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I wish to ask if there is need to change the Transmission oil on a 2008 model LS460 which I just got. It drives and transmits fine however but I have no access to its usage histroy hence my feel for a need of transmission oil. Are there any specific recommended types that I must use if i have to do the oil change? Around me original oil is rare but I managed to find a Dexron VI. Would that work please?
Before draining the fluid check color and smell of the fluid. If it is dark and/or smells burnt, replaced the fluid. If the fluid looks fresh, there is no need for service.
Overall is highly recommended to gradually replace the fluid if you plan on keeping the car. However, do not change whole fluid. Remove the drain plug and let it drain. Replaced the drained amount with fresh fluid. Repeat with next oil change if the fluid is still dark and/or smells burnt. There is a specific way to set the fluid level. Please, use search function to find detailed instructions.
Welcome to Club Lexus and congrats on your new car!
I second Anfanger's suggestion that you use the search function and also check the FAQ and DIY sticky at the top of this forum. From what I've read there is a particular process for changing the fluid.
For what it's worth, I'm the original owner of my 2007, and with 153,000 miles I haven't touched the fluid. You didn't state the mileage on your car. I think a general consensus is if you change the fluid regularly, fine keep doing it. However, if you have never changed it like me, it is best not to touch it.
Before draining the fluid check color and smell of the fluid. If it is dark and/or smells burnt, replaced the fluid. If the fluid looks fresh, there is no need for service.
Overall is highly recommended to gradually replace the fluid if you plan on keeping the car. However, do not change whole fluid. Remove the drain plug and let it drain. Replaced the drained amount with fresh fluid. Repeat with next oil change if the fluid is still dark and/or smells burnt. There is a specific way to set the fluid level. Please, use search function to find detailed instructions.
Thank you for this detailed recommendation. I do appreciate the time you took for that.
I haven't done an entire fluid exchange on the LS, but I do plan on it at some point in the near future. I have, however, done it one a number of previous Toyota vehicles I've owned. It's a closed system, as everyone knows.
I disconnected the return line feeding to the radiator and extended it with clear nylon tubing. I would then turn on the vehicle for 15-30 seconds at a time for the trans fluid to pump out into a graded bucket. This way, I could measure the amount of fluid coming out. I would then pump the exact amount of fresh fluid back in through the fill hole. Once nothing but clean fluid was pumping out, I'd do the trans check fluid by jumping the appropriate pins with a paper clip and the sequence with the shifter. I believe it's pins four and 12 on Toyota vehicles. My 10 year old helped me out with turning the vehicle on and off as I observed the fluid coming out. I think it's taken about 30 mins each time. I've seen many people do the temp check with a infrared thermometer.
I think the biggest thing is to avoid using pressure to flush the system. YMMV. I've never had an issue, and it's made a night and day difference on all the used vehicles I've purchased.
It's actually not that expensive of a job letting the dealer do it. I paid $156 @ Lexus Palm Beach. This includes 4 qts. of fluid. To me, it's not worth the trouble to do it yourself as it's a pretty messy job, not to mention the cost of the fluid, etc.. See item E on invoice.
I haven't done a fluid exchange on the LS, but I do plan on it at some point in the near future. I have, however, done it one a number of previous Toyota vehicles I've owned. It's a closed system, as everyone knows.
I disconnected the return line feeding to the radiator and extended it with clear nylon tubing. I would then turn on the vehicle for 15-30 seconds at a time for the trans fluid to pump out into a graded bucket. This way, I could measure the amount of fluid coming out. I would then pump the exact amount of fresh fluid back in through the fill hole. Once nothing but clean fluid was pumping out, I'd do the trans check fluid by jumping the appropriate pins with a paper clip and the sequence with the shifter. I believe it's pins four and 12 on Toyota vehicles. My 10 year old helped me out with turning the vehicle on and off as I observed the fluid coming out. I think it's taken about 30 mins each time. I've seen many people do the temp check with a infrared thermometer.
I think the biggest thing is to avoid using pressure to flush the system. YMMV. I've never had an issue, and it's made a night and day difference on all the used vehicles I've purchased.
A full flush is not something you want to do on a such old vehicle, especially LS. You can screw up your transmission as there are some reports of transmission issues after a full flush.
A full flush is not something you want to do on a such old vehicle, especially LS. You can screw up your transmission as there are some reports of transmission issues after a full flush.
A flush connotates using pressure to "flush" the system. This method can dislodge items within the transmission and damage it because of the immense flow of fluid.
A fluid exchange is different. You're disconnecting the system and allowing its mechanics to drain out the old fluid little by little. You're also pouring new fluid in through a funnel (some people have used a modified chemical sprayer for ease), which is much less pressure than what the LS system uses to circulate the fluid. I've done this method to a couple early '00s vehicles and have never had issues. Again, this is my experience only. When I do this on my '10 Lexus, I will document, as well.
OK, I just finished mine. My car is just under 100K miles, like by 300 miles or so.
I also dropped the pan and changed the filter, which was pretty easy. The filter I bought from Rock Auto, it was a Beck Arnley brand for about $27. It comes with a new pan gasket. The pan has 3 small magnets...when you clean the pan be sure to put these back in place as they are there to catch and hold metallic particles.
On the fluid change, I did things a little differently....
1) I used Valvoline MaxLife fluid. It's currently on sale at Autozone for $16/gallon. I bought, and used, 4 gallons.
Why did I use non-OEM fluid? It's far less money ($37/gallon for WS), it says on the bottle it is a substitute for Toyota WS, and I am confident Valvoline knows their oils. Moreover, there is a long thread (or rather several threads) on the Toyota board where many guys are using MaxLife with no issues in place of WS. There's probably some truth to the idea that Toyota specifies WS to bolster their parts sales.
2) I didn't see myself pumping 16 quarts of fluid into the trans through a 16 ounce suction pump gun, all through a hole that's hard to access on the side of the trans.
Instead, I made my own 'fluid changing machine' similar to the dealer's. I removed the driver's side cooler line at the radiator. I attached a length of 3/8" fuel hose (Autozone) with a 1/4 turn valve at the end (Home Depot) to the metal pipe that comes out of the radiator. This allows me to flow fluid out of the transmission's pressure side in a regulated manner. Next, I used a 3/8" union to attach a hose to the cooler line that runs back to the trans. I also used a 1/4 turn valve so I could control any backflow.
By running the engine, and opening the pressure side valve, I let 2 quarts dump into a graduated 5 gallon bucket (Lowes $4). Then I shut the valve, and opened the other valve, and pumped 2 quarts back into the trans. With the engine running the whole time, I repeated this procedure until I had gone through all 16 quarts, and of course by then the fluid was new looking. I pumped in about 1 quart more than came out to make the fluid level check easier.
To pump the fluid, I used a Small Block Chrysler oil pump Autozone $36 (like from a 318/340/360) and drove it with a 1/2" electric drill. In an aside, I'll tell you that it is incredible how fast an engine oil pump can pump.....even spinning the drill slowly (maybe 50RPM), I could pump 2 quarts in 10-15 seconds.
I'll reiterate that my 'home-brew' method is basically the same as the fancy machines the dealer uses, just less pretty.
3) I read the procedure others were kind enough to post on how to check the oil level based on temperature accessed through a lot of gearshift lever moving. I figured I would get off easy by using my scanner but I was wrong as my scanner did not read trans temp. Faced with the hassle of 'the procedure' and the fact that I am inherently lazy, I decided to try something different.... I used my infrared temp gun to shoot the bottom of the trans pan. I read 115F. Since we are allowed a window of 115F - 130F, and I figured the oil inside had to be at least a little hotter, I went ahead and pulled the overflow plug and let the fluid drain to a thin flow. As a backup, I shot the oil that came out and it read 124F so I feel I was OK in that regard. Frankly, using a wire to jumper pins on the OBD port sounds like a miserable pain in my back and with my eyesight I was afraid I'd take forever to get the right ports.
Final comments:
1) If I didn't have a lift in my garage, I wouldn't have done, or recommend, this as a DIY job. When I turned 35 I promised myself I was done lying on my back under cars and I've never looked back. The hassle of getting a car up in the air on all four corners using ramps or jackstands would tip it in favor of paying a shop to do it.
2) I spent around $150 in fluid,filter, and the valves/oil pump. This is about a $150 savings over the dealer's quote of $300. Not a lot of money, but I have the pump/valves/hoses left over in case I want to do another vehicle. Plus the filter change, I'm sure, would have been another $100. So anyway I'm probably $200 give or take fatter in the wallet for about 4 hours of work. Plus I didn't have to waste time dropping/picking up the car at the dealer.
Would be interesting to see how this owner faired from this post.
Full fluid replacement is likely fine if done correctly. Most of the problems people have are self induced. Dealers cut corners too.
If you don't follow the procedures for setting fluid level and removing air in the system by flipping through gears you will likely have issues. I don't believe measuring how much fluid comes out and refilling the same amount is good practice.
With our 460 I drove up on ramps. The rear of the car I jacked up to level the car. I dropped the pan and replaced the filter. After refilling the trans fluid I replaced the rest of the fluid by means of disconnecting the tranny line at the radiator. I started the car and let the tranny pump its own fluid out for 20 seconds. Refilled the tranny and repeated the same process a few times. After the second or third time the fluid changed from black to red. Total I used 14 quarts or so.
I used techstream to monitor the tranny temp to set the fluid level. I agree it is a time consuming process without a lift. IMO it's important to start this after the car has sat all night so it is cold.
Changed it at 170k, I'm nearing 190k miles, no issues.
Full fluid replacement is likely fine if done correctly. Most of the problems people have are self induced. Dealers cut corners too.
If you don't follow the procedures for setting fluid level and removing air in the system by flipping through gears you will likely have issues. I don't believe measuring how much fluid comes out and refilling the same amount is good practice.
With our 460 I drove up on ramps. The rear of the car I jacked up to level the car. I dropped the pan and replaced the filter. After refilling the trans fluid I replaced the rest of the fluid by means of disconnecting the tranny line at the radiator. I started the car and let the tranny pump its own fluid out for 20 seconds. Refilled the tranny and repeated the same process a few times. After the second or third time the fluid changed from black to red. Total I used 14 quarts or so.
I used techstream to monitor the tranny temp to set the fluid level. I agree it is a time consuming process without a lift. IMO it's important to start this after the car has sat all night so it is cold.
Changed it at 170k, I'm nearing 190k miles, no issues.
This is almost my same process. I did not use a Tech Stream, however. I used a paper clip with the 4runner, shifted the gears in a very specific pattern, and waited for a light in the dash to become solid (or flashing, I can't remember) to signify the fluid temps are correct for checking through the trans pan. Vehicle must be even in order for the fluid check to be correct. Good callout.
If you want to exchange fluid DROP THE PAN AND CLEAN EVERYTHING. You will be amazed at the black layer that clings to everything and how much fine debris is everywhere and collected inside the pan and on the magnets. If you flush or exchange without doing a cleaning of everything you greatly increase the risk of the new fluid with brand new detergents breaking everything loose and having it anger a solenoid/valve body part.
This also allows you to replace the filter/strainer and inspect the internals to an extent. Do a pan drop, and then 4-6 exchanges and you will not have any issues no matter how high the mileage is. I have done countless exchanges and drops with never a single instance of the trans performing worse/having damage to include my own 289k mile beater Jeep that gets it done every 20-30k miles and has a way more sensitive setup than any Toyota trans.
I'll post up the pictures of the 99 RXs trans pan with how insanely dirty it was when I serviced it to show just how much stuff can stack up in 200k miles and exactly why you never just want to swap fluid.
https://imgur.com/a/BVSD9lW
If you just swap or especially so if you power flush all that stuff will flow through the trans and cause damage. The LS trans is much better than the RX unit but the same concept of debris buildup still applies to nearly all transmissions I've seen. Only exception I've ever seen was 5 speed ZF units
This is almost my same process. I did not use a Tech Stream, however. I used a paper clip with the 4runner, shifted the gears in a very specific pattern, and waited for a light in the dash to become solid (or flashing, I can't remember) to signify the fluid temps are correct for checking through the trans pan. Vehicle must be even in order for the fluid check to be correct. Good callout.
Originally Posted by Striker223
If you want to exchange fluid DROP THE PAN AND CLEAN EVERYTHING. You will be amazed at the black layer that clings to everything and how much fine debris is everywhere and collected inside the pan and on the magnets. If you flush or exchange without doing a cleaning of everything you greatly increase the risk of the new fluid with brand new detergents breaking everything loose and having it anger a solenoid/valve body part.
This also allows you to replace the filter/strainer and inspect the internals to an extent. Do a pan drop, and then 4-6 exchanges and you will not have any issues no matter how high the mileage is. I have done countless exchanges and drops with never a single instance of the trans performing worse/having damage to include my own 289k mile beater Jeep that gets it done every 20-30k miles and has a way more sensitive setup than any Toyota trans.
I'll post up the pictures of the 99 RXs trans pan with how insanely dirty it was when I serviced it to show just how much stuff can stack up in 200k miles and exactly why you never just want to swap fluid.
Did you both use gasket sealant and allow it to cure for 24 hours, or did you trust the new gasket without the sealant? Per the repair manual on other Toyotas, this is part of the typical process.
06-10-21 | 02:58 AM
Transmission oil change. Required?
