "zem" in German. Presitge? for some, yea...
745Li's don't blow up like the 1st and 2d gen 730's did... They just fail at all the places where they tried to be Mercedes or Toyota. But they sure know how to be on top of what BMW does do best. Also, just as BadBronco says above, LEXUS is expensive to repair (when things does fall apart or you break it yourself). In that sense, its no Corolla here.
LS430 = it just works... no compromise.
BMW = feels good, better in many areas but you do have to compromise.
However, I have owned a 2001 "big 7" prior to this LS430, and I must say, I do miss it often as well. For starters, the BMW felt much more docile and defying of it's weight driving around in town as well as on Willow Springs Raceway where I occasionally go to drive my other contraptions. What I mean by this is BMW does feel so much more predictable when being tossed about. This is not to say the LS is slower, it is not. In actuality, given same tires, LS is faster. But the amount of work and general precision you get from a BMW, to post the same lap time, you'd have a relaxed time in the 745 than a LS. But, aside from this driver input and feel department, LS430 can match almost all performance specs to where differences are negligible.
LS430 offers a very long list of "useful" features. Things like shift-matic in very native and intuitive side shift lever with +/- is much better than awkward BMW paddle that needs a long list of programming parameters to figure out exactly how it will go in and out of it's gears. Both have very elaborate HVAC systems but Toyota systems work faster, and is smarter for all the areas that count. Even the seats get warmer and colder (yes LS430 can COOL your seat too) faster and more comfortably.
If you OPT for the "Li" version BMW, the rear seat would be MUCH more roomy than the LS, but in all reality I'm the guy in front with the wheel...but... I do miss the "WOW! IT'S SO ROOMY BACK HERE" comment I used to have in the BIG SEVEN.
Warning about the 745Li though... Don't throw anything you need while driving into the back seat. Jackets, drinks, etc.. Because that extra 4" in floor makes it far enough you need to pull over and get out of the car and open rear doors to get to it... Can't just reach back like in most 4 doors.
745Li's cabin is somehow just as silent in the front seats... however, in the rear seat area, there's much more noise, coming from rear suspnsion and drivetrain... Perhaps not as much insulation? Some like that, others prefer vault-dead silence of the LS back seats. (especially for folks planning a rear entertainment system... LS 430 is THE choice here)
For guys with DUB sized wheel fetish (20's), the BMW does fit larger wheels easier with more dynamic clearance (that is lack of need to roll, hammer etc to clear them in the wells at dropped heights) and suspension does not suffer much change in feel or comfort. That's the inherent goodness of the BMW, trailing arms and struts, done to perfection.
ON the LS430, going to lower profile tires makes the double wishbone suspension motions more apparent, and tracking on uneven roads are pronounced much more. And, dead silent cabin of the LS becomes more obviously compromised with tire noise than in the BMW which was noisier in there to begin with.
So those are some of the major Pro and Cons…that I would say worth mentioning.
Rest are a matter of personal tastes and both matchup well in every area if one feels and smells differently… visually, BMW has advantage of classier interior worthy of a $80K car. LS430, is opulent and loaded, but you still see traces of Camry and Corolla heritage in there if you look around. Namely more use of plastics where German competitors would trim with chrome or aluminum looking pieces.
I got over that part though, about the plastic… Since the sun-chasing AC vents and rain sensing wipers, headlights that look left and right, and a million other features that WORK reliably…where in the BMW I’d be worried to have because they stop working after a while. BMW isn't as terribly unreliable as most people claim... Just that they do have issues from time to time. Mostly small things that stop working that can be fixed with a day trip to the dealer. But that's a Eurpean car-life style. Go visit a service bay few times a year, talk to "zem" in German. Presitge? for some, yea...
745Li's don't blow up like the 1st and 2d gen 730's did... They just fail at all the places where they tried to be Mercedes or Toyota. But they sure know how to be on top of what BMW does do best. Also, just as BadBronco says above, LEXUS is expensive to repair (when things does fall apart or you break it yourself). In that sense, its no Corolla here.
LS430 = it just works... no compromise.
BMW = feels good, better in many areas but you do have to compromise.
Last edited by motohide; 05-27-08 at 03:45 AM.
05-30-08, 11:27 PM
#73
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I was recently faced with this choice as well (LS430 vs. 750Li vs. S600) and obviously I've made my choice. For down-right comfort, NOTHING remotly compared to the LS. The wood in the BMW was horrible and the seats were almost UNcomfortable. iDrive doesn't really bother me at all (esp. since you can actually USE it while moving). I never understood sports seating in an ultra-luxury sedan though... c'mon. As far as driving goes, the BMW is a little nicer, but as far as overall quality, comfort, and aesthetics, the Lexus wins by far.
I'd give the LS a 9.2/10 and the BMW a 7.8/10
I'd give the LS a 9.2/10 and the BMW a 7.8/10
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