'10 LS 460 or new Honda Fit LS?
03-13-17, 12:06 PM
#16
Pole Position
Thread Starter
The answer to your question "So, how truly reliable is a 2010 LS 460 with 100k miles?" Very, based on other owners experience as stated above.
As you said, "The luxury and power is nice, but not necessary"
Seems you already made up your mind....
I suppose the rate limiting factor is money. (Isn't that always the problem?)
Reliability: LS~ Fit.
Cost of ownership: LS> Fit
Comfort/power/luxury: LS>Fit
So how much does the "extras that comes with LS" worth to you, since you will spend substantial time commuting ?
Total disclaimer here, i sold my M3 and bought my LS460 last month. Having twin boys and getting old kinda does that... All the best and let us know! I just joined and its a good bunch of peeps here!
As you said, "The luxury and power is nice, but not necessary"
Seems you already made up your mind....
I suppose the rate limiting factor is money. (Isn't that always the problem?)
Reliability: LS~ Fit.
Cost of ownership: LS> Fit
Comfort/power/luxury: LS>Fit
So how much does the "extras that comes with LS" worth to you, since you will spend substantial time commuting ?
Total disclaimer here, i sold my M3 and bought my LS460 last month. Having twin boys and getting old kinda does that... All the best and let us know! I just joined and its a good bunch of peeps here!
I also had an Audi S4, which, after 120k+ miles was not a pleasant experience to maintain. Always in the shop, and the engine was ready to be replaced for $13k. Do you think the LS 460 will last me to 200k miles?
What year was your M3 may I ask? I'm thinking I will keep my M3 for 2 more years then get rid of it to avoid the german maintenance expenses
03-13-17, 12:40 PM
#17
Roadfrog should be able to help you with the yearly maintenance questions, since during my brief time here, he seems to be the "guru" on DIY and an authority in getting parts!! 
As for me, i had a 2008 M3 and yes, the 414Hp V8 was glorious... The german maintenance expenses was and is the main reason i decided to get rid of it. ~$900 for complete coilover... ~2K for engine gasket/ etc about 2 years ago. To be fair, i put 130,000 miles into that car, since i am in midwest. Got to drive to everywhere, and here we don't measure the distance, we measure the time to get to the destination...
Do i think the LS will last to 200k? Yes, but since i just own my LS for a month, i can not back it up. I did read a tread here about an LS hitting 280k or thereabout...
As for me, i had a 2008 M3 and yes, the 414Hp V8 was glorious... The german maintenance expenses was and is the main reason i decided to get rid of it. ~$900 for complete coilover... ~2K for engine gasket/ etc about 2 years ago. To be fair, i put 130,000 miles into that car, since i am in midwest. Got to drive to everywhere, and here we don't measure the distance, we measure the time to get to the destination...
Do i think the LS will last to 200k? Yes, but since i just own my LS for a month, i can not back it up. I did read a tread here about an LS hitting 280k or thereabout...
03-13-17, 12:52 PM
#18
Racer
Thanks so much for the input! How much would you say should I allocate for yearly maintenance? $1200? $2000?
I also had an Audi S4, which, after 120k+ miles was not a pleasant experience to maintain. Always in the shop, and the engine was ready to be replaced for $13k. Do you think the LS 460 will last me to 200k miles?
What year was your M3 may I ask? I'm thinking I will keep my M3 for 2 more years then get rid of it to avoid the german maintenance expenses
I also had an Audi S4, which, after 120k+ miles was not a pleasant experience to maintain. Always in the shop, and the engine was ready to be replaced for $13k. Do you think the LS 460 will last me to 200k miles?
What year was your M3 may I ask? I'm thinking I will keep my M3 for 2 more years then get rid of it to avoid the german maintenance expenses
As for yearly maintenance, tires may be your biggest yearly or biannual expense. Get an LS without the air suspension and even if you had to deal with control arms, they wouldn't be a yearly thing. Please let us know what you ultimately decide on.
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ragingf80 (03-13-17)
03-13-17, 05:50 PM
#19
Pole Position
Interesting thread, I have a rather large commute (80 miles a day) and the LS460 is great for that. I have an 07 and it has been very reliable (148,000 miles) and surprisingly good gas mileage (26 mpg). But driving a bigger luxury car isn't for everyone, you'll save with the fit...what's that thing get to the gallon? 35? More? So you'll be losing maybe $20 bucks a week on fuel alone. If something breaks in the Fit it'll be a $300 dollar repair...if something breaks in the LS it'll be a $1,000 repair. Something along those lines. But that's where it ends - driving an economy car all those miles on the highway can be an awful experience - they're loud, the wind whips them all over the place, they aren't all that comfortable, there isn't a lot of room...it adds up when you're spending two and a half hours a day in a car. Believe me, I've done it both ways. It depends on where you are in life, how you value the two hours you'll spend in a car everyday...are you worth something? Is your time worth something? Do you feel like you deserve a little more? Etc. If so buy the LS.
03-13-17, 06:31 PM
#20
Pole Position
Thread Starter
I have a high tolerance actually. My M3 is very LOUD and raw sounding with the M Performance Exhaust, and my suspension is also very stiff and low, so I feel all the bumps. Sound deadening is minimal in the M3 to save weight. So long as the AC works and the seats are comfortable! That being said, I wouldn't necessarily mind a more cushy ride!
03-13-17, 07:12 PM
#21
Lexus Fanatic
Doublebase's commute is similar to mine. I also echo his sentiments exactly. For me, my commute to and from work is MY time. I can wind down after dealing with bad guys, crank up my tunes, and drink my coffee and relish in the comfort of my mobile LA-Z-BOY chair. It's pure bliss. I'm just not a "point A to point B" kind of guy....especially with the negligible fuel savings (in my case).
As for maintenance costs, that will obviously vary in so many ways, based on your view on oil changes (DIY or dealer/chain, oil brand etc), strict adhesion to service intervals, etc. Putting aside 1200 dollars a year should be more than ample. If you put 2000 aside, think of it as a savings account - if you NEED to spend it you're covered....if you don't, well then you have a nice little nest egg to put a down payment on your next vehicle. I do about two oil changes per year on my car. I buy my oil from my dealer in bulk at $6/qt and an oil filter for 7 dollars. 1 cabin filter a year is about 10 bucks online. That's about it for routine maintenance. After that, it's a brake flush every two years for about 150 and maybe a diff fluid change for 80 bucks. You get the idea. A water pump and maybe control arms are the only "unforseens" that can happen, but if you do it right, both of these one-time repairs will only set you back 1500 +/- dollars altogether. That's about as cheap as a car can be for maintenance costs. Yes, an ML amp can crap the bed, or maybe you need headlight bulbs (50 bucks for two), air filters every 40k miles, spark plugs every 150k miles....etc
As for maintenance costs, that will obviously vary in so many ways, based on your view on oil changes (DIY or dealer/chain, oil brand etc), strict adhesion to service intervals, etc. Putting aside 1200 dollars a year should be more than ample. If you put 2000 aside, think of it as a savings account - if you NEED to spend it you're covered....if you don't, well then you have a nice little nest egg to put a down payment on your next vehicle. I do about two oil changes per year on my car. I buy my oil from my dealer in bulk at $6/qt and an oil filter for 7 dollars. 1 cabin filter a year is about 10 bucks online. That's about it for routine maintenance. After that, it's a brake flush every two years for about 150 and maybe a diff fluid change for 80 bucks. You get the idea. A water pump and maybe control arms are the only "unforseens" that can happen, but if you do it right, both of these one-time repairs will only set you back 1500 +/- dollars altogether. That's about as cheap as a car can be for maintenance costs. Yes, an ML amp can crap the bed, or maybe you need headlight bulbs (50 bucks for two), air filters every 40k miles, spark plugs every 150k miles....etc
03-13-17, 07:57 PM
#22
Pole Position
Thread Starter
Doublebase's commute is similar to mine. I also echo his sentiments exactly. For me, my commute to and from work is MY time. I can wind down after dealing with bad guys, crank up my tunes, and drink my coffee and relish in the comfort of my mobile LA-Z-BOY chair. It's pure bliss. I'm just not a "point A to point B" kind of guy....especially with the negligible fuel savings (in my case).
As for maintenance costs, that will obviously vary in so many ways, based on your view on oil changes (DIY or dealer/chain, oil brand etc), strict adhesion to service intervals, etc. Putting aside 1200 dollars a year should be more than ample. If you put 2000 aside, think of it as a savings account - if you NEED to spend it you're covered....if you don't, well then you have a nice little nest egg to put a down payment on your next vehicle. I do about two oil changes per year on my car. I buy my oil from my dealer in bulk at $6/qt and an oil filter for 7 dollars. 1 cabin filter a year is about 10 bucks online. That's about it for routine maintenance. After that, it's a brake flush every two years for about 150 and maybe a diff fluid change for 80 bucks. You get the idea. A water pump and maybe control arms are the only "unforseens" that can happen, but if you do it right, both of these one-time repairs will only set you back 1500 +/- dollars altogether. That's about as cheap as a car can be for maintenance costs. Yes, an ML amp can crap the bed, or maybe you need headlight bulbs (50 bucks for two), air filters every 40k miles, spark plugs every 150k miles....etc
As for maintenance costs, that will obviously vary in so many ways, based on your view on oil changes (DIY or dealer/chain, oil brand etc), strict adhesion to service intervals, etc. Putting aside 1200 dollars a year should be more than ample. If you put 2000 aside, think of it as a savings account - if you NEED to spend it you're covered....if you don't, well then you have a nice little nest egg to put a down payment on your next vehicle. I do about two oil changes per year on my car. I buy my oil from my dealer in bulk at $6/qt and an oil filter for 7 dollars. 1 cabin filter a year is about 10 bucks online. That's about it for routine maintenance. After that, it's a brake flush every two years for about 150 and maybe a diff fluid change for 80 bucks. You get the idea. A water pump and maybe control arms are the only "unforseens" that can happen, but if you do it right, both of these one-time repairs will only set you back 1500 +/- dollars altogether. That's about as cheap as a car can be for maintenance costs. Yes, an ML amp can crap the bed, or maybe you need headlight bulbs (50 bucks for two), air filters every 40k miles, spark plugs every 150k miles....etc
This all seems very very reasonable compared to the past 2 Audis, 1 VW, and 4 BMWs I have owned. It's almost unbelievable actually lol! I've also read about oil consumption but it seems like that is not as common an issue as oil consumption on my 4.2 V8 Audi S4. Rather like a exception rather than the rule. True?
03-13-17, 08:21 PM
#23
Lexus Fanatic
This all seems very very reasonable compared to the past 2 Audis, 1 VW, and 4 BMWs I have owned. It's almost unbelievable actually lol! I've also read about oil consumption but it seems like that is not as common an issue as oil consumption on my 4.2 V8 Audi S4. Rather like a exception rather than the rule. True?
03-14-17, 05:39 AM
#25
Pole Position
I'm longing for the day when I can buy and Audi or BMW product and not have to worry about reliability. I keep seeing nice looking A4's and A8's on Craigslist, but every time I think maybe I'll go look at one, I keep thinking of the comments people write about them on here. Just the other day I was talking to a tech about the A4 and he said the 2.0 engine has some "issues". And he just left it at that.
A lot lot of these German cars are having not only the suspected electrical issues, but major engine problems. There are some trends in the industry that just hasn't been ironed out yet...widespread turbo use, direct injection and piston rings that are designed to improve fuel economy. I honestly think this time frame in the automotive industry is going to be looked back on and remembered as the moment when they were still trying to figure everything out, but they'll figure it out, they always do. Then they'll change it again.
A lot lot of these German cars are having not only the suspected electrical issues, but major engine problems. There are some trends in the industry that just hasn't been ironed out yet...widespread turbo use, direct injection and piston rings that are designed to improve fuel economy. I honestly think this time frame in the automotive industry is going to be looked back on and remembered as the moment when they were still trying to figure everything out, but they'll figure it out, they always do. Then they'll change it again.
03-14-17, 12:33 PM
#26
Pole Position
Thread Starter
I'm longing for the day when I can buy and Audi or BMW product and not have to worry about reliability. I keep seeing nice looking A4's and A8's on Craigslist, but every time I think maybe I'll go look at one, I keep thinking of the comments people write about them on here. Just the other day I was talking to a tech about the A4 and he said the 2.0 engine has some "issues". And he just left it at that.
A lot lot of these German cars are having not only the suspected electrical issues, but major engine problems. There are some trends in the industry that just hasn't been ironed out yet...widespread turbo use, direct injection and piston rings that are designed to improve fuel economy. I honestly think this time frame in the automotive industry is going to be looked back on and remembered as the moment when they were still trying to figure everything out, but they'll figure it out, they always do. Then they'll change it again.
A lot lot of these German cars are having not only the suspected electrical issues, but major engine problems. There are some trends in the industry that just hasn't been ironed out yet...widespread turbo use, direct injection and piston rings that are designed to improve fuel economy. I honestly think this time frame in the automotive industry is going to be looked back on and remembered as the moment when they were still trying to figure everything out, but they'll figure it out, they always do. Then they'll change it again.
BMWs have better residuals and reliability in their I6s, but maintenance is still high and IMHO nothing will beat Japanese reliability.
03-14-17, 01:16 PM
#27
Pole Position
You don't buy Audis to own. You lease them and lose them unless you are basically a mechanic. It's too bad the residuals are not that great, which makes leasing not attractive either. I know someone in Audi sales who has told me he would never buy an Audi!
BMWs have better residuals and reliability in their I6s, but maintenance is still high and IMHO nothing will beat Japanese reliability.
BMWs have better residuals and reliability in their I6s, but maintenance is still high and IMHO nothing will beat Japanese reliability.
03-14-17, 01:43 PM
#28
Lexus Fanatic
The answer to this question will be whats most important to you, economy or comfort? The Fit will be cheaper to run and maintain, no doubt. The LS will however be much more comfortable and a nicer place to spend a big chunk of your week. I've never really understood why people buy nice cars, and then buy crappy cars to commute in, when most of their driving is done commuting.
I drive a lot during the day (don't commute that far, but I drive around from place to place throughout the day) and my LS460 does a lot to make my days more enjoyable.
I drive a lot during the day (don't commute that far, but I drive around from place to place throughout the day) and my LS460 does a lot to make my days more enjoyable.
03-14-17, 02:00 PM
#29
Lexus Test Driver
Had to chime in here..
I was JUST thinking about making a new thread but was trying to justify the reason to do it here versus the Car Chat area. I was leaning towards here because I was going to make my favorable comments regarding the LS, and I knew that many of us here could/would relate.
So, on to it...
My wife has been driving larger vehicles (SUV's) for the last 10+ years, and most recently, a Honda Pilot. Neither of us really "loved" the Pilot, but it served us well and we grew to like it a lot since we purchased new in 2012. No major complaints nor gripes from her until I got the LS. She likes the LS but then began to feel like she had yet to drive a car that she really "wanted" to drive.
That toned down over the last few years (never fully ceased), but that tone came to read its head (and got louder) once we had attended the Chicago Auto Show.
Side note: She has wanted an Audi for the last few years..cant blame her as they a great looking and driving cars...
Today is her birthday and she had quite a day planned for herself, as she took the day off to "pamper" herself. So, yesterday, I took the Pilot and traded it in for a '17 Audi A4.
Now its a lease, as I completely believe that if you're going to buy German, you lease and don't buy.
She had no idea about what was going on nor what I was doing, so I was able to pull up in the driveway placed flowers on the hood with a few "Happy Birthday" balloons attached to the car. Went inside and placed the box with the keys in it on the kitchen counter.
Ecstatic isn't even the word, as she was absolutely speechless! It was pretty awesome...
She's never been "excited" about what she's driven, nor had I, until I purchased my LS, and I really wanted her to experience what it was like to drive a car your excited about. Even if it meant the possibilities of "Audi Issues". Hey, you only live once, right!?! (and, its a lease, so im not on the hook for anything).
I figure three years, we should be fine, and keeping it after that time frame is out of the question.
But I will say, it is one hell of a fun car to drive!
Two completely different cars, but I have to say, after driving the Audi for a bit and getting back into my LS, just nothing like it.
So, i'll be one of the few Lexus/Audi owners in here and will share my ownership experience periodically regarding the Audi.
But the most important thing for me though, is that my wife was blown away by the surprise and she absolutely loves the car!
I was JUST thinking about making a new thread but was trying to justify the reason to do it here versus the Car Chat area. I was leaning towards here because I was going to make my favorable comments regarding the LS, and I knew that many of us here could/would relate.
So, on to it...
My wife has been driving larger vehicles (SUV's) for the last 10+ years, and most recently, a Honda Pilot. Neither of us really "loved" the Pilot, but it served us well and we grew to like it a lot since we purchased new in 2012. No major complaints nor gripes from her until I got the LS. She likes the LS but then began to feel like she had yet to drive a car that she really "wanted" to drive.
That toned down over the last few years (never fully ceased), but that tone came to read its head (and got louder) once we had attended the Chicago Auto Show.
Side note: She has wanted an Audi for the last few years..cant blame her as they a great looking and driving cars...
Today is her birthday and she had quite a day planned for herself, as she took the day off to "pamper" herself. So, yesterday, I took the Pilot and traded it in for a '17 Audi A4.
Now its a lease, as I completely believe that if you're going to buy German, you lease and don't buy.
She had no idea about what was going on nor what I was doing, so I was able to pull up in the driveway placed flowers on the hood with a few "Happy Birthday" balloons attached to the car. Went inside and placed the box with the keys in it on the kitchen counter.
Ecstatic isn't even the word, as she was absolutely speechless! It was pretty awesome...
She's never been "excited" about what she's driven, nor had I, until I purchased my LS, and I really wanted her to experience what it was like to drive a car your excited about. Even if it meant the possibilities of "Audi Issues". Hey, you only live once, right!?! (and, its a lease, so im not on the hook for anything).
I figure three years, we should be fine, and keeping it after that time frame is out of the question.
But I will say, it is one hell of a fun car to drive!
Two completely different cars, but I have to say, after driving the Audi for a bit and getting back into my LS, just nothing like it.
So, i'll be one of the few Lexus/Audi owners in here and will share my ownership experience periodically regarding the Audi.
But the most important thing for me though, is that my wife was blown away by the surprise and she absolutely loves the car!
03-14-17, 02:07 PM
#30
Lexus Fanatic
Congrats! I hope she (and you) enjoy it. You should be fine, modern Audis are way more reliable than prior Audis.