Are you disappointed with your LS460?
11-02-12, 02:26 PM
#32
Intermediate
Thread Starter
Update
(I had posted this to the wrong forum)
Hi all, After getting independent diagnoses from three sources that there was a suspension problem, I took the car to Lexus San Diego. I didn't go until I was sure there was a problem.
The shop chief and I took a test ride. He recognized "diving when braking" immediately, said there is a free front suspension "update" that would fix the problem. He showed me the bulletin; it exactly described the problem,.
He soon came back, perplexed: The update was for 2007-2010 LS's; the problem was supposed to have been fixed in 2011 models. He checked the VIN to be certain it's a 2011 model, and also that it's not a Sport version. I think we can agree that he wouldn't have done that unless he had experienced the problem during the test drive.
He thinks it is probably a control arm problem. They will put it on a lift check them. The suspension shop had done this and found them loose, so the Lexus shop should find the same thing, and install/replace as necessary under the warranty. I say "should" because with car dealers one never knows.
The shop chief said that was all they could do (if they do it), there is nothing else that affects ride and braking, other than tires, and I have Michelin Energy Saver on order at a tire shop.
I'll keep you posted.
Latest (11/2) An "area" tech happened to be there, and he and the same man who'd recognized the "diving when braking" when we did a test drive and shown me the updating control arms bulletin for it--this time didn't notice any problem . Neither (unsurprisingly) did the area tech. The shop said they'd checked the control arms and bearings and the movement was within specs.
We all probably at some time have heard/felt something that a shop didn't. The ride might be considered too subjective, so I dropped that as a problem. The dive and snap back isn't subtle. It's expected from hard braking at, say, 60mph. But it happens even when stopping from 5 mph, or less. It's not normal, it didn't happen when I test drove a 2010 460 last week.
The dealer Repair Manager says he drove it and it didn't snap when braking, though he acknowledged that he hadn't been told of a braking problem. He's going to arrange a test drive with me and an area tech. I'm not optimistic that they'll acknowledge the brake problem. When a dealership and/or manufacturer don't know the solution to something under warranty, there tends to be no problem. It won't matter that the shop chief had recognized it, before he didn't (it's campaign time, and changing positions runs rampant). It's like saying you don't notice your pants are on fire, I've little doubt it won't be noticed in the upcoming test ride.
If anyone is interested, let me know, and I'll post what happened next.
Hi all, After getting independent diagnoses from three sources that there was a suspension problem, I took the car to Lexus San Diego. I didn't go until I was sure there was a problem.
The shop chief and I took a test ride. He recognized "diving when braking" immediately, said there is a free front suspension "update" that would fix the problem. He showed me the bulletin; it exactly described the problem,.
He soon came back, perplexed: The update was for 2007-2010 LS's; the problem was supposed to have been fixed in 2011 models. He checked the VIN to be certain it's a 2011 model, and also that it's not a Sport version. I think we can agree that he wouldn't have done that unless he had experienced the problem during the test drive.
He thinks it is probably a control arm problem. They will put it on a lift check them. The suspension shop had done this and found them loose, so the Lexus shop should find the same thing, and install/replace as necessary under the warranty. I say "should" because with car dealers one never knows.
The shop chief said that was all they could do (if they do it), there is nothing else that affects ride and braking, other than tires, and I have Michelin Energy Saver on order at a tire shop.
I'll keep you posted.
Latest (11/2) An "area" tech happened to be there, and he and the same man who'd recognized the "diving when braking" when we did a test drive and shown me the updating control arms bulletin for it--this time didn't notice any problem . Neither (unsurprisingly) did the area tech. The shop said they'd checked the control arms and bearings and the movement was within specs.
We all probably at some time have heard/felt something that a shop didn't. The ride might be considered too subjective, so I dropped that as a problem. The dive and snap back isn't subtle. It's expected from hard braking at, say, 60mph. But it happens even when stopping from 5 mph, or less. It's not normal, it didn't happen when I test drove a 2010 460 last week.
The dealer Repair Manager says he drove it and it didn't snap when braking, though he acknowledged that he hadn't been told of a braking problem. He's going to arrange a test drive with me and an area tech. I'm not optimistic that they'll acknowledge the brake problem. When a dealership and/or manufacturer don't know the solution to something under warranty, there tends to be no problem. It won't matter that the shop chief had recognized it, before he didn't (it's campaign time, and changing positions runs rampant). It's like saying you don't notice your pants are on fire, I've little doubt it won't be noticed in the upcoming test ride.
If anyone is interested, let me know, and I'll post what happened next.
11-02-12, 05:01 PM
#33
OP - if you're still having issues, I have a mechanic friend at Tustin Lexus that may be able to diagnose the problem. He's taken apart my suspension multiple times (even just for experimenting) and is very familiar with the car. If you need a referral, please feel free to PM me.
11-03-12, 11:10 AM
#36
Intermediate
Thread Starter
catching up with replies
SW--I drove a 2010 LS 460 at Carmax last week. It didn't "dive and snap" when braking, and rode smoother. However, that means nothing to dealers who might have to repair cars under warranty. Note that the shop chief who experienced dive and snap when test driving with me, "'didn't find it" when test driving the car with an "area" tech. I anticipate frustration with Lexus, whose 'area rep" has already found nothing wrong in a "test drive," and that I will sell the car at a loss.
JM--I was told the multi-function display doesn't show TP, just if it falls below a certain number. I reduced TP from recommended 33 psi to 30 psi because the ride is too harsh at 33. It makes a discernible, but not great, difference.
GH--Your experience seems to be like mine--the 400 is quieter than the 460.
Lex--I don't think my 460 is representative of all of them. My mistake was buying the car without test driving it (long story, I thought it's a LEXUS 460 with less than 13K miles--What could be bad?)
All--I read and appeciate your comments.
JM--I was told the multi-function display doesn't show TP, just if it falls below a certain number. I reduced TP from recommended 33 psi to 30 psi because the ride is too harsh at 33. It makes a discernible, but not great, difference.
GH--Your experience seems to be like mine--the 400 is quieter than the 460.
Lex--I don't think my 460 is representative of all of them. My mistake was buying the car without test driving it (long story, I thought it's a LEXUS 460 with less than 13K miles--What could be bad?)
All--I read and appeciate your comments.
11-03-12, 12:24 PM
#37
SW--I drove a 2010 LS 460 at Carmax last week. It didn't "dive and snap" when braking, and rode smoother. However, that means nothing to dealers who might have to repair cars under warranty. Note that the shop chief who experienced dive and snap when test driving with me, "'didn't find it" when test driving the car with an "area" tech. I anticipate frustration with Lexus, whose 'area rep" has already found nothing wrong in a "test drive," and that I will sell the car at a loss.
JM--I was told the multi-function display doesn't show TP, just if it falls below a certain number. I reduced TP from recommended 33 psi to 30 psi because the ride is too harsh at 33. It makes a discernible, but not great, difference.
GH--Your experience seems to be like mine--the 400 is quieter than the 460.
Lex--I don't think my 460 is representative of all of them. My mistake was buying the car without test driving it (long story, I thought it's a LEXUS 460 with less than 13K miles--What could be bad?)
All--I read and appeciate your comments.
JM--I was told the multi-function display doesn't show TP, just if it falls below a certain number. I reduced TP from recommended 33 psi to 30 psi because the ride is too harsh at 33. It makes a discernible, but not great, difference.
GH--Your experience seems to be like mine--the 400 is quieter than the 460.
Lex--I don't think my 460 is representative of all of them. My mistake was buying the car without test driving it (long story, I thought it's a LEXUS 460 with less than 13K miles--What could be bad?)
All--I read and appeciate your comments.
11-13-12, 06:07 PM
#39
Intermediate
Thread Starter
I've no idea. I don't know what 3/4 of the buttons, switches, adjustments do. In fact, if you know how to activate the mpg indicator, please tell me. I wonder how many owners read the entire 820 page owners manual (plus two submanuals.) A Lexus employee told me when he bought his wife an LS 460 and presented her with the manual, she said, "It's bigger than the bible, and I don't read THAT."
My impressions of the ride are correct. The dealer technician to whom falls the job of riding as passenger when people test drive Lexuses told me that a number of people have test-driven other LS 460's because, like me, they didn't believe this was a LEXUS suspension and ride. Unfortunately, it is. I'll post the end of the saga of my experiences with and conclusions about the 2011 LS 460 in more detail when I have more time.
My impressions of the ride are correct. The dealer technician to whom falls the job of riding as passenger when people test drive Lexuses told me that a number of people have test-driven other LS 460's because, like me, they didn't believe this was a LEXUS suspension and ride. Unfortunately, it is. I'll post the end of the saga of my experiences with and conclusions about the 2011 LS 460 in more detail when I have more time.
11-18-12, 02:04 PM
#40
I've no idea. I don't know what 3/4 of the buttons, switches, adjustments do. In fact, if you know how to activate the mpg indicator, please tell me. I wonder how many owners read the entire 820 page owners manual (plus two submanuals.) A Lexus employee told me when he bought his wife an LS 460 and presented her with the manual, she said, "It's bigger than the bible, and I don't read THAT." .
Did you ever try hitting that big DISP button on the steering wheel?
It is really not that hard nor do you need to read the owners manual. I hope you fixed your car..
11-18-12, 06:47 PM
#41
Intermediate
Thread Starter
Where in the manual...
...does it address the mpg that appears as "average mpg"? Is that the average at the speed you're going; average since the last fillup; average since the last reset. I know about the DISP button.
I set the other mpg display after filling up. It's hard to understand how to read it, and what it means. What page in the manual explains it?
The ride was not improved by installing Michelins, though it is quieter. The thud over every bump, the dive and jerk back when braking is there, unless I carefully "feather" the brake,requiring paying much attention to braking, even from a couple of mph.
One of the new Michelins blew a sidewall, and I must wait while it's ordered. Speed and road hazard didn't do it: I was creeping along in the ramp to an underground garage when the tire pressure warning came on. I'm beginning to think the car is jinxed.
The local dealer let me drive another 2011 460, and it was almost as bad a ride, though braking was better.
The car is "Certified PreOwned," with 161 things checked. Newport Lexus apparently overlooked that all wheels were out of alignment and a tire out of balance--found by Lexus San Diego. Of course the car drove better after alignment and new tires, but the harsh ride is unchanged.
I set the other mpg display after filling up. It's hard to understand how to read it, and what it means. What page in the manual explains it?
The ride was not improved by installing Michelins, though it is quieter. The thud over every bump, the dive and jerk back when braking is there, unless I carefully "feather" the brake,requiring paying much attention to braking, even from a couple of mph.
One of the new Michelins blew a sidewall, and I must wait while it's ordered. Speed and road hazard didn't do it: I was creeping along in the ramp to an underground garage when the tire pressure warning came on. I'm beginning to think the car is jinxed.
The local dealer let me drive another 2011 460, and it was almost as bad a ride, though braking was better.
The car is "Certified PreOwned," with 161 things checked. Newport Lexus apparently overlooked that all wheels were out of alignment and a tire out of balance--found by Lexus San Diego. Of course the car drove better after alignment and new tires, but the harsh ride is unchanged.
11-24-12, 11:19 AM
#42
Driver School Candidate
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: New Jersey
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My LS460 compared to my previous BMW 745
I went from a 2004 BMW 745 to a 2009 LS460, and I am very disappointed. The ride, noise, responsiveness, and roominess in the car are not as good as the 2004 bimmer. Also, I found numerous little things that are annoying and inadequate such as:
Any one of these annoyances alone is not a big deal. But all together, they make me hate the car.
- Steering wheel heater warms about 40% on the wheel only, forcing the driver to keep hands in one place .
- There is no light under the hood.
- The Nav is inaccessible while driving (major disappointment).
- No pockets or trays in the car for storage. No place to put keys, unless you use the cup holder.
- Many buttons are not visible as they are hidden behind steering wheel, such as park control and steering heat.
- engine knocks at idle.
- not compatible with iPhone. I couldn't download my phone book. My 2004 BMW was compatible with the iPhone.
- fuse boxes ridiculously inaccessible. You need to be a contortionist to test them or replace fuses - not kidding!
- Cornering and handling is generally poor.
- The car beeps a lot to a point that the beeps get ignored, reducing the effectiveness of the warnings. Sometimes I don't know why the car is beeping.
- if by mistake you shut the car in neutral and leave it, it rolls if on an incline!! One would expect this from a cheap car, but not a 70K luxury vehicle.
- I can go and on...
Any one of these annoyances alone is not a big deal. But all together, they make me hate the car.
11-24-12, 12:37 PM
#43
The ride was not improved by installing Michelins, though it is quieter. The thud over every bump, the dive and jerk back when braking is there, unless I carefully "feather" the brake,requiring paying much attention to braking, even from a couple of mph.
One of the new Michelins blew a sidewall, and I must wait while it's ordered. Speed and road hazard didn't do it: I was creeping along in the ramp to an underground garage when the tire pressure warning came on. I'm beginning to think the car is jinxed.
One of the new Michelins blew a sidewall, and I must wait while it's ordered. Speed and road hazard didn't do it: I was creeping along in the ramp to an underground garage when the tire pressure warning came on. I'm beginning to think the car is jinxed.
11-24-12, 12:45 PM
#44
Instructions for the DIY wind noise repair are here: https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls4...noise-fix.html
11-24-12, 02:23 PM
#45