Finally sat in and drove the LS500, my thoughts vs my 2017 LS460L
02-26-18, 01:33 PM
#16
Pole Position
Nice write-up. I don't know why these new Toyota vehicles don't photograph well, but I find myself liking them more in-person than in pictures (ex: Camry, LS 500, LC). I love your quote "the car is stylish but lacks elegance." Very well said- to me that encompasses one of my biggest questions- how well will the car age? I still see 98-00 LS 400's and absolutely love the classic and elegant design. I wonder if I'll feel that way in 20 years about the LS500. The pic you posted of the 460L shows a very elegant and timeless car in my opinion (especially from that side angle).
02-26-18, 01:36 PM
#17
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Yeah I agree, they all look better in person. I think its because they're so three dimensional, it doesn't come across in pictures. I even liked the new Avalon more in person.
I don't see it aging well...
I don't see it aging well...
02-26-18, 02:17 PM
#18
Lexus Champion
Definitely agree about them not photographing well, but as for aging, it's all in the eye of the beholder. One of my coworkers has a 99 LS400, which I once lusted after. Now I see it and think it looks horribly outdated, with ginormous overhangs. Frankly, I'm not sure any current cars really will age that well. Style changes so quickly now.
02-26-18, 03:00 PM
#19
Definitely agree about them not photographing well, but as for aging, it's all in the eye of the beholder. One of my coworkers has a 99 LS400, which I once lusted after. Now I see it and think it looks horribly outdated, with ginormous overhangs. Frankly, I'm not sure any current cars really will age that well. Style changes so quickly now.
02-26-18, 03:09 PM
#20
Lexus Champion
02-26-18, 04:11 PM
#22
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
I think back to other cars with very “distinctive” looks, such as Cadillacs. Think how dated Cadillacs just one generation old look...
02-01-20, 04:37 PM
#23
Driver School Candidate
2017 ls460
I drive a 2018 GS350 AWD AND PREVIOUSLY A 2016 CT6 and 2013 GS350 AWD. I am considering a 2017 CPO LS460 as I would like a bigger car and a V8. A new CT6 would be an option but GM discontinued production yesterday. Is the air ride and L version LS460 worth extra cost over std Ls460? Does the 17 have a larger NAV screen the the 16?
02-01-20, 04:40 PM
#24
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Having had the SWB and LWB LS460, I prefer the LWB, and I prefer the air ride.
Nav screen and system is the same in 2016 and 2017.
Nav screen and system is the same in 2016 and 2017.
02-01-20, 05:02 PM
#25
Driver School Candidate
Thanks for the recommendation. I expect some patience is needed to locate the LWB and air ride 2017 CPO. DON’t understand why Lexus IS so slow to offer Apple car play.
02-01-20, 05:06 PM
#26
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
Oh yeah, 2017 will be the hardest year to find that because so few of them were made.
You can add Apple CarPlay for about $600. I added it to mine.
You can add Apple CarPlay for about $600. I added it to mine.
02-01-20, 09:12 PM
#27
I'm pretty much in line with your assessment (excellent writeup BTW) but I do like the LS500's I've seen on the road. Low, sleek with nice detailing and finishing they have an understated presence; even if they don't have the gravitas of an S or 7.
I've sat in LS500s since my initial test drive over the years at dealerships and car shows and without the twin panel sunroof (which makes the headroom problem even worse) I might be able to live with the tighter cabin given the sportier mission of this car.
However despite the business rationale I think the TTV6 was the wrong choice. Lexus could have easily picked at TT 4.0L V8 (or have it as a second option a-la A8, 7 and S class), turbocharged it to 450hp and added cylinder deactivation and Valvematic and I bet the FE penalty would be minimal. It would add a few thousand dollars to the cost but I bet people would pay it; especially since it's still a great deal compared to the German V8s. Also with less reliance on turbo charging the throttle response would be smoother and more refined. But the market is moving back to the TT6; for the A8 it's order only and the take rate for the 7 seems to be less than 50%.
I like the risks Lexus has taken with the LS 500; and I think there is room for more improvement during a mid-cycle refresh. Now I keep chanting: LSF. LSF. LSF.
I've sat in LS500s since my initial test drive over the years at dealerships and car shows and without the twin panel sunroof (which makes the headroom problem even worse) I might be able to live with the tighter cabin given the sportier mission of this car.
However despite the business rationale I think the TTV6 was the wrong choice. Lexus could have easily picked at TT 4.0L V8 (or have it as a second option a-la A8, 7 and S class), turbocharged it to 450hp and added cylinder deactivation and Valvematic and I bet the FE penalty would be minimal. It would add a few thousand dollars to the cost but I bet people would pay it; especially since it's still a great deal compared to the German V8s. Also with less reliance on turbo charging the throttle response would be smoother and more refined. But the market is moving back to the TT6; for the A8 it's order only and the take rate for the 7 seems to be less than 50%.
I like the risks Lexus has taken with the LS 500; and I think there is room for more improvement during a mid-cycle refresh. Now I keep chanting: LSF. LSF. LSF.
02-02-20, 09:20 AM
#28
Great article. Well written. Demonstrates real understanding of these vehicles.
02-02-20, 11:38 PM
#29
Pole Position
But, the car is significantly tighter inside. The front of the roofline rakes down significantly as it approaches the windshield, and the windshield is much more steeply raked than before. Th result of this is the top of the headliner being a couple inches closer to your head, and lower down into your field of view than on the LS460, which has the result of making the cabin feel much tighter. The headliner on the LS500 w/ black interior is black vs grey in my LS460 w/ black interior which adds to that also. The way the front doors wrap up into the dash make the dash feel narrower too, which makes the cars feel narrower. Front seats are also narrower, and the console seems narrower. Car feels more intimate and sportier, but definitely less airy, and less roomy.
The back seat is a huge difference. With the front sear adjusted for me, the legroom in the back seat felt similar to that in my SWB 2015 LS460, if not slightly less, and when I got into the back seat of my 2017 LS460L behind the front seat adjusted the same way, it felt positively cavernous. I lay my briefcase down on its side in the rear passenger footwell behind the driver, and it doesn't fit without touching the base of the front seat, similar to my SWB LS460, in my LWB LS460L it has 4-5 inches before it touches the seat in front. The rear seating area of the LS500 is unquestionably significantly smaller than the outgoing LS460L. This would be a huge issue for me as the reason I wanted a LWB car was to have more room for my kids and so they wouldn't kick the seats. Well, they would definitely kick these seats, and with the wood trim on the back of the seats, it would be a big issue.
The back seat is a huge difference. With the front sear adjusted for me, the legroom in the back seat felt similar to that in my SWB 2015 LS460, if not slightly less, and when I got into the back seat of my 2017 LS460L behind the front seat adjusted the same way, it felt positively cavernous. I lay my briefcase down on its side in the rear passenger footwell behind the driver, and it doesn't fit without touching the base of the front seat, similar to my SWB LS460, in my LWB LS460L it has 4-5 inches before it touches the seat in front. The rear seating area of the LS500 is unquestionably significantly smaller than the outgoing LS460L. This would be a huge issue for me as the reason I wanted a LWB car was to have more room for my kids and so they wouldn't kick the seats. Well, they would definitely kick these seats, and with the wood trim on the back of the seats, it would be a big issue.
2013-2017 LWB: Note the higher roof line in the front, the larger legroom for rear seats, and the relatively same height for front and rear seats. The clearance between the rear head rests and the roofline is also substantial.
LS500: The rear seats are noticeably higher than the front seats. As a result, the clearance between the rear head rests and the roofline is far less than in the 460L. The panoramic roof will cut down even further on the rear headroom.
02-04-20, 12:07 PM
#30
Lexus Fanatic
Thread Starter
The seats in the LS500 are awesome. The bolsters are adjustable, it has a great massage. The seat was the only thing in the LS500 I wish I had in my 460.