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After some research I determined that the leaking fluid was the front differential/transfer case fluid and that it has a capacity of .74qts. Unfortunately, this leads me to believe that my front diff is either bone dry currently or just about there. Wife works less than a mile from home while I work over 20 away so it looks like she gets to drive the LS until I get this sorted, don't need the diff seizing on the highway at speed.
I ordered a replacement CV axle to address the issue in the video above (bought used for $200 vs. new from dealer for $1K), ordered 2 new axle seals, and will fill with 75w-90 gear oil. Will probably go ahead and do the rear diff fluid at the same time. This should at least address my immediate concerns and will give me the chance to get it into a dealer for the trans and brake service.
Well that sucks, I have never seen that much movement in my life (except for the time I prepped for my colonoscopy).
Serioisly I don't even know if a new axle would fix that, it looks like the differential is loose in the differential housing. How is that axle moving that much? No wonder the seal is junk. Sorry to hear this, good luck and let us know what happens.
The movement is not the show stopper here the fact that your front diff has been deep underwater and is dumping a mix of exlax, gear oil, and water is.
That sludge pouring out the breather ( the check valve you pulled) says its overfull. Its overfull as its not just gear oil in circulation inside.
Pull the drain plug and dump the contents about 6 times. As in refill, drive for 10mi and dump it again.
Repeat until all the water is out and the fluid is clean. Then, if it's still leaking AND NOT MAKING BAD SOUNDS, fix the seals.
Be sure to check the xfer case and rear diff too.
Any creeks and teenage boys involved here?
JM2C - keep us posted!
Edit: unless the boots are torn replacing the axles will not stop all of that motion. That movement comes from the side gears in the diff and a tiny bit from the fit of the axle to the side gear. But they really don't wear as they are splined together as a unit. That is not to say the seal won't wear a grove in the axle, as it will but the axle is not responsible for all that movement.
This! It's the only thing that makes any sense here, based on the color of that fluid. I would still get a dealer to do it, for peace of mind.
In my mid 20's was an RR tech and then builder at trans shop. I've seen it all! OK - a lot!
If its under warranty DO NOT take it anywhere untill all the fluids are free of h20! And you clean up the mess!
That said, if it was NOT making bad sounds, I'd pull the plug in a heartbeat and get that crap out. Fill full maybe a whole quart so it foams and cleans up the mess. Run it at low speeds for 5-10mi and dump it. Usually on the 3rd fill they look pretty good.
But water and seals are like knees on a gym floor. Thats not to say the seals are done but don't replace them until you know the unit is quiet and worth spending money on. If it makes noise you need to be concerned. But honestly the axles move a good bit. Don't fret over that. OK
Anywho - please check transfercase and rear diff for water intrusion.
The movement is not the show stopper here the fact that your front diff has been deep underwater and is dumping a mix of exlax, gear oil, and water is.
That sludge pouring out the breather ( the check valve you pulled) says its overfull. Its overfull as its not just gear oil in circulation inside.
Pull the drain plug and dump the contents about 6 times. As in refill, drive for 10mi and dump it again.
Repeat until all the water is out and the fluid is clean. Then, if it's still leaking AND NOT MAKING BAD SOUNDS, fix the seals.
Be sure to check the xfer case and rear diff too.
Any creeks and teenage boys involved here?
JM2C - keep us posted!
Edit: unless the boots are torn replacing the axles will not stop all of that motion. That movement comes from the side gears in the diff and a tiny bit from the fit of the axle to the side gear. But they really don't wear as they are splined together as a unit. That is not to say the seal won't wear a grove in the axle, as it will but the axle is not responsible for all that movement.
Now this is the good stuff, thanks!
Water intrusion does make a lot of sense given what I'm seeing, but if it requires being submerged ("a creek and teenage boys") to get to this point then I'm afraid it's been this way since I bought it. While we have had rain the past year I've never driven through standing water more than a couple inches. I'm the only one who drives it, my wife has been behind the wheel maybe 5 times since we bought it.
I will definitely be doing your flush procedure this Saturday.
This car was a NE (VA, MD, etc.) car early in life, could the heating and cooling cycles during winter months cause moisture buildup to this level in the diff?
And in regards to your 'EDIT', does this mean I could be looking at damage within the diff itself that is causing this much play?
Originally Posted by 2013FSport
If its under warranty DO NOT take it anywhere untill all the fluids are free of h20! And you clean up the mess!
...
But water and seals are like knees on a gym floor. Thats not to say the seals are done but don't replace them until you know the unit is quiet and worth spending money on. If it makes noise you need to be concerned. But honestly the axles move a good bit. Don't fret over that. OK
Anywho - please check transfercase and rear diff for water intrusion.
No warranty so it's on me to fix
I'm guessing the lower viscosity of water will allow it to seep through seals that are otherwise okay and would not allow a 75w-90 gear oil to pass through. Is that correct?
Will definitely be servicing the rear diff as well, may leave the trans alone until I take it into a dealer to change fluids in that and the brakes.
Originally Posted by 2013FSport
OP - for some reason I thought this had straight cut gear in it but it has a hypoid gear. **Do not use ATF as I had written above.**
Plesse acknowledge this!
Correcting post now...
I knew what you meant
Can anyone confirm for me the size allen wrench needed for the fill and drain plugs on the diffs? I've seen 12mm referenced some places but would like to be sure as I need to stop for one on the way home. And whatever I get is going to require some modification to fit in this plug without damaging this sensor on the steering rack....
I cant imagine condinsation building to that level if the vent is open or plugged.
It would be interesting for others to chime in on the movement. I've seen them move a lot. That's really a lot. That said, if it doesn't vibrate at speed, make strange noises, or leak, it might be fine as is.
Water is not much of a lubricant tho so its hard to say what the conditon of anything is. Strain the dumped contents and run a magnet through it. See what it looks like. If it seems scary Id opt for used of fleabay or similar with lower miles.
I'd hit a store and just grab a whole set from 4 to 12mm. But guess thats a 10mm??
I'd like to know the quantity that comes out.
How long have you owned it and how many miles did it have on it when you grabbed it?
No noise or feedback from the axle or diff. Would also like to hear how much play is in other AWDs out there, but this isn't really a community where someone will just run out and check for me.
I'll definitely be straining and magnetizing the contents to see what comes out. REALLY hoping for minimal metal shavings as I think that's the best hope given what the fluid looks like.
I stopped by Harbor Freight at lunch for allen wrenches yesterday but didn't find a complete set that had anything larger than a 10mm, so planned to head to Sears on my way home. I did some more searching and it appears that all Toyota/Lexus diff plugs are 10mm (as you guessed above) so that's what I set out to find. I bought this $20 kit for the single circled piece as this should allow me to remove the plug without damaging that steering rack sensor...
I also grabbed a 12mm by itself, just in case.
Bought the car end of January last year and have put roughly 20K wonderful miles on it
FWIW those plugs are in there tight and I'd venture to guess that little 5/16" driver will shear off before the plugs come out. Not from the OEM torque spec, but they often take a lot break away torque to free them.
I'd suggest a 3/8" driver as it would suck to shear it off and have it stick in the fill hole with minimal access.
I'm planning to hit the plug lightly with a torch (after wrapping everything else up well) to help loosen it, might try a 10mm box wrench first and only inserting that bit half way into the plug and the wrench, then tap the box wrench with a hammer to act as an impact wrench. We'll see what I can come up with but I'm confident I'll be able to get it off.
01-09-18, 02:07 PM
