2KHarrier

Wow... God news/Bad news huh. This is a situation that I would not want anyone to have to deal with. I would have assumed that the dealer tech would be the authority on this and a solution found. It's a shame they're washing their hands of the problem, but it's nice they're comping the labor.

Johnhav430

This is going way back, to when my dad told me, "This is because you had to have a Volvo."

What I mean is, the only way I could get a Volvo, was to get a V6. This motor was a dud, made by Peugeot, Renault, and lastly, Volvo. PRV. They cost less, much less, than cars with SOHC 4 cyl. motors.

Anyway, the last place one would take a V6 to was the dealer. In most cases, THEY WOULDN'T EVEN WANT TO TOUCH IT. They know they a) have techs that were likely only in elementary school when the car was built (11 y.o.) b) have little chance of repairing them successfully I think the Lexus dealer here is hinting that it's beyond their capability to fix what's wrong. Nobody's going to be happy in the end if they move forward.

There was a little club of Volvo specialists from NY to ME, and I got to know more than half of them. I bit the bullet despite my dad's warnings, and put $900 into it. The car drove from 1990-1998 as a result. My point is in some cases, and this may be one, the indie knows far more than the dealer, and from experience. Meaning, the dealer doesn't work on cars when they reach a certain point, but indies do, day in, day out. imho an indie would be a better bet, just not the one who did the timing belt job in the first place. They're not honest, and they're not competent.

edit: Now try changing the plugs on this B27F motor (below). Also, it took 7 qts, I would always have to explain, and they would say, it's a diesel? Finally, I started DIY'ing, and I had a special Snap On adapter to open the drain plug, which was female (those darn French). This pic depicts exactly where the motor belongs, in a museum! But those who worked on them, had so many cheats that they actually liked them and said internally they were well built.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/V6_PRV...nginevolvo.jpg

nthach

QFT - while I do take my parent's car into the local dealer, my car(not an LS) goes to the local Toyota/Honda/Subaru indie for things I can't do like brake fluid flushes or anything that needs the TIS Techstream to properly do. I've convinced them to do the ATF on my parent's car, even though I could do it myself I don't have access to a lift to make things easier. My indie doesn't get too much Lexus clientle, they do get 50% of their business from Subaru because the 2 main dealers aren't that great.

I do see older Japanese cars going back to the dealer for service around here - I think Toyota and Honda make it a point to make most parts available for 10 years after the car was made(and longer, Toyota kind of embraced long model cycles while Honda does have a lifetime warranty on seatbelts), unlike Ford/GM/FCA that only keep barebones minimums for cars out of warranty. However, dealer service departments are flat-rate shops and a tech's goal there is to do the work in less time than the "book" time, that way they can get more cars in within a 8-10 work day. There are plenty of good techs out there - I know quite a few who worked at the local Honda dealer, but there's always a few bad apples or a bad dealer GM who's willing to play hardball over their union contracts or pay/safety to help the dealer's bottom line.

tallcaguy

Sorry to hear how this is going. It sounds like both sides are trying to solve the problem. It's good that your buddy is willing to pay for the dealer to work on the car. Does "recommending you take it back to your buddy" mean the dealer really won't do the work? Maybe they're worried about the probably expensive repairs? Some businesses have insurance for errors. Any chance your buddy has something like this? We all like these cars. It's hard to hear about someone botching repair work this badly.

02Legend

iTrader: (3)

Right now, I think the dealer is worried about how expensive it can or will get depending on the time they put in. I would hope my buddies shop has any and all insurance related to the industry. The shop has been around for years and get's a lot of customers, always busy.

tallcaguy

Is the dealer willing to give some kind of an estimate? You'd at least have a number to work with. LOL mirrors are 700-800 and LCA's are 1,000. I can't imagine what any real engine work would be! Whatever the price, your buddy is paying.

Johnhav430

LCA's for $1,000, your dealer is $400 cheaper than mine!

imho dealerships aren't normally doing open-ended work unless warranty (they have to), meaning usually x job takes 4.5 hours, tech does it in 2, and does another job. He wins, and the dealership wins. Customer pays what was agreed to. With this job, likely the tech would be under a lot of pressure by the foreman to bring it to a resolution and free up himself and the bay...just imagine the dealership already basically did a timing belt job, didn't really charge anything for it, and prefers the vehicle out, and they have the best tools, equipment, and supposedly techs...seems as if they're cutting their losses, and I totally believe that Lexus does not want unhappy customers, which is what they'd likely have if they kept working and charged for it. It's one of those, "it's me, not you" deals.....

02Legend

iTrader: (3)

That's where I think the dealer thought it was specifically valve related and originally told me that just to pull the passenger side apart to check valves would be just over $1200, and depending on how that resulted and if anything needed to be adjusted it would be just over $2400. Since they did this and only saw very small valve lash on two valves, made the adjustment and the noise is still present. It seems like they don't know where to start, as this would most likely have been the problem.

I agree, my car has been sitting taking up space and they work off of calculated times and jobs. What's makes it more interesting is I got a call from my buddy late last night and he said when he spoke with the advisor, he was told they know exactly what the problem is. I was very curious as to why they would say that to him and yet tell me that they are unsure and don't want to rack up a huge bill. This morning I called the dealer and spoke with the advisor that has been working my issue and told him what was said to me. He sounded completely shocked, and quickly responded with no sir and was very adamant that it was not said. "We don't know what the hell the problem is right now". And we don't want you to have your car here and the bill just compound (as I type this it seems like he was rude, he was not, very professional and polite).

At this time, I just don't know how this whole ordeal is going to progress. Anyone looking to buy a used 06 with 83K and recent timing belt job, lol?

tallcaguy

Go to the service manager. Ask what the problem is and what it will cost to fix. I can't believe a Lex dealer can't figure out what the problem is. These guys work on engines all the time.

I'm surprised the service advisor was willing to talk to your "buddy". Seems weird. My service advisor (for past LS) is great but he absolutely will not talk about any car I don't own. Fortunately there's Lex Drivers for on line info

02Legend

iTrader: (3)

I may call them again and ask for the manager on Monday, or just wait until I fly back on Friday and just talk with them face to face.

After their recommendation to take the car back to the original shop, I provided my advisor with my buddies name, number and business name and asked if they would get in contact with him, he did not hesitate at all. Now, I was told they would keep the car there if I wanted to. I also asked if I provide them with the name and details, can I have my buddy pick up the car.

I have been checking Lexus Drivers daily and have yet to see anything updated. Guessing it won't show up until the ticket is closed.

Johnhav430

It doesn't sound like you've gotten upset yet, and maybe it's because you're on the road so much and really can't get into it in person and it's a pita.. But if this happened to me, and I were sure, that's important, I were sure that the timing belt job f'd up my car, the shop that did the job has a few choices. Either fix it as their highest priority, or face DMV, BBB, Yelp, small claims., etc. When you say this guy is your buddy, not sure if that means he's a personal family friend, because that makes it even worse. Who wants to end a friendship over a timing belt job, when any indie could have done it for $800 and that's the end of it.....And in this case, since they are not competent, it should be in writing that they will pay the dealership whatever it costs to fix if this is the route, doesn't matter if it's $5k, $10k, because as mentioned, they already get $1400 for the job without the tensioner, idler, and tensioner pulley, imagine what they get to troubleshoot the unknown, etc. someone has to step up and start showing some progress, and the other thing, $10k to us, is not $10k to a shop who's in the business, it could be 1/2, for example, right now OEM LCA bushings are like $44 on eBay, that means a shop gets them even cheaper than that, and they list at $112....just my .02....

02Legend

iTrader: (3)

I am at that point right now. I wanted to give my buddy the benefit here to see if he was going to step up and get things done. Hasn't happened. All communication has been on me, I would assume that I would be getting a daily status update as to what he is doing and etc, nothing. On our last conversation, and when I mentioned here that I set it up so he could pick up the car early/mid week last week he gave me the excuse of "I don't know when we can get to it". We have cars in the shop right now (RED FLAG). I have been in the customer business and dealt with all types of customers/clients/contracts and personnel. That was not the right answer. It takes a lot for me to get this upset. Does not help that my online Java class is kicking my *** right now either. I have talked with my credit card company about doing a dispute/charge back and was told it should not be an issue. I am going to call the dealer tomorrow morning before I fly back home and see what my advisor says, and to see if the car is still there. If the car is still there, then I'm filing a dispute. I have been gone for 19 business days and my buddies shop does some work on the weekends and my issue has not been resolved. Unfortunately I will not be using his business again, and not sure how any type of friendship is going to continue. I feel like my good nature and us knowing each other for this long has led him to be laxed in this issue.

Johnhav430

You're very likely to be a good guy, and it's not pleasant to think about the situation, nor is it to get upset. But imho the time comes to set things right and get some satisfaction. The BMW dealer broke something on my car, and I was so surprised that they said it was already like that. It can't be true because, when the cars pull in, they read the key for faults, and they have 2 guys going around the car taking pics with iPads. Anyway, I let the SA know, I let the lady calling back to make sure I was 100% satisfied know, and I let BMWNA know. NOBODY MADE THINGS RIGHT. So I opened up a case with the BBB, and their rating dropped from A+ to C-. Suddenly I had one level above the service manager saying this wasn't handled right, what can we do to get you back as a customer. I was not rude, but I let him know how outlandish it was for the incompetent and rude SA to say the car came in, in that condition. (The issue was related to brakes--I had just done the ABS, 4 rotors, 4 pads, 2 sensors,, and there were 200 miles on these brakes--they f'd up the car doing a 4 wheel alignment) He agreed and was willing to do a $2,000 job for free, because that's what I said when he asked what they can do. But I thought about it, and I never want to bring my car back there again. I ended up fixing the car myself, but they sent me a check for the part--$13. I gave them the straight goods honest internet price, I was not looking to beat them out of anything, and they knew it. The subsequently sent me a letter for free service, but F them. Sometimes, we really have to understand, there are folks out there in the industry who don't care about our cars, and even though they're gonna damage our vehicles, they have to know that it's not ok. my .02...

02Legend

iTrader: (3)

Picked my my car this morning. It drives fine, as I expected. Popped the hood open briefly to see if the noise was still there and or as loud as before. It did not seem as noisy, however it is raining pretty bad, and I will be checking it again once the rain stops. I have filed a dispute against the shop charge on my credit card. I will be stopping by another shop this week to just get an opinion on what they may think the noise could be. The shop primarily works on Hondas/Toyotas.

Johnhav430

Is there a chance that the motor truly is not as noisy as it was?

Also, with the credit card dispute, my wife's experience has been that the merchant still holds the cards....she did it against one of those mall kiosks a few holidays ago. She called the 800#, to send gifts to her bffs (like 9 of them), and rather than send 1x9 gifts, they shipped 3x9=27 gifts. This order was done by a human, not the web. So as soon as she disputed, the charges were removed. Then they were put back on 14 days later as merchant said they were valid and that the recipients should have returned 2x9 orders if my wife only ordered 1 each. HUH? Not only that, Chase flagged her as having disputed a legit charge. WTF? Who solved it? BBB--they were accredited and once the case opened they stated their error--then the charges were credited in about 4 days. Chase never removed that flag and today if she applies for a Chase amazon card etc., she is rejected (her fico is over 830 experian). Just our experience with that dispute method, seems to leave the power in the merchants' hands as the cc states you must try to resolve with them....

good luck hopefully the noise is not there, you get your money back, and that's simply the end of it!