ktiger

Did any of you drive the 7 series before buying your LS? I am in a serious debate with myself on which to buy. After driving both (2002 LS ultra / 2003 745Li) I have come to several conclusions.

1. The 745 is an awesome driving machine
2. The interior of the LS is beautiful
3. I actually perfer the sporty look of the 745, I'm just wondering if it's the 19" wheels. Maybe if you put those wheels on the LS that may help it look sportier.

My wife has an LX 470 so I know all about the reliability of a Lexus but the 02 & 03 745's come with a 100,000 mile factory warrenty. I just want to know the thoughts of anyone that considered both. Thanks.

sha4000

iTrader: (1)

i drove an ls430 at the lexus taste of luxury and i was really impressed. im with you though i think the 7 has a sport look which of course is what bmw is all about sports/handling. i guess the knock on bmw is the reliability issue but i wouldnt know b/c ive never owned one. but right now id take the 7 over the 430 at least until i see what the 07430 looks like

aerodragon

745 was one of the cars that I test drove when deciding on what to purchase few months ago. It drives smoothly and it looks great. One thing I am not a big fan of is the complexity of the controller (not too intuitive). In addition, I like LS' leather feel (smoother) & the wood trim much better than that of the 745.

Recently, I've read that Bimmer's reliability is getting better. Now it comes down to the fact that would you be willing to go to your dealership more frequently in case you get a non-reliable 745 (I know, eventhough everything is covered under warranty). I am just referring to the trip, time, etc. I am not saying all 745 is non-reliable, but the chances of getting a reliable one is probably less than that of LS430.

ktiger

The I-drive doesn't bother me, one of my hobbies is fixing computers but you are right about the interior feel, fit and finish. The Lexus blows the bimmer away. Yet I'm reading that the problems are with the electronics and not mechanical.

You are correct about being over burden with trips to the dealership. As a matter of fact my wife's LX was just in the shop for a key switch replacement. The entire shaft broke.

We have to travel almost two hours to get to the nearest Lexus dealership but only 15 minutes to the BMW dealership. I guess the trips this week kind of got to me. I'm just wondering why Lexus doesn't open more dealerships.

sha4000

iTrader: (1)

this is a good point that would make me lean towards the lexus also

Mandingo

After test driving both I found the 745i is a little faster and a more dynamic drive than the LS430 although choosing Euro tuned suspension helps. The exterior styling of the 7 takes some getting used to but grows on you.

However 95% of the time I am driving "normally" and that means I want a luxurious and comfortable interior and that's where Lexus blows BMW away. BMW interiors are just so uninspiring.

The other thing is the i-drive - people get used to it after a while but the absence of a touch screen makes everything extremley laborious - trying to enter an address by typing out one letter at a time with the i-drive **** is a disaster versus the on screen keyboard of the LS.

Reliability has been poor on 7 series but has been improving of late.

I admire the 7 for what it does well but I have absolutely no regrets about my choice.

Paying an extra 15 grand for the 7 series would have stung too ...

encore888

I think Consumer Reports gave the strongest critique of the 7-series yet, if you look at the CR view of the 7-series, they go so far as to say 'it fails as a luxury sedan' mostly due to the reliability and iDrive problems.

Having ridden inside the 7-series at the Taste of Luxury event, I think that the car's interior is servicable but nothing special. For BMW, I guess you buy the car for the engine/handling, and perhaps for the looks. The 7-series Banglization is interesting, at least. The revised 7-series for this year looks even better, IMO. But the interior of the LS 430 is just so much more sumptuous--although I think the BMW interior is larger. The looks on the outside are fine--the LS 430 is substantial and the current front faschia is quite dynamic. It's also powerful, and the smooth ride is wondrous. Plus the LS 430 convenience, and it being so intuitive, and so pampered inside...it's in another class by itself IMHO.

ktiger

Does the euro tuned suspension help that much? Have you ever driven your LS hard? No one in my area has one with the euro tuned suspension.

Also are the seats in the Ultra more comfortable?

lexusls430

The ultra package uses a lot better leather in the inside.

Mandingo

Yes, I think it does. I wouldn't say I have been rallying in it but I have driven it hard enough (with TCS switched off) that the VSC system had to cut in on several occasions

The LS430 is a big car - the time you appreciate the Euro Tuned Suspension (ETS) is mostly during rapid lane changes and sweeping curves - the car just remains very flat and confident throughout.

I think you sacrifice a little of the "LS430 magic carpet ride" for this but the ETS feels to me very BMW-like and is a lot of fun - switch to manual shifting, switch off the TCS and floor it.

I test drove both with and without and it was a worthwhile trade-off for me but others may disagree.

0-60 in 5.9s without handling to match is a waste IMHO.

ktiger

Thanks, Mandingo. That may be the answer that I need.

solarea100

Hey ktiger,

I've had a 2000 740 and a 2004 530. I drive about 25k per year. Without a doubt BMW is a great driving machine.

I gave up both and we now have the LX and LS. WHY YOU ASK!

It really depends on what you are looking for. BMW is having a great problem with service at their shops. This year, I was at the dealer almost everymonth for my 530. It took 2 weeks to get in with an appointment and 1 hour to drop it off and pick it up.

I wasted a great amount of time being at that dealer. In contrast, Lexus has treated myself and my wife extremely well. If you are looking for reliability, which I am, I'd recomend the Lexus. If you want the brand and driving experience, the BMW...but be prepared for problems and being at the shop.

FYI....I really liked the X-Drive.

Mandingo

Good point, I took that for granted. My BMW dealership experience (I had an X5 from BMW of Bellevue in Washington) was terrible - I dreaded going to the dealership (which I had to do too many times unfortunately). I was always made to feel like I was inconveniencing the service agents and they treated me like some anonymous "number".

The Lexus dealerships are great - polite, courteous and generally quick.

While I didn't actually have an issue, the 6-speed LS430 had a big recall for transmission and fuel tank last year. Lexus notified me, drove to my house at 8am and dropped off another Lexus loaner and took my car away. They then came back 3 days later at 8am to my house and delivered my upgraded car and drove the loaner away. Then they sent me $200 in gas cards "for my trouble".

Please Lexus, keep "troubling" me like this

The only way to compare the 2 cars is the TOTAL EXPERIENCE including value for money, driving feel, "name badge equity", performance, aesthetics, features, quality, comfort, ease of use, resale value and dealership.

Many people fail to look at this overall and my opinion is that it is often the *weakest link in the chain* that ruins the entire experience.

ktiger

Would you say that your experiences with the service was dealer specific? Did you try another dealer and received the same treatment?

BrickHead

I agree the 7 series looks more sporty and better on the outside. But if I remember correctly the 2004 consumer reports annual car issue stated that the 2003 BMW 7 series was one of the most unreliable cars from that year. The quality has improved for new BMW's but be cautious if you are looking at a 2003 7 series. Does a 2003 7 series cost about the same as a 2004 LS430? The 2004 LS has a more sporty look than the 2001-2003. Why not get the 2004 LS?