Devh

Unfortunately that chump change can cost the company millions. If it was a safety issue then it is their obligation but for something like this as well as other TSBs most all makes will not be recalled because it's mostly cosmetic.
My car is still under warranty and I probably could ask them to fix it my way but to be frank its such an easy fix and I do not want the hassle of having to explain my version of the fix to the service writer who probably thinks I'm a overzealous nut case. It will be wasted time and energy when I can be doing something else with my time like fixing the issue.

Some people tend to believe the word of mouth from the dealerships but until you actually talk to the head service technician or an actual engineer you will find that in most cases you are more knowledgeable about your own car.

is150

iTrader: (10)

How'd the road test go? This fix the wind noise?

Devh

It was raining all day and the car is clean. I will have it out tomorrow but keep in mind that What ever I report maybe premature because only one side has been fitted. I will have the passenger side Monday.

jmcraney

That's a good question. I think the most important thing to keep in mind is that there were many thousands of 2007, 2008, 2009 and 2010 LSs that didn't have a wind noise problem. So, changing the trim to the part with the vortex-generator that came with the 2013 models can not offer any wind noise improvement as there is no room for improvement. There were thousands of cars in those model years that did have a "wind noise" problem and the cause of that problem in most of those cars was that the "triangle-trim" on the front doors was detached. I have tried to explain many times what causes the trim detachment and I will try once again. On some of the cars, If you apply the trim to the car and press on it as hard as you can, some of the contact tape will not ever contact the car because of the way that trim saddles on the window gasket. And on some of the cars you may be able to press hard enough to get contact tape to fully contact the car, but that leaves the window gasket compressed under the trim and that leaves the contact tape under residual tension and will cause it to separate over time. And the window glass moves through that area and pushes out every time it is operated. The wind noise affected cars really had a "noise isolation" problem and the characteristic that separates the inside from the noises outside was compromised by the the detached trim. This noise isolation problem was evident even when the car was sitting still and can't possibly be helped by the addition of a vortex generator. There are two ways to deal with the trim detachment. One would be to put a glob of sealant under the trim when you apply it. If you have read the discussion thread you will see that that is the first approach that I tried. It gave a significant improvement but not perfection and it was messy and hard to gauge how much sealant to use. The metal plate offers a much more certain fix. The reason that works so well is that it is a two step process that allows the area to be completely sealed with no regard to the trim and then the trim is applied, with no residual tension, just for cosmetics. It takes a couple days because of curing time. The sealant that I suggested is slow curing and that equates to low shrinkage and no residual tension. About your question, if the new part is only different on the outside then you would need to trim off the registration pins and remove the contact gasket and use the metal plate and sealant. If the new part has some changes to the part that attaches to the car such as different contact gasket arrangement then you would not want to use the metal plate or sealant. If your car doesn't have a wind noise problem I wouldn't expect any improvement with the addition of the vortex generator.

Devh

I had a chance to drive the car and here are my impressions.
You have to keep in mind that sealant has already been applied to the cracks so it will not be known if the majority of the fix was the sealant or the new trim. What I can tell you is the difference between the old piece and the new as it stands.

There is at least a 10-20% reduction in wind sound which isn't significant but what I found remarkable is no more sound of the wind pitch that makes it obvious there is turbulence. Under 50 mph the car is well isolated and after 50 mph you can then hear a steady increase in wind noise that increases with speed. Prior to this I could hear it get progressively louder at 10mph and above. So there is an improvement to a level where you do not think there is something obviously wrong but at the same time the car is not bank vault tight but I don't expect it to be. I would say the road noise matches well with the wind noise and appears to be normal. Sounds from other cars passing you is also very quiet.

I have built my own computer as a hobby and I have chosen parts that were dedicated to provide the least amount of sound. It got to the point of obsession that I felt that something was still humming so I investigated trying to isolate the sound and to my amazement the humming was the refrigerator coming from the next room. Because my computer is so quiet the ticking on the clock on the wall is loud and so is the keyboard when I type.

The LS 460s cabin is so quiet any external sounds however light they maybe are more noticeable and can be more distracting if it fluctuates randomly. With this new fix if you turn the radio on even at a low volume all of that wind noise is no longer herd.

In a nutshell I do believe I have experience a difference, not in overall sound reduction but to the point where the wind nose no longer sounds like a cold and windy night rustling sound.

Lextrician

for the time price and piece of mind it is worth it. I did the wind noise fix and although suttle it worked, be in mind that I had put rims and the cabin noise is changed significantly with the tire noise but compared to other car it is night and day. great observation.

Devh

You don't realize how quiet it is until you snap your fingers and its loud. There is a trade off and lets say for argument sake you eliminated all of the wind sound then the road noise would be more prominent or every little creak of this car will drive you nuts. So I think you need a balance of sounds to create a kind of masking. The way the car was before was unacceptable and now if someone drove the car they would not pick up on the wind noise.

tyrenfroe

Sounds like a matter of "be careful what you wish for" once again. Ain't life a *****?

I8ABMR

My concern is taking what was done apart and then creating some new issue that I didnt have before

Devh

If you are satisfied what what you have done then there is no point in touching it. My wind nose problem was a high pitch howl especially during a cross wind.. Adding sealant and using aluminum tape double up as a patch reduced the sound significantly however that characteristic pitch was still there and I could tell where it was coming from. With this new trim it's gone and whatever wind nose there is sounds like white noise that cannot be localized. I'm going to the dealer to pick up the other piece and maybe tomorrow if it's dry out I will test again.

ryan78

iTrader: (2)

It's supposed to snow 5in tomorrow. Lol. Think you may have to table until the weekend. Interested to hear of your results.

Devh

Not again. The passenger side piece is on the car now and I guess having to wait until the weekend which will give the sealant a good bond. If I didn't have the car cleaned I wouldn't mind taking it out.

Devh

I was able to drive the car today and re-evaluate with the passenger side piece added.

I'm happy to report that the wind noise is completely gone and all I hear is road noise that is isolated to the tires. My tires are louder then new because they are in need of replacement soon and when I got to a smooth part of the road I noticed that the road noise diminished and no wind noise could be heard even above 60mph.

Your millage may vary with this fix but I do sincerely believe this is the fix.

It would be nice if someone can purchase the pieces and report their findings to confirm my observation.

wjg18

Where exactly did you add the sealant and did the clips break off of the old pieces when you removed them? Were they difficult to remove?

Devh

There are white clips that are designed to break off when you remove the piece. I imagine it was designed this way so the piece can be re-installed if you had access to replacement white clips.

The old piece was very easy to remove. Just grab a corner and pull slow with force behind it.

Please check the wind noise thread for where to apply sealant on the body of the car and when you install the new piece add sealant on the bottom of the tabs before insertion and that's it.