Helmar

http://www.autospies.com/news/Lexus-LS460-vs-Volkswagen-Phaeton-4-2-V8-4Motion-18138

rominl

iTrader: (4)

is the phaeton always awd? maybe they should use a touring package to compare instead?

it's funny on the braking, coz' between the 7 series, s class, and ls, the ls has much better brakes (from my test drive). i haven't driven the phaeton before so i don't know, but i remember from the japanese video a while back testing between the several cars, the ls stopped the car well before other competitors.

if anything, maybe it's the braking feel again?

Gojirra99

The brakes are fine :
http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dl...THISWEEKSISSUE

Brakes & handling bumps completely contrary to germancarzone review, given it's a German car site, what do you expect ? . . .

The LS460L Touring Package gets very positive review in handling from the current Sports Car International magazine too.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

lol, honestly? to me it's just another review

Luxofreak

I thought the Phaeton was taken out of the US market after the fiasco its electric system was.

I think the Phaeton is history. Who drives a VW anyways....?

Johnny

Phaeton was just an Audi A8 in disguise. The problem is nobody bought it, literally & figuratively. VW has since drawn back and will stick to what it does best. The last one I saw in an Audi showroom (ironically enough) was pretty nice, but I just couldn't bring myself to buy it new, even at $30K below sticker price (that was their asking price - I could have gone deeper). In the end, I couldn't get the Ford Edsel out of my head that day, as considering the pitifully low sales VW was only able to achieve, I knew if I sprung for it, I'd be stuck with a sweetheart like this...

miniround

not to burst your bubble or anything, but the phaeton is now being designed into a 2 door coupe version also.

just thought i'd let you know.

LexFather

Actually the Phaeton was not an A8 in disguise. It probably is the BETTER vehicle. We are talking state of the art from the ground up, including a factory you can eat off the floors.

Of course, who the HELL wants to buy a 60-90k VW? No one! It was dropped here and sales a lil better in Europe. You can buy a used one for 30k. That is a TREMENDOUS BUY.

However its a bish to keep. Only certain mechanics can work on it and VW service is probably the worst. The usual German quality headaches.

Looking past the VW badge, this is an extraordinary car with some worlds firsts like the 4 zone climate control. You are getting top luxury for less $$$$$ but can you get past the badge?

I can't, like most prospective buyers.

LexFather

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_Phaeton

LexFather

The Phaeton's platform, the D3 platform, is shared with the Bentley Continental GT and Bentley Continental Flying Spur. Certain systems such as the transmission and some engines are shared with the Audi A8.

Itsuki_23

This (AMS) Auto Motor und Sport review is full of it. German magazine...
All European LS460-s come with adjustable air suspenison, which in Sport mode is very firm. Stock European market LS460 brakes are the same that you have with the Touring Package in US. 14.6 (370mm) inches front and 13.2 (336mm) in the rear, the brake calipers are HUGE, size of a split watermelon . LS460 brakes are so good its even scary how fast such an huge car can brake for example from 100mph to 0. For example the most powerful luxury sedan in the segment S600 Mercedes (512hp) has Front 351-mm Disc and Rear 320-mm disc.
If you select the option without rear cooler in the armrest and rear electric seats etc. then the LS460 trunk is massive - same size as the Phaeton. I bet AMS didn't mention that.
Phaeton is afterall a VW - it shares some of the *****, bits and pieces with cheaper smaller VW's, I bet AMS didn't mention that.

Pointless German review. Germans are slowly loosing market share in their home turf and there is ongoing full war against the japanese in German automotive journalism.

encore888

Good points, Itsuki!

This survey seems rather extreme. The Passionate Pursuit blog sums it up well:

Luxofreak

It's not about the badge, the Audi A8 parts or the D3 Bentley platform. This lame VW attempt to get into the luxury market is completely pleagued with electrical problems.

Thermactor

iTrader: (1)

Yep, in the longer run the Lexus is the very clear winner, and the VW buyer is the very clear loser. VWs would be some of the best cars on the road if they didn't have crap build quality.