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According to the OP, the transmission had been experiencing " Thud/Clunk" problem prior to the timing belt service, and running with 1/3 quarts low on ATF.
The ATF cooling lines are located fairly high up off of the ATF pan. The transmission is equipped with a pump to circulate ATF through the cooler, but with the engine off, the line does not hold significant amount of ATF (I'm sure it is less than 1/3 quarts that can drain out).
The OP mentioned that the dealer may have put on 41.4 miles (81 miles minus 39.6 miles), which should not cause much more damage to the transmission than how it was before the OP added the 1/3 quarts of ATF a few days prior to the timing belt service.
Now, the loud whirring noise from the engine is another serious matter that must be investigated and fixed.
The loud whirring noise could be a bad water pump if it was defective outta the box.
You would not want me on your jury. Motor probably needed the timing belt and parts associated with it. Transmission probably was going bad for some time and probably had not been serviced as required.
This sort of thing happens all the time. Stuff wears out.
You are not entitled to any refund and the fact that they gave you one means the were very generous. I would not have. If you feel taken advantage of, try doing the work yourself and find out how much fun it is.
You would not want me on your jury. Motor probably needed the timing belt and parts associated with it. Transmission probably was going bad for some time and probably had not been serviced as required.
This sort of thing happens all the time. Stuff wears out.
You are not entitled to any refund and the fact that they gave you one means the were very generous. I would not have. If you feel taken advantage of, try doing the work yourself and find out how much fun it is.
All it is is a belt, a water pump and some tensioners it's not that hard to do if you take your time it takes like 3-6 hours and parts can be faulty out of the box, and have you ever serviced your own vehicle?
You would not want me on your jury. Motor probably needed the timing belt and parts associated with it. Transmission probably was going bad for some time and probably had not been serviced as required.
This sort of thing happens all the time. Stuff wears out.
You are not entitled to any refund and the fact that they gave you one means the were very generous. I would not have. If you feel taken advantage of, try doing the work yourself and find out how much fun it is.
But there'd always be someone like me also on the jury. This is why our cars are more suitable for DIY or indies, because in the latter, rarely is anyone recommending unnecessary services at full retail. btw the BMW dealer offered to do a $1,600 job to make things right. I said maybe (it wasn't about money and I already fixed the problem DIY), and then I finally decided they can go and [radio edit] themselves. They're never touching my car again.
When one is in business, there are times they have to make good, at a cost, then again, isn't every person on this forum in business in some way or another?
The loud whirring noise could be a bad water pump if it was defective outta the box.
The loud whirring noise can definitely come from a defective water pump. However, the Lexus dealership does not automatically include in its "timing belt service" price to replace the neighboring parts such as idler, tensioner, water pump, and the like. In fact I recall reading a Lexus work order (somewhere on this forum) which lists a timing belt, a gallon of coolant, and xx hours of labor for a timing belt job - no other parts were listed. Perhaps the existing water pump or idler was failing, and the timing belt service accelerated their demise.
If it were my car, I would not just accept a refund and walk away, instead, I would insist on the dealership fixing the problem. You should not be responsible for labor cost for Lexus to take the engine apart again to troubleshoot. If the source of the whirring noise is from a failing water pump, as 05ls430518 pointed out, you should only be responsible for the cost of a new water pump, without having to pay for the labor.
Your transmission problem is most likely unrelated to timing belt job. You have posted several discussions about problems you were having with your transmission before, including burnt-smell ATF, noises, and running with low ATF level probably for an extended period of time. Your transmission will continue to deteriorate and should be addressed promptly.
The loud whirring noise can definitely come from a defective water pump. However, the Lexus dealership does not automatically include in its "timing belt service" price to replace the neighboring parts such as idler, tensioner, water pump, and the like. In fact I recall reading a Lexus work order (somewhere on this forum) which lists a timing belt, a gallon of coolant, and xx hours of labor for a timing belt job - no other parts were listed. Perhaps the existing water pump or idler was failing, and the timing belt service accelerated their demise.
If it were my car, I would not just accept a refund and walk away, instead, I would insist on the dealership fixing the problem. You should not be responsible for labor cost for Lexus to take the engine apart again to troubleshoot. If the source of the whirring noise is from a failing water pump, as 05ls430518 pointed out, you should only be responsible for the cost of a new water pump, without having to pay for the labor.
Your transmission problem is most likely unrelated to timing belt job. You have posted several discussions about problems you were having with your transmission before, including burnt-smell ATF, noises, and running with low ATF level probably for an extended period of time. Your transmission will continue to deteriorate and should be addressed promptly.
I agree, in the car business, it is routine for labor to be eaten. It's always that way first when there is a disagreement. Dealer will say, you pay for the parts, we'll pay for the labor. Of course, the part is at list. Then you say, I have a better idea, you pay for everything, and they agree.
If an indie, since they are dealing with older cars like ours, they have to eat labor a lot more often. That is, when they supply the parts. I've been told if I supply the parts, then no warranty. So we have to weigh the "internet" price vs. what the indie wants, and the likelihood of failure...
I agree with you, you spelled it out nicely, as opposed to a refund, the best case is the job done properly. I'm pretty sure that the so-called 90k tb job for the LS430 has the water pump, but does not have the idlers and tensioner? Then the next one does?
The only issue with old cars and new car dealers, is they don't seem to understand sometimes the owner wants value, they're not looking to restore the vehicle to brand new, they want to do what makes sense...indies get this factor...
I agree with you, you spelled it out nicely, as opposed to a refund, the best case is the job done properly. I'm pretty sure that the so-called 90k tb job for the LS430 has the water pump, but does not have the idlers and tensioner? Then the next one does?
Agree 100%... If the Lexus dealer included a defective water pump in the timing belt service, of course it will be fully responsible for the entire re-work (parts and labor). Lexus is very good with record keeping, so whatever parts are provided and installed should be easy to find out.
If an indie, since they are dealing with older cars like ours, they have to eat labor a lot more often. That is, when they supply the parts. I've been told if I supply the parts, then no warranty. So we have to weigh the "internet" price vs. what the indie wants, and the likelihood of failure...
My friend who owns his shop he gets all his parts from NAPA because if there part is defective they reimburse him for the defective part, let's say a tensioner siezes up, causes the timing belt to break and the valves to hit the pistons and bend them then napa will pay for all machine work or anything that is needed to make your car run and drive like stock.
He will not work on another customers car if they bring there own parts because people buy the cheapest stuff possible it breaks and then get pissed off when he will not warranty it, he changed to this policy after a lady tried to sue him when she purchased cheap struts for her car the sway bar link tab broke off and she could not get a refund for the part from the website she purchased it from.
I got my money back from the dealer for the timing belt, sold the car to damaged cars.com/carbrain. Now I am shopping for another 430. Thanks for all the feedback. The loud whirring noise was the idler bearing btw. December to Remember
I got my money back from the dealer for the timing belt, sold the car to damaged cars.com/carbrain. Now I am shopping for another 430. Thanks for all the feedback. The loud whirring noise was the idler bearing btw. December to Remember
were are you located in NY? I will go to inspect a car with you if you would like.
Damn. No Im in Washington but I would love to have some expertise with me. Shucks. Appreciate the gesture. I was going to fly to Phoenix yesterday to get an 01' Hunter Green 430 w/ 130k but the guy sold it. For me, If I trust the seller/owner and they sound competent and somewhat knowledgeable then I feel more comfortable with my purchase. I am going to start a "vehicle inspection checklist" thread so I can get some veteran knowledge from all you guys. Though I am looking all over I am focusing on the west coast (OR, CA, AZ,N.TX, NM, NV) because they are warmer dryer areas. Too expensive here in Washington
Good link I downloaded the pdf and holy cow there is like 5 pages that's a dealership form correct? Also is that link stickied anywhere I think tbat would be a good thing to have at the top of the ls forum page with the other stickies.
12-14-17, 10:06 AM
