kfir

I know people might not give me an honest answer because this is a forum of ls 430 but you guys know the car better than anyone else!
I値l start with a little bit about myself so it might help you advise me if I should buy the car. I知 27, lives in Los Angeles, a student that works full time after serving in the Israeli military (that痴 why I知 studying only at age 27 and not earlier). I currently have a lease on Chevy equinox that is going to end on December, 2021. I started to think what am I going to do with my car, the chip shortage seems to make cars prices go up, and when I was looking on lease deals the prices were pretty high, around $2000 down and +$300/monthly payment. So I started to think if I should buy my Chevy equinox 2019 at the end of the lease because I can buy it only at $15k+tax but then, when I calculated the tax and everything I got that I will need to pay $18k which I don稚 have, so then I might need to finance it and it will end up more than $20,000. So I started to think maybe I should buy a used car that unfortunately their prices also went up. So, then I thought what are the important things for me in a car, and one of the things that are most important to me while driving is a smooth ride, and this is where I was first introduced with the ls 430, and OMG what a car... I found a good deal of $19,899 for ls 430 2006 with nav and 36k miles! But unfortunately because I don稚 have the money and there are tax to add to the car I will end up paying more than $25,000 for the car that I知 not sure is worth that. But I fall in love! The smooth of the ride, the comfort of the chair and the quite is everything I was looking for, not to mention the reliability! The sales person actually laughed at me because I知 only 27 and I知 interested in an elderly car, or at least a car that people of age 40 and above are interested in. So I started to look on other ls 430 models, and I知 not really sure if I should buy them. I am trying to keep my budget at max of $13,000 because I really can稚 afford anything higher right now and I tried to keep it like the amount that I would spend on a lease for 3 years. (On the Chevy equinox the total for the car is $9360). I know the car is very reliable but from what I was reading here in the forum people had some quite of fixes to do on the car, some got to $15,000 in couple of years. So I was wondering if should I buy LS 430 that reached to 90k-130k miles? Will I get to a circle of a continuing maintenance and fixing that it will cost me a lot to take care of this luxury car? I知 afraid that it this car is too old that the maintenance is pretty high... And I知 not even talking about the fuel that this car is obviously consuming more than new cars (and in LA when the lowest gas price right now is $3.9/gallon it can get quite expensive..). What year of the model should I buy? How is the suspension on this type of car that reached to such high mileage? Will I need to replace it soon? Because this is the main reaso why I want to buy this car. I was only leasing up until now that I haven稚 really had to deal with maintaining the car because they were all new. My wife has Hyundai Elantra 2014 and there is barely maintenance for the car and the cost of maintaining it is really low, so I知 debating if I should get a newer used car or should I get the ls 430because even though these cars are old, they are known for their reliability.
thank you so much for your time! I am sorry if the text is a little hard to read.

TominPT

Hi kfir. Welcome to the forum. Many of your questions have been covered in previous posts but I will recap what I think is the consensus.
1. Yes these cars are reliable and many owners report only needing to do routine maintenance. My car is an '05 with 130K miles and everything works and nothing has ever failed. The suspension is good, no leaks of any kind, etc. etc. But it was maintained by a dealer every 5000 miles until I purchased it a few years ago at 109K and I now do my own maintenance. Many others with higher mileage cars end up replacing some suspension components, deal with valve cover gasket leaks and a few other common problems such as the tilt/telescope motors for the steering wheel etc.
2. You can find excellent examples with 130K miles or less for $ 10-15K for the 04-06 model years. You will pay less, possibly a lot less, for earlier model years or cars with higher miles, or ones with accident history, lack of maintenance, poor cosmetics, etc etc. I would not hesitate to purchase a 130K mile car in any of the model years if it has complete maintenance history and was owned by 1 or 2 obviously caring owners, garage kept, with no obvious flaws, recent timing belt and water pump (due at 90K miles), and importantly no rust whatsoever.
3. A purchase of an LS 430 makes a lot more sense if you can do your own maintenance and simple repairs. The cost of ownership will kill you if you have to take it for a dealer to keep it maintained and repaired as necessary. Your wife's car is a good example of many newer cars with very low maintenance and repair costs and frankly they may make more sense if funds are limited. Examples any other Lexus model from the 2000-2006 years such as the ES, early Toyota Avalons, etc.

LS430inDE.

I own a 2005 and just turned 180,000 miles during my Fri-Sat trip yesterday. I bought it in 2009 with what I thought was "high mileage" around 50k miles if I recall correctly.

I drove two senior citizens (93 and 90 years old) from Delaware to Elk County PA. Pennsylvania is a beautiful state! I set the cruise control to 78mph and had good conversation mixed with nice music for nearly 4.5 hours of the voyage, one way. My fiance's father, who is 93, always comments he loves riding in the Lexus, and always asks me what year is it again, and how many miles do I have on it now, lol.

Not once did I think about the LS's reliability or ability to safely and comfortably transport a group of 4 adults (2 of them 90+ years old) on the 4.5 hour drive.

The only questions running through my mind were, does the rest stop require face coverings or not?! I'm happy to announce most rest stops did NOT require them.

I've owned my 2005 since 2009, and have loved every day of ownership. I have no passion or desire to find a replacement for my LS yet.

You can easily find a nice LS430 for your budget of $13,000 or less.

EDIT: I averaged 25.9MPG for this trip with the AC on both legs of the trip

demark1

Wow, long post....I will give a reply similar to that I have done before, also long.

I love my LS430, but it is aging. Passenger seat has a tear near seams ($850 quoted from upholsterer to replace seat bottom). Tilt broken ($800 but I don't are, it is positioned). DEFINITELY avoid the ultra due to air suspension. This car is NOT CHEAP.to keep unless you do your own maintenance. Dealer is especially outrageous, but convenient, and fortunately rare. Oddly, fewer things have brpken per year as car aged, but one check-engine-light series of issues ended up totalling around $3k..

Brakes for $350/axle every 30k miles or so since it has a stupid wear indicator (unless you bypass) that Lexus wants $200 to replace if yo let it go too far.... tires 40-60k miles if you buy carefully (some last much less). My current mileage reads 16.5 mpg at about 70% local...pure highway I used to get 28, now maybe a bit less. Timing Belt and water pump $1500 or so (NOT at dealer). Better not keep the battery over 3 years or it may spontaneously die. Brake flush every 3 years (probably all cars should). Trans fluid at 100k just because... I've also done differential fluid twice and power steering once. Spark plugs at 100k if I recall. Had bad experiences with independent mechanics and Lexus dealers have gotten VERY VERY pricey. Any diagnostic work figure $200.

I had the car under warranty for 6 years (CPO) and replaced telescoping wheel motor, 2 speaker, left mirror, height sensor (only in UL model), mirror switch brake actuator (clicked annoyingly. Shocked now that they actually covered it, I got it with that defect). Chrome wheels leak (regular alloys are fine)

Repairs for 1 cat (of 2)/o2 sensor/y-pipe/mass airflow sensor all happened around 2 years aho and maybe they misdiagnosed, but I had car in dealer 3x and it cost total of around $3k. That and a wheel bearing ($800)! are only true repairs (vs maintenance) I have had since the 6 year warranty that expired in 2015.

My used Cadillac XTS will never need a timing belt (and hopefully no chain). I got it at 1.5 years old, bur at 65k I still have the original brakes an just 1 minor repair to a brake bushing (small squeak). In its best days, the LS blew away my Cadillac. There is just no comparison in smoothness, engine etc. Not even close.. My XTS feels like an upscale Buick (and I owned a LeSabre for 15 years). Newer, the LS is simply beyond fantastic. And it is reliable: except for flat tires and battery, it has never left me stranded. My Buick had more issues of significance (manifold replacement, etc.) . But a 2016 year old XTS is around $20-30k and can be optioned with very nice bells and whistles. It is still a fine car, and feels much newer. You can't ignore the age thing totally. But I still trust my 16 year old LS more than any other car that was over 10 years old for sure (and I have kept ALL of my cars over 10 years).

Most of my little LS problems occurred EARLIER. Just the big $3000 thing 2 years ago, nothing new since then. But find a good independent mechanic and/or be prepared for bills of $1500 when you do brakes and fluids etc. every few years.. I have spent $15k maintaining the car but over 12 years, and it is aging but still highly reliable. I have the ultra and love the radar cruise (it also died at 50k under warranty, pattern failure in the computer), but recommend the Modern Luxury if you like the Marc Levison (check that subwoofer works). Avoid the UL due to the air suspension. But be prepared to do your own work, have a reliable mechanic, and/or pay when you do need repairs.

Suspension ages like any car. Test drive yours or have mechanic check bushings, control arms, etc. It probably won't ride like new. Exception is the UL where changing the shocks/struts is VERY expensive so you'd probably convert...

TominPT

Re: brake pads, changing them is really easy with the help of the tutorials on here and a few YouTube videos. My pads front pads lasted about 70K miles and cost me about $ 60 to replace with OEM pads. The rears have over 80K miles on them and still have plenty of meat on them. demark1 highlights well an example of ownership cost when you don't do your own repairs.
By the way, there was a great article in a recent Consumer Reports issue about repair costs for different vehicles, including some high end cars and more pedestrian models. The difference in repair costs for routine items between high end models and a low end model (the Ford Escape, IIRC) is frankly shocking.

another way to look at it is this: you pay $ 10K for a good example of the LS430, 04-06, CL or ML. You put another $ 5K into fixing anything and everything, new tires, etc. You put another $ 5 into the piggy bank for future issues. For $ 20K, you have a car that is just way better than anything you can drive off the lot today for twice that. And cruise across the country trouble free and in total style and comfort like LS430inDE reports.

Bocatrip

Wow... That is some gigantic very first post!!!! I find that new members tend to post longer posts but still get great info from our loyal members. As a 16 year long member of this forum, I could say with authority.. most info you will get for your interest on the LS430 should be helpful... but for someone who has owned a 21 year old example for 11 years... I can honestly say... Go for it! You can't go that wrong if it's a good example. One of the best cars ever made! good luck...

Striker223

These are awesome if you can work on it yourself, extremely well built in my opinion and also extremely easy to work. Never fights, huge amounts of room to get to stuff but the only drawback is parts are fairly hard to get relative to other stuff and expensive. Some stuff never really broke during the first 10 years so aftermarket support is zero and sometimes even the dealer network is of no help.

I bought mine as a reliable mindless daily at 200k and I'm at 230k after a year and change.

When I got it I went ahead and replaced the whole suspension (upper front arms had dead bushings, lowers were gone as well, shocks were not leaking but super weak, strut mounts and springs were also weak all around and springs are HARD to get now), all seals (dipstick, trans pan, valve covers and pvc all were leaking), all three motor mounts were torn but it was actually smoother still than nearly any other car I've driven, the water pump was leaking so I did the entire timing setup and crank seal, all maintenance item as well. Oh and the entire steering system other than the pump and rack, inners, outers, ball joints, and the front and rear sway links and bushings since I always do that when I buy a new car.

Nothing I did was really needed and it could have been driven for at least 50k more but I like always resetting a car to "zero" when I get one. Only real issue I ran into was the engine blew up on me at 227k due to the prior owners abusing it via never changing oil, still served me well with at least 85 120mph pulls and three drag strip visits and a lot of redline. Easy and cheap swap if it blows though, be careful the last owner wasn't an idiot with oil

These are old cars that are very well made but are old to the point you need a low mile one or be able to fix it yourself. I like mine but my next car will be a 2013 460 even if it's not made as well or to last like the 430 was, it's a fact though that it's starting to get hard to get parts for the 3rd gen LS and that's a deal breaker for me.

CA2WALS430

I don't DIY anything that involves grease or tensioning, hah. In my experience with 2 of these, the straight mechanical stuff is Toyota, and normal pricing applies. What you get into with a top-line Lexus are all the 'Lexus things', which rarely fail, but sometimes they do and that stuff will add up. Still these cars will not soak you like a German will, or an American.

@kfir I saw the car you are looking at in LA, gorgeous! 2 things: 1-it is over-priced (partly because it is consignment), and 2-I looked it up on the Lexus Owners site, and unless the owner has other service records, there is no record of that car being touched since 2012! In 2012 it had 25k on it. 10k miles in 9 years, and potentially 9 years with no service???.....ehhhh.
**Many people on this site will advise you that a well-maintained and driven 100k on these is better than an almost-never-used 36k. If I was going for that car in LA (rare CL with leather upgrade package, and the interior is Ecru, not gray), I would not leave town before I dumped $2500 into it, all fluids and belts, etc.

It is an amazing car though. These are great cars for sure, but they can have their moments.

kfir

First of all thank you all very much for your response and your time helping me with my decision I really appreciate that!
Thank you! I tried to look in carfax but it seems that not many vehicles have a detailed car history so I guess I am kind of lost in trying to get something that is very well maintained. I actually wasn't planning to take the car to the dealership because they charge a lot, but I did think to take the car for a mechanic that will maintain and fix my car every time that I'll need to... is it still going to be expensive? I Guess my main question is if this car will require me to have more maintenance service and repairs than a newer used car because it reached to the point that it is very old.

Thank you! it is an amazing car! I can't stop thinking about this car but I am a little afraid that it is a little bit out of my league, for a rookie with bare experience in cars. Also, I am not sure if there are still parts for the vehicle to maintain, and how much it cost to get those parts, because I am sure that I will need to run some fixes but I don't want to get stuck with something that is unrepairable or expensive to repair...

Thank you for your response. So bottom line from what I understand from you, you spent on avg $1250 per year on repairing and maintaining your car.. May I know how many miles you have driven in it? what I am afraid is that buying a car with high mileage like 120k miles, will get me very fast to high-cost repairs as you had, I guess it is kind of risky to take such an old car with high mileage. From what you wrote at the beginning it seems that many things broke down like sensors, mirrors, speakers, and more, fortunately, you had your car under warranty but it does make me a little scared that all these things broke down pretty early and I do not have any warranty on the car... Another guy here said in the post the parts for the vehicle are becoming rare, how are you manage to repair the car? for me, I am worst worried about suspension because this is the main thing why I want to buy the car, and if I buy a car with high mileage I will probably need to replace the suspension.

Ok good to know, I didn't know that replacing pads is that easy, last time I just sent my wife's car to the mechanic to replace the pads. I guess then it will be a better choice for me to buy the lexus with the 36k miles in $20,000? because this money is going to be spent on the car anyway from what you are saying... And I am still worried about suspension on this car, how can I fix and repair the car if parts are becoming rare? is it a good time to invest in this car right now when maybe in the near future I won't be able to truly repair it?
Thanks! it is an amazing car! I love it! but I am a little bit worried about the very old age of the car and the difficulty and the cost to fix it... what do you think? is it worth investing now in the car when it is really hard and hard to repair?
Thank you very much for your response! to be honest, you scared me a little bit with how difficult it is to repair the car, I don't if this car is a good fit for a rookie like me that was spoiled by having new cars with barely maintenance that was covered by the dealerships... it seems that you spent a lot of money of fixing the car, may I ask how much did you pay? and how were you able to find a whole new suspension? after your comment, I was looking for new suspension systems for the car and the only ones I found were for lowering the car and make it more of a sport-type car. I really want the car but it is not worth to spend money on a car the in the near future will be unrepairable...
Yes! I had a test drive on that car and I was so impressed! a 2006 model, with such low miles and in great condition! it drove like everything I have a dream of a car! but yes, the price is quite expensive.. I started to look at more ls430 models with higher mileage so I can it can fit my budget. actually, all the cars I have found are from dealerships, is there a website to find and buy used cars from owners? I am trying to see if in the long run, the maintenance on the car will exceed other newer used cars that I can buy.

Ellesse

It sounds like low cost and low maintenance are high on your priority list.
LS430s are great cars, but they are getting up there in age now and regardless of mileage they will need more and more to keep going.
if I'm you, I'm looking for an accord, camry, sonata, something on those lines. They go forever and even if they break down they're cheap and easy to fix. And honestly many of them will have more creature comforts and better safety than a Lexus that's 10+ years older than it

CA2WALS430

@kfir , that is cool that you drove it. I like the fact that it is a consignment sale, so that is almost like a private sale car, but I will bet the dealer is into that car for $3,000, so every offer you make they present the owner with $3,000 less. Private sale cars are mostly on Craigslist, but occasionally pop up on Auto Trader and Cars.com also.

While I agree these cars are great and sort of "bulletproof", I also agree with @Ellesse . If budget is a huge concern, stay Japanese, but go with the non-luxury labels. If you like biggish sedans, look into Avalons.

Not sure where you are in LA, but in the 9 years I lived there, I used these guys for all my service and really like them:
https://automotiveinstincts.com/bran...oodland-hills/

demark1

Kfir, to answer your question, I got car with 35k miles in 2009. extended CPO was to 100k in 2015. I now have 142k miles. First 8 years wife drove around 11k / year, now I drive it primarily and work from home, so around 4k / year. Some expenses of the 15k are because I like changing fluids / doing spark plugs at desired interval, but I would say brakes were $2200 (2 sets on front, 3 on back + 1 change of rotors) of that, tires were $2000 (two new sets, latest are still like new), timing belt/waterpump twice $2500 (I am not convinced the first shop actually ever did it, sadly. Change v-belt once. Never changed any hoses yet.

I may have gotten fleeced with the timing belt first time, hence water pump leaked at 140k and I drove it (!) to a new mechanic nearby to fix water pump and might as well do timing belt again since the car was open. The under-warranty items were a couple when I first got the car (CPO but ordered it from Chicago and I live in NY... the car had some initial flaws). The biggest affect Ultra Luxury only (cruise computer and height sensor) so if you get Modern Luxury (or Premium) you will not face that. Nothing affecting overall drivability. If you make sure the car works completely AT FIRST, there is no reason to expect lots of problems, just that there may be some. The 3k on emissions was my biggest headache and cost at one time (over 2-3 months really). I think dealer threw parts at it based on codes. First a cat, then a y-pipe/o2. then finally a new mass airflow sensor. They kept my car for a month the last time as I said I didnt want another CEL going off within the two months or I would be very upset. The MAF was $500 from them and I had a loaner for a month (es350). I felt guilty driving their loaner for that long, but THEY kept the car with no update. I had people telling me to sell the car, but I refused just for a check engine light, after I had had in in twice already, and it was fixed in the end, I guess 3rd time was the charm. Nice way to test-drive a new Lexus, I will admit, although that was definitely not my goal.

By the way, the es350 was far more modern in design, interior in better shape, etc. But it felt pedestrian to me, like an imitation of luxury. Maybe it is the V8, I don't know, and the ride of the LS. I didn't like the adaptive cruise on the steering wheel (vs a separate stalk), I hated the touchpad NAV. etc. When I got my LS430 back, it felt old and kind of old-leather smell, a bit frumpy condition even after detailing it. It was elegant but more beat up, and I realized the difference. But driving it daily, with its great visibility, taller roofline, smooth V8 (alas with the sucky gas mileage), and just general feel, I prefer my 16 year old LS430. I do not dislike the es350, but it just didn't do anything much for me. I'd rather by a cadillac XTS or especially a genesis g80 or g90 (I do tend to prefer sedans to SUVs having rented SUVs several times). I wish my LS430 were newer-looking, but I still love driving it. So if your car is fine at first when you get it, don't expect tons of issues. Mine were over twelve years, and mostly in the first 6. Something here, something there that I could live with until I went to dealer once a year to take car of (except the CEL which I went in for immediately). You may never have issues, but you need to expect that there will be some, at a couple of hundred dollars on up -- maybe much higher. If I have to bring my car on once every year or two now, that is fine by me. Given that a new Camry can cost up to nearly 40k I am saving money keeping this, even at occasionally outrageous repairs. As long as it stays reliable and safe, I will keep it, even with a few cosmetic issues.

mpit

I have driven an LS430 2006 for the past ten years. It has 169,000 miles of mostly repair free driving. I just bought a LS430 03 with 37,000 miles on it. The LS430 is one of the best built cars ever. Yes buy an LS430. It is a great car. I also drive a 93 SC400 and a p11 Carrera.

Jabberwock

Purchased my 2006 LS in 2009 with 13k miles on it. Now has 135k miles. In that time the driver mirror was replaced under warranty. Also LCA and front shocks were replaced in 2016 - cost approx $1600. Other than that nothing but brake pads, tires, TB/WP service at 90k, oil and filters, spark plugs at 105k. Car still runs and operates like its maybe one year old. Engine at idle is glass smooth and totally silent. Probably the best factory built luxury car every made. Take the time to find and buy a well maintained example that hasn't been trashed and you will love it.

Striker223

Car cost me $5000, I spent about 2300 on parts and fluids ETC, all the work was done by me but would have been over 14k to have done. The car is very easy to work on though, like unrealistically so for a 20 year old car and what that normally means for service, literally as easy as working on a 3 year old car that has a very simple configuration like a charger or something for example.

Now keep in mind I wanted anything that was not perfect fixed, I drive this car over 140 from time to time and I don't like it behaving weirdly over 100. You won't need to do as much as I did most likely but suspension parts are very much drying up. It took me months to get a new set of springs for my car and I had to have custom bushings made for the rear lower arms since it's nearly impossible to get Lexus ones now.

Its just stuff like that you need to be aware of, a LS460 will have parts support for at least one more decade and since it had so many issues early on there are a LOT of great options for suspention unlike the 430 that didn't have any issues for the first 12 or so years. In my opinion and action taken when I was looking for my first car (up to this vehicle I drove/drive full size trucks and SUVs and I wanted something small for a change) I firmly believe the 430 is a better made car than the 460 to the extent I would and did pick a 430 twice over the 07-12 460.

However even my sub 65k mile 06 garage queen pales in comparison IMO to a 2013+ 460 in terms of driving comfort, quietness, and plain power, quality is not as high but it's a car that I can get parts for and is not THAT much harder to work on. I say that from the perspective of someone who does engine replacements at home so bear I mind my version of "easy" might be impossible for some.

The LS has no equal in the Lexus product line, the ES is nice but is a toy in comparison and simply is not on the same level. Still nice cars but nothing compared to any LS, even a 1990 LS400 is better than all but the newest ES in every way.