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They are serviceable. (I have an 04). There isn't a conventional dipstick, but there is a check plug port that can be utilized when fluid is at a certain operating temperature to check the level.
Awesome, thank you for pointing me in the right direction! I will check this over. I've seen this on cars before but like I said earlier, I just haven't had to think about it yet.
Perhaps it may help you understand the market if you switch your perspective from buy-side to sell-side.
This is something I've never thought to do, probably b/c I've driven two cars until the wheels fell off, bolted them back on, and drove them some more. I DID just go through this buying and selling a house, so it applies better there. Thanks for that perspective. I think this also gets to the heart of what I'm trying to ask and I think everyone has given really good feedback.
Originally Posted by StanVanDam
My recommendation: 1) know what generation you want (2001-2003 or 2004-2006), 2) what package/options you want (base, CL, UL), and 3) what mileage range is acceptable to you (under 80k, under 100k, etc). Once you have defined your criteria, then collect the selling prices over the past 12-24 months for that combination of 1+2+3. This gives you a set of numbers with lower variance and minimal standard deviations from the average selling price than if you just looked at all LS430s. Now you know what the market rate is for a 1+2+3. Then it's up to you to lowball sellers if you think they are too high, pay extra to secure a good deal if someone's price is too low, or quickly accept whatever price someone asks if you think the supply of 1+2+3 is low and demand is high.
This is what I've seen and, tbh, I think the cars I'm seeing that I'm interested are priced in the right bracket.
Originally Posted by Striker223
Great advice here and the post above it.
When I went looking for a 430 I wanted a 01-03 due to more easily serviceable parts and replaceable blubs instead of LEDs, I didn't want self leveling headlights or air suspension, and I didn't want a nav screen since I never use them and they date the hell out of any car.
From there i had zero zero mileage requirements, I instead had exterior and interior condition requirements that it be 98% or thereabouts. I would have gladly bought a cosmetically perfect car with a blown engine or trans since any mechanical error is extremely easy and cheap for me to address. The reason air suspension and the other features are ones I wanted to avoid is because aside from the screen that I just don't like, is the parts to repair those other options are really pricey and nothing I can do will change that coupled with those systems always failing.
Only thing I wanted that I don't have is heated seats. I'm working on that though, also seeing how possible it would be to add in soft close. Laminated glass will be added soon as well.
First, I agree, I wanted to quote him and you to highlight that yeah, all of that makes sense. Just being pointed to a few of the threads people have posted has been hugely helpful in answering my question. Secondly, to relate, I'm about in the same boat. I want the '04 - '06 just because at this point it's a 16 - 14 year old luxury car and the only thing that really pushes me away would be a UL with air suspension and NAV - just a little too many things to worry about.
Believe me, it’s not you. A lot of users on this forum get some strange satisfaction in saying these cars are worth less than they are (like John always citing his cars trade in value for some reason). I have a 2001 I paid $1700 for, and I have a 2005 I paid $10k for two years ago. Guess which one I regret buying? The $1700 one!
Well I think this was the reason I brought up this thread like this - I didn't see anything in Search directly about the subject and thought it'd be something worth talking about. I think I was right in doing so b/c a lot of good points have come up from it! I don't want to be the guy that regrets the purchase b/c I went too far in either direction - underpaying and getting a heap or overpaying to get a good example.
Originally Posted by Peacebay
It must be a demographic thing. Because the BMW I have and the VW I used to have, those forum members do not seem as obsessed over current values as these ones are.
When I was in the old Volvo community (I had a 1991 240), there were a ton of them being sold for $8,000 or more simply b/c they were a "classic" Volvo and I saw a lot of people getting absolutely fleeced for it! They bought them thinking that these were pristine garage queens or something, but they turned out to be the same kind of beater I bought for $1600. So I guess naturally I'm a little skeptical and the difference is that 15 years later I want to make sure I actually get a great car for $10k and not make the same mistake as others and just overpay.
Originally Posted by Peacebay
Believe me, some of the guys on this forum are awesome and have a lot of Lexus wisdom — but just look at the two most popular threads on this forum. Both go into irrelevant pricing discussions with the same few people weighing in.
I think this is just what happens on car forums, especially when you start getting in to niche cars. There's a lot that's already been talked about and the horse is long dead and buried, so it becomes cyclical. Then you have newbs like me that can't use the damn search feature (I tried! I tried! I promise) and rehash these conversations.
kbb, that's what it's for. A mint condition ls430 with that many miles...at most 9k...maybe 10 but...no. 15k is absurd
Yeah and that's why I'm happy I started this thread, although some people seem to be salty about it. I have two cars in my region that are around 50k miles and they're asking $16k! So I thought either I'm waaaaay off base in believing KBB values or something is up. I'm happy to say that this thread has confirmed that the good ones I'm seeing for $10k are really worth looking at, and the ones that are asking $16k can **** off.
So many great posts!
For me it all depends if I get what I'm paying for and I have no prob paying a fair price.
When a seller does a cheap respray on the bumpers and redye the seats to sell it as "mint" for Top Dollar but the car is all original and will be needing big $$$
to make like new again mechanically- I can't pay top dollar Dealer Prices.
Well I think this was the reason I brought up this thread like this - I didn't see anything in Search directly about the subject and thought it'd be something worth talking about. I think I was right in doing so b/c a lot of good points have come up from it! I don't want to be the guy that regrets the purchase b/c I went too far in either direction - underpaying and getting a heap or overpaying to get a good example.
When I was in the old Volvo community (I had a 1991 240), there were a ton of them being sold for $8,000 or more simply b/c they were a "classic" Volvo and I saw a lot of people getting absolutely fleeced for it! They bought them thinking that these were pristine garage queens or something, but they turned out to be the same kind of beater I bought for $1600. So I guess naturally I'm a little skeptical and the difference is that 15 years later I want to make sure I actually get a great car for $10k and not make the same mistake as others and just overpay.
I think this is just what happens on car forums, especially when you start getting in to niche cars. There's a lot that's already been talked about and the horse is long dead and buried, so it becomes cyclical. Then you have newbs like me that can't use the damn search feature (I tried! I tried! I promise) and rehash these conversations.
A Volvo 244 was my first car, 264 were my 2nd and 3rd cars, and I drove one through 1998. I worked on my Volvos out of a 3 ring binder made that had shortcuts on jobs saving hours vs. the factory method. And no, the internet despite what Al Gore says, did not exist yet! (pretty sure the book is in the attic)
The funny thing about them was they were not particularly reliable and yes mine went to 500k, but the amount of repairs needed would be way more than say a 1995 Camry that you see on the road today with say 400k. If you look at the history of Volvo, they harped on safety where in 1975, the car had 4 wheel discs and 3 point belts in the rear. They still pretend that they build safer cars today when in fact, they do not! The reason that 1993 was the last year of the 240 Volvo, was that they were still basically 1975 cars, and could not meet crash standards for 1995.
What I did love most about my Volvos? The rear headrests, the printed circuit rear 6 panel tails, the aluminized OE exhaust with the mandrel bent turns and the curved tailpipe and correctly tack welded hangers (I refused the Midas touch on all my cars), and the creme de la creme the Ate fixed calipers on all 4's.
Those were the days. I'm hoping to recapture the excitement with AMG. Lexus and BMW are OK, but not thrilling to work on.
edit p.s. to elaborate on the Volvo OE muffler--the weld for the hangar was to the edges of the muffler. An aftermarket would weld it to the face of the muffler, where it would basically rust through every 12-18 mos (kinda like Walker does today). The edges were stronger to support the weight of the silencer
A Volvo 244 was my first car, 264 were my 2nd and 3rd cars, and I drove one through 1998. I worked on my Volvos out of a 3 ring binder made that had shortcuts on jobs saving hours vs. the factory method. And no, the internet despite what Al Gore says, did not exist yet! (pretty sure the book is in the attic)
The funny thing about them was they were not particularly reliable and yes mine went to 500k, but the amount of repairs needed would be way more than say a 1995 Camry that you see on the road today with say 400k. If you look at the history of Volvo, they harped on safety where in 1975, the car had 4 wheel discs and 3 point belts in the rear. They still pretend that they build safer cars today when in fact, they do not! The reason that 1993 was the last year of the 240 Volvo, was that they were still basically 1975 cars, and could not meet crash standards for 1995.
What I did love most about my Volvos? The rear headrests, the printed circuit rear 6 panel tails, the aluminized OE exhaust with the mandrel bent turns and the curved tailpipe and correctly tack welded hangers (I refused the Midas touch on all my cars), and the creme de la creme the Ate fixed calipers on all 4's.
Those were the days. I'm hoping to recapture the excitement with AMG. Lexus and BMW are OK, but not thrilling to work on.
edit p.s. to elaborate on the Volvo OE muffler--the weld for the hangar was to the edges of the muffler. An aftermarket would weld it to the face of the muffler, where it would basically rust through every 12-18 mos (kinda like Walker does today). The edges were stronger to support the weight of the silencer
Yes, yes, yes! I loved that little car - especially after I overhauled and rebuilt the engine when the cylinder head went out but yes, it was a dinosaur of a design and not at all easy to keep up with. It was a plucky little car for sure.
Yes, yes, yes! I loved that little car - especially after I overhauled and rebuilt the engine when the cylinder head went out but yes, it was a dinosaur of a design and not at all easy to keep up with. It was a plucky little car for sure.
My first one was OHV and I actually didn't know what the difference was lol So a friend helped me get the timing case off (I was thinking where's the timing belt) and he said bad news, there's nothing wrong with the gears (I had borrowed my mom's credit card to order a set of timing gears--pretty sure it was from IPD and they still exist today!). It turned out that inside the distributor, a lock pin was missing. So I stuck a paper clip in the hole and drove the car another 2 years haha. Like I say that may have been a pile of junk that I paid $700 for, but it was my first car, and "my" car. 4 speed manual with ice cold air and holes in just about every panel (even my newer ones rusted behind the mud flaps in the rear 1/4's).
If I could go back I would, sorry wife and 6 y.o. son but those days were fun! But maybe I can get that fun back with a AMG car.
edit p.s. another memory of my first car, the white 244 DL--since I already got the black 264 and was moving, I wanted to keep the rims/tires even though they were on steelies. The rears came off an older wagon and were 15"--195/65-15 continentals--in that day those were LOW LOW PROS!! lol The fronts were 14" 185/70-14 Michelin MX-Ls. I set the car on cinder blocks and the landlord showed up cuz the 1st floor tenant called and told her what I was doing. "You better not be abandoning that car!!" I said no, I'm not, just changing the tires (c'mon it was on cinder blocks at all corners lol). As I said, when you're 19 man the world is your oyster just don't care and life is fun
Ok, except KBB still contradicts what the 'pricing experts' on here purport to be the fair market value. Here is what KBB says is fair for a 2006 with 60k miles FOR THE BASE MODEL (read: not a UL or with any desirable color combinations):
Bottom line is that $7k or whatever other arbitrary price one can come up with is not the going rate for a mint low mile example.
Both KBB and NADA utilize surveys of ASKING PRICES significantly in its data to determine car values, as both KBB and NADA attest to doing. (A used car dealer I know pastes the KBB window stickers on all of his inventory. He said most people who buy a car from him below the KBB guide price seem happy. He would say "If you buy at Black Book price, and are able to sell anywhere near NADA or KBB prices, you will do very well.")
Edmunds TMV https://www.edmunds.com/tmv.html bases it prices on ACTUAL SALES PRICES in its database as it states it does on its site. Recommend anyone looking to buy any used car to look at values at Edmunds if one wishes to know at what actual prices car transactions are taking place. If one is selling a used car, KBB and NADA will give one a sense of higher ASKING PRICES for similar cars in the marketplace, so one may know if they are in the ballpark of prices listed by optimistic sellers. One may wish to keep in mind asking prices for used cars are often significantly inflated as a seller can always easily lower the price from the asking price to make a deal, while it is usually not practical to try to raise a price from the asking price when a buyer agrees to pay asking price without negotiating it and seller has a sense that buyer would have paid more.
Private Party value for a 60,000 mile 2006 LS 430 in outstanding condition based on ACTUAL SALES PRICES..............$7,327
I am new to the forums and new to Lexus in general; hoping to be a new part of the club from Atlanta, GA. I will apologize in advance if this has been discussed or is common knowledge for most users - I searched and didn't find a thread within the first 3 pages so here we are.
I am earnestly looking for an LS 430 to replace my current daily driver. It's a car I've admired for a long time and I can't get over the consistent remarks of it being "one of the most reliable cars ever built" as well as reading stories here of owners going back to an LS 430 after owning later generations of the LS 460, or even other flagship models from other brands. I have a hard budget of $10k (cash) and I am specifically looking for as low mileage '04 - '06 model years. As I am researching and combing through listings, I am noticing that asking prices are consistently $11k or more from dealers, and comparably higher than that from private party. There's one I see in Cordele, GA (private party) with 52k miles and they are asking $15,995! https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ngId=531737294. Here's an '05 with 108k miles at $10,800 (dealer) and it it's shown to be about $2k over average value. https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ngId=541481063
So that brings me to my question: is the state of the LS 430 market such that asking prices are just higher than published prices seen from Edmunds and KBB? My initial reaction tells me yes, the car holds its value well and that's a good thing but at the same time, I don't want to get fleeced. I've not gone through the car buying process that much - the two cars I've bought so far were offered at or below market value so it was a very straight-forward process of "I'd like to buy this car and the price is fair. Thank you." If I'm coming to a dealer with cash in hand, should I realistically be asking for median market value of around $8k to $9k? Should I reset my expectations so that I'm prepared to pay a couple more thousand dollars to make sure I'm getting what I want out of it? Thanks in advance for your guidance and help.
-stylo
I paid Dealer Retail Price a little bit on the higher side for my last car but here is why.
1) Dealer had an good reputation.
2) Carfax & Accucheck was perfect with no Multi-Year gaps in mileage reporting so Mileage is Proven and Accurate.
3) No accident history and oil changes & service work done including Timing Belt/Waterpump($1k+) by Lexus.
3) Car was in excellent condition mechanically and cosmetically and 2nd owner.
4) Tires were a name brand and excellent condition($700-$800).
This is the kind of car I can pay Top Dollar for.
PS- The reason I bought from a dealer is because they got the best Older Trade in's from the Lexus dealer- the private party cars I saw were
polsihed up beaters asking crazy money $$$. I would've loved to save money on a private sale but couldn't find a good one.
A Volvo 244 was my first car, 264 were my 2nd and 3rd cars, and I drove one through 1998. I worked on my Volvos out of a 3 ring binder made that had shortcuts on jobs saving hours vs. the factory method. And no, the internet despite what Al Gore says, did not exist yet! (pretty sure the book is in the attic)
The funny thing about them was they were not particularly reliable and yes mine went to 500k, but the amount of repairs needed would be way more than say a 1995 Camry that you see on the road today with say 400k. If you look at the history of Volvo, they harped on safety where in 1975, the car had 4 wheel discs and 3 point belts in the rear. They still pretend that they build safer cars today when in fact, they do not! The reason that 1993 was the last year of the 240 Volvo, was that they were still basically 1975 cars, and could not meet crash standards for 1995.
What I did love most about my Volvos? The rear headrests, the printed circuit rear 6 panel tails, the aluminized OE exhaust with the mandrel bent turns and the curved tailpipe and correctly tack welded hangers (I refused the Midas touch on all my cars), and the creme de la creme the Ate fixed calipers on all 4's.
Those were the days. I'm hoping to recapture the excitement with AMG. Lexus and BMW are OK, but not thrilling to work on.
edit p.s. to elaborate on the Volvo OE muffler--the weld for the hangar was to the edges of the muffler. An aftermarket would weld it to the face of the muffler, where it would basically rust through every 12-18 mos (kinda like Walker does today). The edges were stronger to support the weight of the silencer
I'm sorry , but I can't hold back and need to chime in on the Volvo 240 subject. I'm sure I'm older than most of the members on this forum (collecting social security for a number of years)...In the days I had my own used car business, I sold more Volvo 140, 164, and 240s than I could count. Every father wanted a 240 for his daughter or son for their first car. I am not even going to mention the great 120 and 544 series I sold. That's how far back I go!!! I gave my wife (at the time) a 140 or 240 ( can't remember which one) as a personal driver for her and the kids. Yes, it was NOT TROUBLE FREE. This one had carburetors and there were a number of issues, but it was a safe car at that time. Also, it had very comfortable seats which was the one thing I loved the most. When I came to Fl in 1995, I had a car service business, and the one car I used the most was a 1988 Volvo 240 wagon. I LOVED THAT CAR! It was so comfortable and yet soooo slow. I purchased it with 72,000 miles and sold it with 209,000 miles. I remember when the hinges on the rear hatch door broke off and I had the door being held on with duct tape! My indy loved me because it always required service. It was not a car that would break down, but it always had leaks and talk about the interior plastic.....What CRAP....Everything broke. Anyway, I still miss that car. Very reliable but very high maintenance. You won't see too many on the roads after 1993 (last year) because of the prohibitive upkeep. The engines and transmissions would last forever...Everything else would break. FYI...The 264 was absolutely the worst engine of all time, regardless of being in a Volvo or a Peugeot. Loved those Volvos! Sorry for the long story, but I couldn't help myself.
I'm sorry , but I can't hold back and need to chime in on the Volvo 240 subject. I'm sure I'm older than most of the members on this forum (collecting social security for a number of years)...In the days I had my own used car business, I sold more Volvo 140, 164, and 240s than I could count. Every father wanted a 240 for his daughter or son for their first car. I am not even going to mention the great 120 and 544 series I sold. That's how far back I go!!! I gave my wife (at the time) a 140 or 240 ( can't remember which one) as a personal driver for her and the kids. Yes, it was NOT TROUBLE FREE. This one had carburetors and there were a number of issues, but it was a safe car at that time. Also, it had very comfortable seats which was the one thing I loved the most. When I came to Fl in 1995, I had a car service business, and the one car I used the most was a 1988 Volvo 240 wagon. I LOVED THAT CAR! It was so comfortable and yet soooo slow. I purchased it with 72,000 miles and sold it with 209,000 miles. I remember when the hinges on the rear hatch door broke off and I had the door being held on with duct tape! My indy loved me because it always required service. It was not a car that would break down, but it always had leaks and talk about the interior plastic.....What CRAP....Everything broke. Anyway, I still miss that car. Very reliable but very high maintenance. You won't see too many on the roads after 1993 (last year) because of the prohibitive upkeep. The engines and transmissions would last forever...Everything else would break. FYI...The 264 was absolutely the worst engine of all time, regardless of being in a Volvo or a Peugeot. Loved those Volvos! Sorry for the long story, but I couldn't help myself.
Oh man, so many flashbacks reading this. Yes, that engine and transmission just wouldn't give up. The block and cylinder head didn't even blink at the head gasket blowing out on it - it ran for 2 weeks after it went out before it finally started acting funny. I remember I had heard a loud bang and thought someone was firing a gun! The engine didn't hesitate for a second when it happened, but like I said, after about two weeks of just chugging along it finally stopped dead in its tracks. Towed it up to my dad's garage and found the blown head gasket.
Both KBB and NADA utilize surveys of ASKING PRICES significantly in its data to determine car values, as both KBB and NADA attest to doing. (A used car dealer I know pastes the KBB window stickers on all of his inventory. He said most people who buy a car from him below the KBB guide price seem happy. He would say "If you buy at Black Book price, and are able to sell anywhere near NADA or KBB prices, you will do very well.")
Edmunds TMV https://www.edmunds.com/tmv.html bases it prices on ACTUAL SALES PRICES in its database as it states it does on its site. Recommend anyone looking to buy any used car to look at values at Edmunds if one wishes to know at what actual prices car transactions are taking place. If one is selling a used car, KBB and NADA will give one a sense of higher ASKING PRICES for similar cars in the marketplace, so one may know if they are in the ballpark of prices listed by optimistic sellers. One may wish to keep in mind asking prices for used cars are often significantly inflated as a seller can always easily lower the price from the asking price to make a deal, while it is usually not practical to try to raise a price from the asking price when a buyer agrees to pay asking price without negotiating it and seller has a sense that buyer would have paid more.
2006 Lexus LS 430 ................................................................................... Edmunds TMV https://www.edmunds.com/tmv.html
4dr Sedan (4.3L 8cyl 6A)
Mileage 60,000 Condition Outstanding Exterior Mercury MetallicYour appraisal As of 02/06/2020
.........................Trade-in $6,106 Private Party ..$7,324 Dealer Retail ... $9,361
National Base Price .........$4,061......................$5,307.......................$7,383
Color Adjustment ...........$25...........................$33............................$46
Regional Adjustment ......-$108........................-$141.........................-$196
Mileage Adjustment ........$2,128.......................$2,128.......................$2,128
Value ............................$6,106......................$7,327.......................$9,361
I'm sorry , but I can't hold back and need to chime in on the Volvo 240 subject. I'm sure I'm older than most of the members on this forum (collecting social security for a number of years)...In the days I had my own used car business, I sold more Volvo 140, 164, and 240s than I could count. Every father wanted a 240 for his daughter or son for their first car. I am not even going to mention the great 120 and 544 series I sold. That's how far back I go!!! I gave my wife (at the time) a 140 or 240 ( can't remember which one) as a personal driver for her and the kids. Yes, it was NOT TROUBLE FREE. This one had carburetors and there were a number of issues, but it was a safe car at that time. Also, it had very comfortable seats which was the one thing I loved the most. When I came to Fl in 1995, I had a car service business, and the one car I used the most was a 1988 Volvo 240 wagon. I LOVED THAT CAR! It was so comfortable and yet soooo slow. I purchased it with 72,000 miles and sold it with 209,000 miles. I remember when the hinges on the rear hatch door broke off and I had the door being held on with duct tape! My indy loved me because it always required service. It was not a car that would break down, but it always had leaks and talk about the interior plastic.....What CRAP....Everything broke. Anyway, I still miss that car. Very reliable but very high maintenance. You won't see too many on the roads after 1993 (last year) because of the prohibitive upkeep. The engines and transmissions would last forever...Everything else would break. FYI...The 264 was absolutely the worst engine of all time, regardless of being in a Volvo or a Peugeot. Loved those Volvos! Sorry for the long story, but I couldn't help myself.
haha I had two 264's because....they were the flagship! The sideview mirrors were the same as the 6 and 7 series BMW. Guess what was the truth? If one changed the oil every 2-3k, the B27F was in fact indestructible. I drove a 264 GLE from 1990-1998, used motor/tranny where the salvage yard who installed it ended up rebuilding the top end. I guess I lost interest altogether when I bought a 1998 Maxima SE new in 1998. Up to then I had every intention of getting a P1800 and a Bertone Coupé. Note the accent--coupe AY! My first dream car was a 1987 740 Turbo wagon, with the beautiful star 15" rims. Never realized that dream. Back in the day? I knew every Volvo indie by first name, from Albany NY to the Canadian border through VT. I challenge anyone here to name one I didn't know.
Back in the day I too loved the 200's because 700's and 900's were not a reality. Also loved my finned aluminum 14" rims.
I say hmmm....drive a 2006 LS430 and 2007 BMW 335 today, it simply cannot end there, there has to be more excitement (hey my cousin got a C63 AMG and another a M5 so I figure we're at the right station in life to do so), because it will end at some point where one no longer cares about cars and worries about college tuition and weddings and etc. This is why I am pushing myself towards an S class and an AMG version. Hey, it's my dream, only I can burst it! and it's not really a very high priority.
True story--a colleague said some ****** in a Kia Stinger nearly ran him over crossing the street at the office. Turns out it's one of my buddies at work hahahaha never knew he had a Stinger.
2006 Lexus LS 430 ................................................................................... Edmunds TMV https://www.edmunds.com/tmv.html
4dr Sedan (4.3L 8cyl 6A)
Mileage 60,000 Condition Outstanding Exterior Mercury MetallicYour appraisal As of 02/06/2020
.........................Trade-in $6,106 Private Party ..$7,324 Dealer Retail ... $9,361
National Base Price .........$4,061......................$5,307.......................$7,383
Color Adjustment ...........$25...........................$33............................$46
Regional Adjustment ......-$108........................-$141.........................-$196
Mileage Adjustment ........$2,128.......................$2,128.......................$2,128
Value ............................$6,106......................$7,327.......................$9,361
This simply demonstrates how inaccurate "book" value can be. I (and most any would be buyer) would jump at the chance to buy a 2006 LS in "outstanding condition" with 60,000 miles for $7327 in a private party transaction. Unfortunately, such deals don't (or only very rarely) exist.
02-06-20, 04:32 AM
