Having owned a low option SWB and a high option LWB, my thought on options...
01-28-18 | 11:46 AM
#31
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I'm actually getting used to the LEDs and liking them better...
If an LED goes bad I believe the whole assembly has to be replaced.
As for the semi-aniline, you will also have stitching on the airbag cover of a 13-17 car.
If an LED goes bad I believe the whole assembly has to be replaced.
As for the semi-aniline, you will also have stitching on the airbag cover of a 13-17 car.
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lizhekb (01-29-18)
02-01-18 | 02:02 PM
#32
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The 2011 Touring edition has wood trim around those vents but I don't think it has semi aniline as the doors are not stitched or at least don't look stitched(still not exactly sure what is supposed to be stitched). I have never seen a touring edition with ML either.
09-16-18 | 03:03 PM
#33
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I thought it would be interesting to come back to this thread now that I've lived with the car for a while and see if my thoughts on any of these options have changed. I'm 8 months into ownership now, the car was 13,500 miles on it. I'm going to quote each of the points I brought up below, and respond and share how my thoughts have changed...or haven't.
I still strongly agree with this. The LWB really makes this car IMHO. The rear seat is so spacious it always draws a comment from whoever sits back there, and the LWB really makes the car feel and look a lot more imposing. I would definitely recommend the LWB.
This is really huge also. At 13,500 miles my semi-aniline leather shows no wear. Any patina or gloss comes right out with a quick leather cleaning. The feel of the leather is a huge upgrade. The base leather in my 2015 quickly got shiny and there wasn't anything that could be done to bring that back. Quality leather makes a huge difference.
Now that I've gotten used to them and have the tire pressure dialed in (I run them 31 cold) the 19s no longer bother me in any way, and the car definitely looks better with the 19s. I don't know that I would want the 19s on a SWB car, but the LWB car at least mine with air suspension deals well with the reduction in sidewall, and I think the car would look pretty different with smaller wheels. Now I would say, on a LWB car I would seek out the 19s.
This one I have REALLY come around on. For one, I've basically stopped listening to Satellite radio. I now listen to Slacker, Pandora, etc through the App Suite, or I listen to audio off of my iPhone. The music streamed through the AppSuite is much better sounding than satellite radio, and listing to better quality sources I can say the ML is really excellent. You do have to listen to it louder to really get the full effect, but the highs are so clear and the bass is so sharp. I would say the ML is definitely worth it.
Now that the novelty has worn off, I've basically stopped using the DRCC, and as you may have seen in my other thread I did have a scary false trigger on the PCS too where the car stopped in the middle of a highway merge. I would say I wouldn't specifically look for this feature again.
As I've gotten used to them, I now prefer the LED lights. The color temp makes things look much brighter, and the lights throw off to the sides and disburse much better.
Definitely still agree with this. I love the air suspension, and coupled with the LWB it really makes the car feel a lot more regal and refined. A must have IMHO, even with the risk and cost of replacement.
Since I wrote this I did have the opportunity to drive the 2017 in the snow. I was extremely impressed by how well the car handled with the VSC and TRAC, MUCH better than my LS430 or LS400 were (which were scary in the snow). I would say I felt 75% as confident in the snow as I did with the AWD, which is a huge win IMHO. All in all, I have no issue having this car in RWD here.
Still agree 100% on this. I LOVE my 2017, enjoy it much more than I did the 2015. For the first time in a long while I don't have a wandering eye, I can say I'm totally happy driving my LS460L. Since this I have driven a couple of the new LS500, and I still am totally without regret about not waiting and pulling the trigger on this car.
Hope this is helpful to somebody!
1. LWB vs SWB: So, the LWB does a couple things for the car. For one, it makes it look more imposing. The car looks a lot bigger from the side, and it makes the car feel more like a peer to something like a 7 Series or S Class. The rear space is cavernous, and its worth having even for the passenger comments. It makes the car feel like a much "grander" automobile. It also helps to even out the ride somewhat, and makes the car track down the road more gracefully. I have a small one car garage and I was concerned about the LWB car fitting, it fits fine and now that I'm used to pulling it in, its a non issue. I note people make a lot more comments about the LWB car than they did my SWB car, it has a different look and feel. Worth it? Yes.
2. Semi-aniline leather and alcantara headliner option: IMHO this is a must have, and its really the option that I most wished my 2015 had. The basic leather feels very plasticky, and shines up quickly making it seem more aged than it is, really doesn't belong in a car of this caliber. I was tired of my minivans having nicer leather. Door stitching materials and dash materials, while still synthetic with the upgrade are softer and feel higher quality, and the big one is the front armrest being real leather vs clearly vinyl without the upgrade, this has a huge impact on the feel of the front row. Steering wheel airbag cover is stitched leather, and what most people don't realize is the plastic on the sides of the airbag cover, surrounding the steering wheel buttons is also wrapped in leather with this upgrade, while on the base car it is hard plastic. Suede headliner is nice, but the base headliner is very nice too. Worth it? For sure.
This is really huge also. At 13,500 miles my semi-aniline leather shows no wear. Any patina or gloss comes right out with a quick leather cleaning. The feel of the leather is a huge upgrade. The base leather in my 2015 quickly got shiny and there wasn't anything that could be done to bring that back. Quality leather makes a huge difference.
3. 19" vs 18" wheels. The 19s definitely look better, especially on the bigger LWB car. However, even with the same high quality tires, the LWB and the air suspension, certain road irregularities present a slightly stiffer jolt on the 2017 with 19s than on the 2015 with 18s. Whether that is an issue for you vs the looks is a question. Am I going to run out and replace my wheels with 18s to get that slight impact softness back? No. If given the choice would I spec 18s over 19s to get the best ride possible? Yes. Worth it? No.
Now that I've gotten used to them and have the tire pressure dialed in (I run them 31 cold) the 19s no longer bother me in any way, and the car definitely looks better with the 19s. I don't know that I would want the 19s on a SWB car, but the LWB car at least mine with air suspension deals well with the reduction in sidewall, and I think the car would look pretty different with smaller wheels. Now I would say, on a LWB car I would seek out the 19s.
4. Mark Levinson Audio. First let me say that I am not an audiophile, I appreciate a nice sounding system, but very few car sound systems sound "bad" to me. With that said, does the ML blow me away compared to the stock audio? No. Now, bear in mind I listen exclusively to XM Radio, and music streamed off of my iPhone. I will try a CD in the system...if I can find one. The ML does sound clearer, but I find I have to listen to it louder to make music "pop". Bass is much better. Is the ML better? Yes. Would I personally make it the deciding factor between two cars I liked? No. Worth it? No.
This one I have REALLY come around on. For one, I've basically stopped listening to Satellite radio. I now listen to Slacker, Pandora, etc through the App Suite, or I listen to audio off of my iPhone. The music streamed through the AppSuite is much better sounding than satellite radio, and listing to better quality sources I can say the ML is really excellent. You do have to listen to it louder to really get the full effect, but the highs are so clear and the bass is so sharp. I would say the ML is definitely worth it.
5. Dynamic Radar Cruise/PCS. This is a system that I have had on numerous vehicles that have been my wife's daily drivers. Our 2014 Jeep Grand Cherokee Overland had it, as did our 2015 Kia Sedona SX-L and our 2017 Chrysler Pacifica Limited. For her, it is a must have. While I do drive those vehicles around town (especially the Jeep when we had it), the bulk of my experience with that feature was on long trips, and I had come to the conclusion that I did not like it. I'm the type that likes to make good time on a trip, and what frustrated me about DRCC is that it leaves too big a gap in front of me, where I don't put any pressure on cars in front of me to go faster or get out of my way. It also allows people to "sneak in" to the gap pushing me further and further back. I would have it set to say 80 and find I was doing 70 and had been for a while just because traffic would loaf around me. Once I took control again I would be back doing 80 comfortably because people would move out of my way or I would move around them. However, now that I have the system on my daily driver I find that I like it when commuting and driving around town when I'm not so focused on getting to a destination as quickly and efficiently as I can. Its great in stop and go/slow traffic too. Worth it? Yes.
Now that the novelty has worn off, I've basically stopped using the DRCC, and as you may have seen in my other thread I did have a scary false trigger on the PCS too where the car stopped in the middle of a highway merge. I would say I wouldn't specifically look for this feature again.
6. LED Headlamps. My 2015 had HIDs, and my 2017 has LEDs. The HIDs had a wider beam that was whiter and more flooded with light. The LEDs are a better color temp, but I am still getting used to the different beam pattern. The car looks better with the LEDs. Auto high beams are cool. Overall, I think I prefer HIDs. Worth it? No.
As I've gotten used to them, I now prefer the LED lights. The color temp makes things look much brighter, and the lights throw off to the sides and disburse much better.
7. Air suspension. This is a big one, because its a hot topic of whether the reward is worth the potential repair cost. My previous LS400 and LS430 had air suspension. However, a long period went between me having access to those cars and my purchase of the LS460 in 2015. I had test driven the LS460 with air suspension prior to buying the 2015 and didn't see much of a difference. I can tell you though that the differences between the coil car and the air car are there, they're fairly substantial and they don't really become apparent until you live with the car a while. The air suspension is not really softer, and I think that was the crux of why I didn't "get it" in 2015. However, thats not what its about. It IS more refined. The car glides down the road more quietly, the air shocks mute more NVH than the coil spring car, so the car feels more insulated from the road, and you have no spring or strut noise when driving on rough roads. The leveling means the car actually corners flatter, while being more compliant in a straight line. It also means that empty or loaded, the car feels the same. On Tuesdays in my business we all pile in cars and go look at new listings. Well, with 5 people in my 2015 car, you could tell visually and by driving the car was heavily laden. It felt heavier, ride was affected, it sat low in the rear, it rolled more in corners. In the 2017 car with air, it feels, looks and drives the same whether there are 5 people in it, or one. Which is really quite remarkable. The drive modes also provide some different options that while subtle, do change the feel and tenor of the car. The height high function does notably raise the car which is nice for rutted roads, carwashes, etc. One of the more interesting situations is when exiting and entering my office parking garage. The ramp goes sharply and steeply down, and the 2015 would actually drag the center of the car on the edge of the pavement at the apex of where the ramp meets the driveway, sometimes when I was in it alone, ALWAYS if even one person was in the car with me. I was worried about the LWB car being worse because that center part of the car would be lower when the car was negotiating that drop-off, if that makes sense. However, the 2017 never drags even with 2-3 other people in it. Why? Only reason I can assume is the air suspension. A feature I was really not a fan of has become the stand out feature in my new car. I would buy a warranty. Worth it? Yes.
Definitely still agree with this. I love the air suspension, and coupled with the LWB it really makes the car feel a lot more regal and refined. A must have IMHO, even with the risk and cost of replacement.
8. AWD. So this is the only feature that my 2015 had that my 2017 doesn't have. I have not had the opportunity to drive the 2017 in the snow, and hopefully I don't. My 2015 with AWD was excellent in the snow. Unstoppable, I wouldn't think twice about driving it anywhere in up to 6-7 inches of snow. However, there are differences in feel between the AWD car and the RWD car you need to be aware of. The RWD car does feel a little more sprightly, it does have more power and you can feel that. The drivetrain in the AWD car is a little louder, and the transfer case does slightly impede on drivers legroom (not in any meaningful way as it does on smaller RWD/AWD Lexus products). The steering in the RWD car feels lighter, and there is a little driveline vibration through the wheel on the AWD car that isn't there on the RWD car. The front end being connected to the drivetrain has an impact. Worth it? Yes if you need to depend on the car in snow. If not? I would actively seek out the RWD car.
Since I wrote this I did have the opportunity to drive the 2017 in the snow. I was extremely impressed by how well the car handled with the VSC and TRAC, MUCH better than my LS430 or LS400 were (which were scary in the snow). I would say I felt 75% as confident in the snow as I did with the AWD, which is a huge win IMHO. All in all, I have no issue having this car in RWD here.
I think the biggest thing to take away from this is, get what you want and don't settle. I loved my 2015, but I LOVE my 2017, the 2015 was an awesome car don't get me wrong. I preferred the colors inside and out I think. The silver is sharp but it doesn't look as great clean as the nebula, and inside the grey leather made the shimamoku wood pop more (which is something a friend of mine also commented on just today while riding in the new one) There were a few things missing from the 2015 that once the luster of it "being an LS" wore off, bugged me. Most notably the interior leather and the shorter wheelbase once I started driving my kids around. The new one just feels a lot more special than the 2015 did. I truly feel having driven all of them, that as old as the LS460 is that it still holds up well to the modern competition in the form of the A8, 7 Series, S Class, etc. I don't at all regret getting this car vs waiting for the LS500.
Hope this is helpful to somebody!
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01-24-20 | 03:40 PM
#40
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Found numbers from this thread. https://www.clublexus.com/forums/ls-...uild-info.html
Very interesting.
Very interesting.
01-24-20 | 03:59 PM
#41
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From: Knoxville, TN
I may end up with a late 460 one day, maybe maybe not.
I will search until I can find one with the bamboo, that is some of the most beautiful wood I've seen in any car.
01-24-20 | 05:00 PM
#42
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From: CA
Steve (SW17LS), I'd love to hear your thoughts on the LS500 optioned with the Luxury Package and Variable Air Suspension in comparison to your 2017 Lexus LS460L. I always look forward to reading your thorough, logical and insightful responses/posts (like this current thread)!
Russ
Russ
Last edited by RussLS460; 01-24-20 at 06:22 PM.
01-24-20 | 07:34 PM
#43
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Steve (SW17LS), I'd love to hear your thoughts on the LS500 optioned with the Luxury Package and Variable Air Suspension in comparison to your 2017 Lexus LS460L. I always look forward to reading your thorough, logical and insightful responses/posts (like this current thread)!
Russ
Russ
Now, supposedly for 2020 they have softened the LS500s suspension some. I plan on driving another one to see if thats the case. The ones I drove were 2018s.
The 500 is just a really different car than the LS460, feels like it could be another model entirely other than an LS. Wouldn't be a replacement for my LS460L to me.
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01-24-20 | 09:28 PM
#44
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The LS500 is a very different car. Its beautiful, I think, and the interior is beautiful but its much smaller inside than my LS. Up front and especially in back. The roofline feels much lower and the car is not nearly as expansive feeling inside. From a ride and drive perspective the LS500 is considerably sportier, the ride is firmer, its not as quiet, and the powertrain doesn't feel as refined. That includes the car with the air suspension as well. I would say in comfort mode (softest suspension setting) the LS500 feels slightly firmer than my LS460L in Sport + mode (firmest suspension setting). With the 460 in comfort mode it is considerably softer riding.
Now, supposedly for 2020 they have softened the LS500s suspension some. I plan on driving another one to see if thats the case. The ones I drove were 2018s.
The 500 is just a really different car than the LS460, feels like it could be another model entirely other than an LS. Wouldn't be a replacement for my LS460L to me.
Now, supposedly for 2020 they have softened the LS500s suspension some. I plan on driving another one to see if thats the case. The ones I drove were 2018s.
The 500 is just a really different car than the LS460, feels like it could be another model entirely other than an LS. Wouldn't be a replacement for my LS460L to me.
I’m seriously considering buying a 2018 500 but I’m hesitant because my main priority is a soft ride and quiet interior. As long as that aspect was a little better then my current 2011 SWB 460 without air suspension I’d be fine. The 500 has such a beautifully designed exterior.
Last edited by RussLS460; 01-24-20 at 09:31 PM.
01-24-20 | 09:48 PM
#45
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From: Tx
Would you agree that the ride quality and quietness would be better in a 2018 LS 500 with air suspension versus a SWB 4th generation 460 without air suspension?
I’m seriously considering buying a 2018 500 but I’m hesitant because my main priority is a soft ride and quiet interior. As long as that aspect was a little better then my current 2011 SWB 460 without air suspension I’d be fine. The 500 has such a beautifully designed exterior.
I’m seriously considering buying a 2018 500 but I’m hesitant because my main priority is a soft ride and quiet interior. As long as that aspect was a little better then my current 2011 SWB 460 without air suspension I’d be fine. The 500 has such a beautifully designed exterior.