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I think 4.4-4.7 is reasonable. At least in the scope of manufacturer-claimed times. Claimed times on the current model is 5.4s with a 386 HP engine.
The RCF is heavy. The LS, base model at least, might only be a 200-300 lbs heavier, which isn't enough to slow it down that much. Look how heavy the S550 and 750i are. Relatively the same with less HP at the listed claimed times.
No idea why the RCF isn't quicker. That is one knock, imo, on that car is the weight. Audi's S7 has less HP, not sure about the M5, but there are a lot of ponies under that hood. Amazing engine imo. Especially considering the naturally-aspirated nature of the HP output. In fact it's on par HP/L of comparable turbo engines, which is pretty amazing.
Depends on what Lexus is positioning their vehicles truly. If it does some fancy chassis work where you have a huge weight loss, plunking in the same motor would offer dividends without even a single dime spent on engine dev. But again all just assumptions on what direction they intend to take.
Tastes are subjective. Personally I think the 13+ car is the best looking 460 (no surprise) and the 07-09 car I find much more fluid than the 10-12 which is my least favorite iteration of the 460.
I agree! I actually favour the original design the most in Touring guise or Euro-spec, but consider the 2012-present version to be an excellent improvement. That 2009-2012 version of the LS, was a regression in being designed as a cost-cutting measure from 2006 to circa April 2008, basically the work of a Toyota loss leader in Katsuaki Watanabe. What you own, is what Toyoda ordered in early 2010 while he prepared a top-notch redesign. He was probably disappointed with the MY2010 LS facelift and the initial work on the 5LS back in 2009-10.
Originally Posted by SW15LS
Don't let it get to you. You can post stuff time and time again and people don't take it and keep posting the same questions.
Don't take this the wrong way, because I find you very knowledgable and enjoy your posts, but your posts are often so long and verbose my guess is most people stop reading about 1/3rd of the way through so what you say in its entirety never gets across.
In any event...it's the LS forums and everybody enjoys talking about the LS and the future LS and you'll always have fan theories, etc that don't equate to the truth.
Well thanks, I was probably just overreacting of course. My work life has become very challenging, so spending my free time here had to be cut back when discussions seemed very dead ended. I am very guilty of writing out way too much, which is partly due to my hobby of writing books/stories for fun and love of automotive history.
I am glad to see some discussion here about the LS, but it seems much of the information I had provided elsewhere wasn't making its way back here. I kept finding it irritating how renderings for the 2019 GS and 2018 LS instead made their way to Club Lexus via semi-pirated forms rather than the 2 original sources I submitted them to respectively.
Many of these copycats provide a very incomplete version of 5LS background information, which makes for inaccuracy and what I see as now requiring "damage control" to prevent others from being misled by their poor journalism.
More than anything, I dislike inaccurate reporting by news outlets, due to their level of influence. It results in spreading of rumours, that can taint an upcoming product well into model launch. I cannot tell you how many gaffes have made in reports about Lexus products, mostly due to an author's negative biases.
Auto Spies in a trolling manner, claimed the other day that the 5LS would solely be powered by the new 2.0L turbo, only because autoevolution made mention of the LS being tested with a turbo engine. Readers ate that fallacious Auto Spies theory up, as if Toyota-Lexus is dumb enough put the GS200t engine into the LS and call it a day.
The writer responsible for that, hates this brand with a passion and gets off on reporting destructive theories like that. The truth of the matter is, the LS prototype in Colorado was being tested with the 750i and A8 4.0T V8.
Now tell me, why is Lexus testing a turbo engine with twin-turbo V8 competitors and not 6-cylinder competitors in the 740i and A.8 3.0T? Now that is a mysterious thing to me.
Sorry for the late response. It is quite rude of me to not respond promptly and will try to check more often.
Originally Posted by Rhambler
Nice, thanks for sharing. I had no idea where the genesis of article came from, other than what was shown in the article.
In any case, the production/release date seems more realistic as the dates indicated in the article seemed strange. The whole reason I made this post to begin with was because if we were to see a 2017 model year, someone, somewhere, in our internet-connected world, should have seen a test mule/spy shot by now. So seeing it now just reaffirms a 2018 model year.
I'm really anxious to see what it looks like now. Based on your comments, the Lexus LF-FC will definitely NOT be it, which frankly I'm relieved because I know that won't fit in my garage, lol. I presumed as much, but didn't know for sure.
I love how they taped on lights. It tells me that light design is a key design element and something they want to guard closely, although I'm sure we can make guesses based on existing themes. I think lights, both front and rear, are important elements and can really showcase a car and set its overall look.
The only thing I would wager at this point is the 5 liter engine. Other than that, I'm really curious and I guess we'll have to wait and see.
Thanks Rhambler, I hope you didn't take what I wrote the wrong way. I was frustrated with Carscoops for not giving due credit, but much more irritated with them getting many of the facts wrong. I posted this rendering+article to another site called Lexus Enthusiast a few weeks ago, after traveling to Beijing and HK.
Mag X does not allow foreigners to subscribe to them. You must live in a Japanese prefecture to buy any copies. I had discovered they had some more 5LS intel back in April, but took 1-2 weeks to get my own copy and found this rendering on page 12.
The mule as you said more recently, is actually a turbo engine. Is it a V8 though is my question? What does this mean for the LS500, not to mention the LC500 w/2UR-GSE. I will try revisit this another, as I'm running out of time right now. I apologise for the very late response.
I'm really curious about the engine now. Could it be an all new V8 turbo? That would be surprising. Maybe a 4 liter or 4.3 liter V8 turbo pushing out 440-450 HP?
I know engine development can be more secretive than an overall car, but I personally don't think that will happen just based on past precedent and how Lexus lines up their engines across the family, so to speak, but again, the past doesn't always point to the future, so who knows?
This engine could be introduced in the LS as all-new and it (or derivations of it) making its way into other models and the 5 liter NA retiring.
The only other caveat is what will they call the LS? The numbers have always matched the displacement, although I know BMW and MB have strayed from that, so they could still technically call it LS 500 even if it has a smaller displacement V8t, if nothing else to maintain the same level of numbers (i.e., '5') versus the "S550" and "750i." While it means nothing really, I'm sure there's some number jockeying going on in the model designation (number envy lol).
The other benefit of turboing (even though I think they're crap for long-term reliability) is that the true "F" could have higher output with the same relative displaced engine/core, but with more workings in pressurization, turbos, fuel, air, etc. More bang for relatively little extra bucks.
In any case, I still think the first LS500 really will have the 5 liter NA with the turbo, assuming that was even a turbo that was heard, a smaller displacement engine (6 cylinder), meaning the likelihood of two LS' seems high if what I said is true. Or even three if they hybridize it, although bless your soul if you buy such an expensive beast unless you plan on unloading it soon.
LS 500 (5 liter NA) @ 467 HP (my guess)
LS 500 (all new 4.0 to 4.3 liter turbo) @ 450 HP (anyone's guess)
LS 400 (all new 3 liter V6 or inline-6 turbo) @ 330-350 HP (my guess)
Someone in the other thread in car chat claimed to have seen it. He mentioned that the exterior changes are mild, but the interior was completely redone.
One HUGE wish is a complete digital dashboard ala Audi or MB. Get rid of the dials and replace that with a full screen that can be customized and can display pertinent information in the instrument cluster all at once instead of hitting that damn MODE button.
That's one thing I loved about the A7 I almost bought, I could see temp, radio station, mileage, range, navigation etc., etc., etc. ALL AT ONCE, NO MODE BUTTON REQUIRED. You hear that Lexus! Give us our digital dashboards and instrument cluster dammit.
The instrument cluster needs to display more info SIMULTANEOUSLY.
Just test driving the Audi gave me a shock in what is so obvious and desirable.
I can see this all at once, in the instrument cluster without scrolling through the mode button:
1. Radio and entertainment info
2. Outside temp
3. Range
4. Navigation info
5. Full navigation map
6. Time
7. Phone info
That info is available AT A GLANCE. No button pushing, no seeing only two things at once, no scrolling.
Yep, my '16 Challenger has it. When in navigation guidance mode, all turns and map will show up on the center and all that info you've mentioned above is also there, and it can be configured anyway I want it. Lexus has some overdue homework...
Cannot see a Flagship without one. Plus considering how a couple of other models have gotten a TFT display for almost everything I could bet for sure.
Only question is whether or not Lexus has hired a HMI design team for their model.
If its going to be rocking the F sport LFA inspired gauge set while everyone has jumped into full TFT machines running the latest GPU tech with Google maps etc..welll then
I'm all for a full digital dash. But only if it's warrantied the life of the car. I still recall when the lights on my ES300 dash went out. That was no fun.
Why would you be worried about a TFT gauge cluster being warranted for the life of the car...but not a navigation screen? It's exactly the same screen.
Your ES had the same gauges the LS has now. Why would those gauges going out make you worried about a TFT cluster and not the gauges you have in your LS now?
While the 2010-2012 LS front is lovely, I have always been distressed by how similar it looks to the 2010 Camry.
Who copied whom?
And I am not liking that Toyota is following Lexus' cue with the front grille treatment. It's getting a bit too extreme for my taste.
Agreed on the front end...
I was behind a 2016 Sienna, the other day, and was taking in the design. So much LS in it... Check out that front grill too. It's probably the same part # as the LSh
C-pillar is very reminiscent of the mid-2000's Odyssey...
And just throwing this in for good measure...
Speaking of c-pillars, the one on that Camry isn't nearly as egregious as the Avalon. But it seems like the last three years, for sedans at least, were nothing more than 'how can we copy the c-pillar on the Ford Fusion' (itself a lift from what's-his-name's days at Aston Martin).
Originally Posted by SW15LS
It will have a TFT gauge cluster I'm sure
They need to go OLED. LCD absolutely kills the whole gauge cluster concept, especially at night. At the minimum, I think that a VA panel would required.
Every car manufacturer shares similarity in design and theme across their line; it's in their genetics and automotive DNA. Name one major manufacturer that doesn't. Grills and lights are two features that are really synonymous, everywhere, across most brands.
No idea why this a surprise to you.
I guess if you squint hard enough you can see an LS in that sienna lol. Of course, if you just close both eyes, the clarity would be downright enlightening.
I wonder if the tech for OLED would be approved by a conservative Lexus Design board. The best I can see is LCD/TFT setup at the high end. Unless of course the normal board took the week off when the LS design was being frozen lol
05-22-16, 10:40 AM
