14' ES 350 lease to 12' LS 460L, is it a good move?
09-23-15, 06:02 AM
#17
Driver
Thread Starter
New deal...?
What do you think of the 2011 version of the LS 460 specifically the sport version? Looking at a 2011 LS 460 Sport with 80K miles in very good shape? Would you trade it for a 2014 ES 350 (lease) with 6500 miles on it in "like new" condition (of course) considering that fuel economy is not an issue and payments will remain the same? I cannot afford the 2012 or 2013 models presently since I will have to pay more and cannot justify the extra cash. What are your thoughts? Thanks.
Last edited by docmarioce; 09-23-15 at 06:19 AM. Reason: add info.
09-23-15, 07:58 AM
#18
Lexus Test Driver
Personally, since you seem to very budget conscious, which is a great thing, I would just exercise patience, enjoy the new ES, save some money over the next few years and keep an eye out for a '12-'14.
From the sounds of it, you really want an LS.
Granted these cars can take the miles, and as long as they have been cared for, there are great representative models with higher miles.
However, an '11 with 80k miles...it just seems that if you have a little more patience, you'll be able to find a good deal and a much lower mileage car.
The new ES is a nice car!
My situation was similar, in that I really wanted an LS and was willing to settle for an older model with higher mileage (80k-90k range). But I waited a few months and came across a model that had been well cared for with 65k on the clock, and best of all, a great price.
Mine is much older (07), but the theory is the same.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
From the sounds of it, you really want an LS.
Granted these cars can take the miles, and as long as they have been cared for, there are great representative models with higher miles.
However, an '11 with 80k miles...it just seems that if you have a little more patience, you'll be able to find a good deal and a much lower mileage car.
The new ES is a nice car!
My situation was similar, in that I really wanted an LS and was willing to settle for an older model with higher mileage (80k-90k range). But I waited a few months and came across a model that had been well cared for with 65k on the clock, and best of all, a great price.
Mine is much older (07), but the theory is the same.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
09-23-15, 11:37 AM
#19
One think to keep in mind with the Sport is it has the air suspension, which gives you one more potential repair bill (new air shocks). Those wheels are pretty, though.
I agree with CRowe14 that I bet you can find a lower-mileage car you can afford.
I agree with CRowe14 that I bet you can find a lower-mileage car you can afford.
09-23-15, 12:28 PM
#20
Aside from the fact that I personally would want out of the lease, you gotta do what you gotta do. I will put my $0.02 in, from the perspective of an engineer who was 100% responsible for the seat design (a few years back) for the Avalon, Solara and Camry.
I would NEVER buy the first year of ANY car. Even a Toyota. But that doesn't mean they are no good. But after the launch, problems are found. At some point the problems that have not already been worked out are gathered and a drop dead timing is set to release the changes to fix those problems. This drop dead date is fixed. It is never missed. If engineering changes are release on or before the drop dead date, the problems are either addressed timed exactly with the new vehicle, or implemented into the previous year just prior to the end of its production. Depends on what the change is. But this is done on every vehicle for all areas of the vehicle (not just seats).
What that does: Engineers are flying, breaking their necks to get it all covered by the drop dead date. And it happens, because there's no such thing as being late with Toyota, or go find another job. But they get it all done by the date. That day when they get off work, they all go out and get fit-shaced.
Well ... not all of them.
What this means is: The 2nd model year vehicle is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS, better than the first model year. Sometimes the 2nd model year is the best of that generation period. Because after the engineers sober up, they begin doing cost reductions.
So if the 2013 was a facelift / minor model change, I would get a 2014.
7milesout
I would NEVER buy the first year of ANY car. Even a Toyota. But that doesn't mean they are no good. But after the launch, problems are found. At some point the problems that have not already been worked out are gathered and a drop dead timing is set to release the changes to fix those problems. This drop dead date is fixed. It is never missed. If engineering changes are release on or before the drop dead date, the problems are either addressed timed exactly with the new vehicle, or implemented into the previous year just prior to the end of its production. Depends on what the change is. But this is done on every vehicle for all areas of the vehicle (not just seats).
What that does: Engineers are flying, breaking their necks to get it all covered by the drop dead date. And it happens, because there's no such thing as being late with Toyota, or go find another job. But they get it all done by the date. That day when they get off work, they all go out and get fit-shaced.
Well ... not all of them.What this means is: The 2nd model year vehicle is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS, better than the first model year. Sometimes the 2nd model year is the best of that generation period. Because after the engineers sober up, they begin doing cost reductions.
So if the 2013 was a facelift / minor model change, I would get a 2014.
7milesout
09-23-15, 02:27 PM
#21
Lexus Fanatic
Like I said in your thread in the ES forum, considering you're budget conscious, I would not make this trade. An LS with 80k miles is going to have maintenance and repair needs that are much greater than an ES with 6k miles. I think you should wait until the budget is a little less of a priority to make this move.
There is no mechanical difference in a 2013 and a 2012. The powertrain is exactly the same. Really the changes were cosmetic. No reason to avoid a 2013.
Originally Posted by 7milesout
So if the 2013 was a facelift / minor model change, I would get a 2014.
09-23-15, 02:57 PM
#22
Pole Position
As stated, I've had the ES as a loaner car. Great ride. LS is greater. You'll lose some of the current features with the 12 versus the 13, but as for superior performance and silence, nothing is better.
09-23-15, 05:24 PM
#23
Lexus Fanatic
14' ES 350 lease to 12' LS 460L, is it a good move?
That's true, but is it worth exchanging 6k mile car for an 80k mile car when budget is a concern for no monthly savings?
09-24-15, 06:28 AM
#24
Driver
Thread Starter
Like I said in your thread in the ES forum, considering you're budget conscious, I would not make this trade. An LS with 80k miles is going to have maintenance and repair needs that are much greater than an ES with 6k miles. I think you should wait until the budget is a little less of a priority to make this move.
There is no mechanical difference in a 2013 and a 2012. The powertrain is exactly the same. Really the changes were cosmetic. No reason to avoid a 2013.
There is no mechanical difference in a 2013 and a 2012. The powertrain is exactly the same. Really the changes were cosmetic. No reason to avoid a 2013.
09-24-15, 06:29 AM
#25
Driver
Thread Starter
Aside from the fact that I personally would want out of the lease, you gotta do what you gotta do. I will put my $0.02 in, from the perspective of an engineer who was 100% responsible for the seat design (a few years back) for the Avalon, Solara and Camry.
I would NEVER buy the first year of ANY car. Even a Toyota. But that doesn't mean they are no good. But after the launch, problems are found. At some point the problems that have not already been worked out are gathered and a drop dead timing is set to release the changes to fix those problems. This drop dead date is fixed. It is never missed. If engineering changes are release on or before the drop dead date, the problems are either addressed timed exactly with the new vehicle, or implemented into the previous year just prior to the end of its production. Depends on what the change is. But this is done on every vehicle for all areas of the vehicle (not just seats).
What that does: Engineers are flying, breaking their necks to get it all covered by the drop dead date. And it happens, because there's no such thing as being late with Toyota, or go find another job. But they get it all done by the date. That day when they get off work, they all go out and get fit-shaced. Well ... not all of them.
What this means is: The 2nd model year vehicle is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS, better than the first model year. Sometimes the 2nd model year is the best of that generation period. Because after the engineers sober up, they begin doing cost reductions.
So if the 2013 was a facelift / minor model change, I would get a 2014.
7milesout
I would NEVER buy the first year of ANY car. Even a Toyota. But that doesn't mean they are no good. But after the launch, problems are found. At some point the problems that have not already been worked out are gathered and a drop dead timing is set to release the changes to fix those problems. This drop dead date is fixed. It is never missed. If engineering changes are release on or before the drop dead date, the problems are either addressed timed exactly with the new vehicle, or implemented into the previous year just prior to the end of its production. Depends on what the change is. But this is done on every vehicle for all areas of the vehicle (not just seats).
What that does: Engineers are flying, breaking their necks to get it all covered by the drop dead date. And it happens, because there's no such thing as being late with Toyota, or go find another job. But they get it all done by the date. That day when they get off work, they all go out and get fit-shaced.
Well ... not all of them.What this means is: The 2nd model year vehicle is ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS, better than the first model year. Sometimes the 2nd model year is the best of that generation period. Because after the engineers sober up, they begin doing cost reductions.
So if the 2013 was a facelift / minor model change, I would get a 2014.
7milesout
Thanks,
09-24-15, 06:31 AM
#26
Driver
Thread Starter
Personally, since you seem to very budget conscious, which is a great thing, I would just exercise patience, enjoy the new ES, save some money over the next few years and keep an eye out for a '12-'14.
From the sounds of it, you really want an LS.
Granted these cars can take the miles, and as long as they have been cared for, there are great representative models with higher miles.
However, an '11 with 80k miles...it just seems that if you have a little more patience, you'll be able to find a good deal and a much lower mileage car.
The new ES is a nice car!
My situation was similar, in that I really wanted an LS and was willing to settle for an older model with higher mileage (80k-90k range). But I waited a few months and came across a model that had been well cared for with 65k on the clock, and best of all, a great price.
Mine is much older (07), but the theory is the same.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
From the sounds of it, you really want an LS.
Granted these cars can take the miles, and as long as they have been cared for, there are great representative models with higher miles.
However, an '11 with 80k miles...it just seems that if you have a little more patience, you'll be able to find a good deal and a much lower mileage car.
The new ES is a nice car!
My situation was similar, in that I really wanted an LS and was willing to settle for an older model with higher mileage (80k-90k range). But I waited a few months and came across a model that had been well cared for with 65k on the clock, and best of all, a great price.
Mine is much older (07), but the theory is the same.
Good luck with whatever you decide to do.
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