140,000 mile LS430 even trade for my ES300?
01-02-18, 07:03 AM
#1
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140,000 mile LS430 even trade for my ES300?
Hey all,
wanted some opinions. been an LS fan since I was a little kid - actually tried to buy one in 2003 when I was 16. Had the funds, but parents put the kibosh on it and I ended up with a pearl white and silver two-tone camry with leather. Loved the car but was aware then and now that lexus materials and NVH (or the lack thereof) are absolutely noticeably better. Haven't ever owned one.. I currently have a mechanically clean (very clean) 2002 ES300. There is a chap who planned to give a 2001 LS430 to his family member but that person says its way to big, and there is a possibility he'd trade even for my 2002 es300. Mine has 35,000 less miles and is mechanically perfect. His has had the timing belt done, so that is a good sign.
I am aware of the premium fuel thing; no problem because I run that in my ES. Cant imagine MPG is much worse... I'm inclined not to care.
I see that parts are more expensive.... but other than that, just wanted to hear some pro's and con's from people who have owned one (or ideally owned both)
Thanks
Drew
wanted some opinions. been an LS fan since I was a little kid - actually tried to buy one in 2003 when I was 16. Had the funds, but parents put the kibosh on it and I ended up with a pearl white and silver two-tone camry with leather. Loved the car but was aware then and now that lexus materials and NVH (or the lack thereof) are absolutely noticeably better. Haven't ever owned one.. I currently have a mechanically clean (very clean) 2002 ES300. There is a chap who planned to give a 2001 LS430 to his family member but that person says its way to big, and there is a possibility he'd trade even for my 2002 es300. Mine has 35,000 less miles and is mechanically perfect. His has had the timing belt done, so that is a good sign.
I am aware of the premium fuel thing; no problem because I run that in my ES. Cant imagine MPG is much worse... I'm inclined not to care.
I see that parts are more expensive.... but other than that, just wanted to hear some pro's and con's from people who have owned one (or ideally owned both)
Thanks
Drew
01-02-18, 07:47 AM
#2
Pole Position
We have a 2007 ES 350 and two LS 430 (2001 and 2004). 2001 has 132k miles, 2004 has 65k miles.
I would trade the 2002 ES for an LS 430 if it is in good shape and you can get an idea that the maintenance has been done. Timing Belt/Water Pump is done.
The cost of Premium fuel amounts to $400 or so in a year for us. Not significant in the grand scheme.
The ride quality and smoothness puts the LS over the 02 ES vintage in my books.
I would trade the 2002 ES for an LS 430 if it is in good shape and you can get an idea that the maintenance has been done. Timing Belt/Water Pump is done.
The cost of Premium fuel amounts to $400 or so in a year for us. Not significant in the grand scheme.
The ride quality and smoothness puts the LS over the 02 ES vintage in my books.
01-02-18, 07:57 AM
#3
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Good advice… Money is pretty tight around here, but things like premium fuel and maintenance to our vehicles are very high priority, so they’re not a deterrent at all. I just wonder if a 430 is still a 400,000 mile car, like a 400 W
01-02-18, 08:29 AM
#4
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The reason to stay with your ES is you know the car, the history and that you are current on maintenance.
Gas mileage will be in that 18 to 25 range on the LS. If I can set the cruise at 65 I can get 27. But, 75+ mph you are looking at the 24-25 range.
The ES will get better MPG. FWD is more familiar to most. I like the RWD and Traction Control system in the LS. But, it is a bit different. Snow mode works good when we do get heavier snow amounts.
Drive the LS and then drive the ES.
Gas mileage will be in that 18 to 25 range on the LS. If I can set the cruise at 65 I can get 27. But, 75+ mph you are looking at the 24-25 range.
The ES will get better MPG. FWD is more familiar to most. I like the RWD and Traction Control system in the LS. But, it is a bit different. Snow mode works good when we do get heavier snow amounts.
Drive the LS and then drive the ES.
01-02-18, 10:02 AM
#5
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Believe it or not, if the cruise set on 65, mine doesn’t do any better than 24 miles per gallon… This is probably because of the extreme cold, and the gasoline mixtures the stations use as a result. It would probably be closer to 30 in the summer. I have taken an hour drive an average almost 30 in the cold, but the cruise was more like 58 mph. My wife and I put about 135,000 miles on a 3.3 L solara and that car always impressed me… Modest driving habits, and cruise under 70 and whole tanks would average 30 combined city and highway. From Boca Raton Florida to Rochester New York, we once average 37 mpg, but we hardly saw faster than 65, because she was following me while I was driving a large truck and towing another car. I love that car, and was convinced it was the right thing to do to move on from it, now I wish I had spent the money and kept it. Just didn’t make sense to put $1500 in parts, and a good two days of labor into a car with almost 200,000 miles on it
all that said, there is no good reason to be looking into trading up to an LS, other than the fact that I simply want one. It’s not in anyway shape or form beneficial financially or mechanically… But then again, I can get a Yaris instead of my ES If it was all about the bottom line. I’m a good mechanic, so the LS doesn’t scare me, it’s the actual cost of the parts that gives me a little pause.
Far is rear wheel drive, I actually prefer it. The definite majority of the miles I’ve driven have been in front wheel drive cars, but I have had BMWs, and obviously my hot rod is rear wheel drive, and it never has bothered me in the snow. I mean the BMWs, not the hot rod. Pick up trucks and sports cars are awful, but near 50-50 weight balanced sedans do just fine. I would make sure to run good tires.
I’ve researched the exhaust system, and is complex and expensive as it is, I know I can handle it when, not if, but when I saw trouble with it.
I’ll let you guys know… I’m supposed to drive the LS this afternoon
all that said, there is no good reason to be looking into trading up to an LS, other than the fact that I simply want one. It’s not in anyway shape or form beneficial financially or mechanically… But then again, I can get a Yaris instead of my ES If it was all about the bottom line. I’m a good mechanic, so the LS doesn’t scare me, it’s the actual cost of the parts that gives me a little pause.
Far is rear wheel drive, I actually prefer it. The definite majority of the miles I’ve driven have been in front wheel drive cars, but I have had BMWs, and obviously my hot rod is rear wheel drive, and it never has bothered me in the snow. I mean the BMWs, not the hot rod. Pick up trucks and sports cars are awful, but near 50-50 weight balanced sedans do just fine. I would make sure to run good tires.
I’ve researched the exhaust system, and is complex and expensive as it is, I know I can handle it when, not if, but when I saw trouble with it.
I’ll let you guys know… I’m supposed to drive the LS this afternoon
01-02-18, 10:06 AM
#6
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Appreciate all the feedback. It wouldn’t be such a tough decision if we had more disposable income and/or I didn’t ride so much for work. Regardless of the outcome of this adventure, I definitely want a first generation LS to restore and drive as a Fairweather “classic”
01-02-18, 12:49 PM
#7
I've owned two 3rd Gen LS 430s. My brother bought both of them from me. He put 280K miles on the '03 before someone rear ended him and totaled it. The only thing he ever had to do to it aside from routine maintenance was replace a wheel bearing that got noisy.
He currently has about 140K on the '05 with zero having gone wrong with it. IME, they are as BULLETPROOF as cars get.
I haven't owned other Lexus cars, but I've driven almost all of them. None are in the class with an LS, IMO. Even a GS isn't remotely close, IMO.
He currently has about 140K on the '05 with zero having gone wrong with it. IME, they are as BULLETPROOF as cars get.
I haven't owned other Lexus cars, but I've driven almost all of them. None are in the class with an LS, IMO. Even a GS isn't remotely close, IMO.
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01-02-18, 12:56 PM
#8
Trade up. No question about that for me. LS is levels above the ES and will do fine. If that is the ride/style you want. You've always wanted one, and here is a no cost opportunity. You'll know after you drive it as your gut will tell you. Keep us posted and good luck.
01-02-18, 02:09 PM
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Crazy story all… I made it to look at the car, but didn’t dare drive it, as Buffalo, the city that it’s in, is in a complete and total blizzard… I’ve probably got 300,000 miles of winter driving under my belt, and I could say this is in the top four worst days I’ve seen. I may actually be stranded here tonight.
The car is quite nice… having messed with the built-in diagnostics for the climate control system on my ES, I ran it on the LS. It pulled code 21 and 24, which my ES also polls if it’s not outside. It has to do with the solar sensor. The L *** was in the guys heated garage. It also pulled 34 and 35, neither of which correspond with any information I could find. I don’t suspect something is wrong, I suspect they’re codes just like the ones my ES pulls if I check it at night or in the garage… The car was serviced by Buffalo and West Palm Beach is Lexus dealers… The car spent it’s winter is in West Palm Beach. All the maintenance has been done by Lexus, so I highly doubt somethings wrong with the air conditioning, but I told the guy I’ll come back this week and have him crank his garage up to 65°, and then put the air-conditioning on low and see if it blows cold. I’m also obviously going to drive the car. He was impressed with mine, but didn’t look at it nearly as in-depth as I looked at his… So yes I’ll definitely need to go by my “Gut“
I am writing this stuck in the blizzard… What an interesting day! I’ve literally been driving through snow high enough to scrape the bottom of this car. Hopefully it doesn’t get stuck in the middle of the road…
The car is quite nice… having messed with the built-in diagnostics for the climate control system on my ES, I ran it on the LS. It pulled code 21 and 24, which my ES also polls if it’s not outside. It has to do with the solar sensor. The L *** was in the guys heated garage. It also pulled 34 and 35, neither of which correspond with any information I could find. I don’t suspect something is wrong, I suspect they’re codes just like the ones my ES pulls if I check it at night or in the garage… The car was serviced by Buffalo and West Palm Beach is Lexus dealers… The car spent it’s winter is in West Palm Beach. All the maintenance has been done by Lexus, so I highly doubt somethings wrong with the air conditioning, but I told the guy I’ll come back this week and have him crank his garage up to 65°, and then put the air-conditioning on low and see if it blows cold. I’m also obviously going to drive the car. He was impressed with mine, but didn’t look at it nearly as in-depth as I looked at his… So yes I’ll definitely need to go by my “Gut“
I am writing this stuck in the blizzard… What an interesting day! I’ve literally been driving through snow high enough to scrape the bottom of this car. Hopefully it doesn’t get stuck in the middle of the road…
01-02-18, 02:18 PM
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There is a video for anyone interested… if you’ve ever tried to videotape snow knows that it doesn’t show up on camera, but if you look in the headlights that should give you an idea of how fast it’s coming down. There is 4 to 5 inches of snow in the middle of the road
01-02-18, 04:27 PM
#11
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Made it home in one piece!
Next question… I know the LS 430 was the first Lexus to have one of those sealed transmissions, where a scan tool is needed to know the level, because there is no dipstick. Does anybody know if 2001 was that way? If I remember correctly, it was in the middle of the third generation Ls when the change was made… Hoping it has a dipstick like my 2002 ES, as I’m pretty big on tranny drain/Fill maintenance
Also, it has chrome wheels. The basic ones but chrome. Can they stand a rochester winter? Next fall I’d get steel wheels and snow tires but this winter id have to run them. It’s never seen a winter except in West Palm. Ironically I used to work across Okeechobee Blvd from the Lexus dealer or was maintained at!
Next question… I know the LS 430 was the first Lexus to have one of those sealed transmissions, where a scan tool is needed to know the level, because there is no dipstick. Does anybody know if 2001 was that way? If I remember correctly, it was in the middle of the third generation Ls when the change was made… Hoping it has a dipstick like my 2002 ES, as I’m pretty big on tranny drain/Fill maintenance
Also, it has chrome wheels. The basic ones but chrome. Can they stand a rochester winter? Next fall I’d get steel wheels and snow tires but this winter id have to run them. It’s never seen a winter except in West Palm. Ironically I used to work across Okeechobee Blvd from the Lexus dealer or was maintained at!
01-03-18, 02:07 PM
#12
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Hey all, hope not to let this thread die.... I looked over the car's maintenance. looks like it was at lexus for everything... both owners, same lexus dealers.
It had the timing belt done at 107,000 but not the water pump, tensioner, and bearings. I see a Mitsuboshi/Aisin kit for like $130, if I get the car I guess I can just do the next one at 180 and call it a day. In all the records (coolant flush, brake fluid flush, lexus battery, michellin tires) all at the lexus dealer, I DIDNT see one for a transmission drain fill (2001 is a drain/fill year) which is scary, but of its 146,000 miles, only 5,000 per year were off of the 1500 mile stretch between its Buffalo and West Palm Beach homes. This is a scary thing though. I typically drain and fill every 15,000-20,000 with Toyota T-IV. Carfax, service records, looking underneath, and talking to the seller all lines up that it has NEVER seen a winter. Breaks my heart that it will with me. If i buy it, maybe i'll build a winter car over the summer, like a 2 or 3es that needs a motor or something.
Anyway, looking forward to more comments =) if I have PEACE about this when I drive the car, I am going to jump on it.
It had the timing belt done at 107,000 but not the water pump, tensioner, and bearings. I see a Mitsuboshi/Aisin kit for like $130, if I get the car I guess I can just do the next one at 180 and call it a day. In all the records (coolant flush, brake fluid flush, lexus battery, michellin tires) all at the lexus dealer, I DIDNT see one for a transmission drain fill (2001 is a drain/fill year) which is scary, but of its 146,000 miles, only 5,000 per year were off of the 1500 mile stretch between its Buffalo and West Palm Beach homes. This is a scary thing though. I typically drain and fill every 15,000-20,000 with Toyota T-IV. Carfax, service records, looking underneath, and talking to the seller all lines up that it has NEVER seen a winter. Breaks my heart that it will with me. If i buy it, maybe i'll build a winter car over the summer, like a 2 or 3es that needs a motor or something.
Anyway, looking forward to more comments =) if I have PEACE about this when I drive the car, I am going to jump on it.
01-03-18, 02:28 PM
#13
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Sounds like it might be a great car. Get it and do 3 AT drain and fills over a 3 week period and you will be fine. My concern would be running a rwd car in the Snowbelt in the winter. I would want a 4wd or at least fwd with last choice being a heavy rwd car for winter driving in snow. At the very least get some serious high end snow tires.
01-03-18, 04:51 PM
#14
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I would definitely drain and fill once every couple weeks until ruby red.
I had a 2001 bmw rwd winter car, which like the LS is well balanced. It had Blizzacks and was great. I’d need to sneak through this winter cause if money but will was it minimum 5 times per week. Over the summer l will put together a 1mz or 3mz winter car. Hopefully a 200k well maintained strong car or one that is low mile but needs transmission or something. $1000 car. This is if I do it. Now I am more or less hoping t works out. If not, now I have to build a 1 gen Ls this summer. Wanted one for 14 years
I had a 2001 bmw rwd winter car, which like the LS is well balanced. It had Blizzacks and was great. I’d need to sneak through this winter cause if money but will was it minimum 5 times per week. Over the summer l will put together a 1mz or 3mz winter car. Hopefully a 200k well maintained strong car or one that is low mile but needs transmission or something. $1000 car. This is if I do it. Now I am more or less hoping t works out. If not, now I have to build a 1 gen Ls this summer. Wanted one for 14 years
01-03-18, 05:51 PM
#15
I run 4 snows and tear it p. The LS is so fun in snowy weather with the trac control and weight. run full tank of gas no worry's. Ya don't need to run premium, just regular