LS500 at Cleveland Car show, but you can't touch it
02-24-18, 06:17 PM
#1
Rookie
Thread Starter
LS500 at Cleveland Car show, but you can't touch it
1 LS up on a rotating pedestal. Asked if there was one I could sit in, she says go to a dealer.
I read that the front leg room was reduced 3". Since I have the seat of my 09 LS460 all the way back, I wanted to test. On a side note, what is the logic in not allowing the drivers seat to go all the way back to almost touching the rear seat? How often do LS drivers have an occupant in the seat behind them? I know there is the image of executive in back, in reality, it's an occasional kid or senior who really don't need a lot of leg room
Pretty much every other company had samples one could sit in: S560, AMG, even 200k Aston Martins. Does Lexus think that exterior is enough to sell the car? (laugh)
They didn't have another LS was because they are sold out (laugh2).
Reliability used to be differentiator. After paying 2k (negotiated down) for an engine repair for my LS, and experiencing failures in other parts, I don't believe there is a significant reliability difference in recent models from other makes including MBenz. Even if I do have to pay more for repairs, if there is a clear advantage (ride, quietness, features, appearance), I'll pay it.
added 25fe: I forgot to mention I had to have the rear air suspension replaced also. Fortunately, it was right before the 100k warranty expired. Otherwise it would have been a very expensive repair. I can't remember exactly how much at this point, but well over $1000. I'm thinking 2k.
Maybe it's just me, but I would think a car maker as large as Toyota would want to compete at the highest level of the luxury segment. According to motor trend, the G90 outperforms the LS for much less $. To me, it appears Lexus was not really trying in this redesign.
I read that the front leg room was reduced 3". Since I have the seat of my 09 LS460 all the way back, I wanted to test. On a side note, what is the logic in not allowing the drivers seat to go all the way back to almost touching the rear seat? How often do LS drivers have an occupant in the seat behind them? I know there is the image of executive in back, in reality, it's an occasional kid or senior who really don't need a lot of leg room
Pretty much every other company had samples one could sit in: S560, AMG, even 200k Aston Martins. Does Lexus think that exterior is enough to sell the car? (laugh)
They didn't have another LS was because they are sold out (laugh2).
Reliability used to be differentiator. After paying 2k (negotiated down) for an engine repair for my LS, and experiencing failures in other parts, I don't believe there is a significant reliability difference in recent models from other makes including MBenz. Even if I do have to pay more for repairs, if there is a clear advantage (ride, quietness, features, appearance), I'll pay it.
added 25fe: I forgot to mention I had to have the rear air suspension replaced also. Fortunately, it was right before the 100k warranty expired. Otherwise it would have been a very expensive repair. I can't remember exactly how much at this point, but well over $1000. I'm thinking 2k.
Maybe it's just me, but I would think a car maker as large as Toyota would want to compete at the highest level of the luxury segment. According to motor trend, the G90 outperforms the LS for much less $. To me, it appears Lexus was not really trying in this redesign.
Last edited by jzqj55; 02-25-18 at 01:01 PM. Reason: forgot something
02-24-18, 07:17 PM
#2
Lexus Fanatic
Having driven the car, front legroom is reduced but I did not find it problematic. I was more disappointed in the reduction in rear space and legroom, and front headroom.
As for the ride and drive, its excellent. The LS500 is MUCH sportier than the LS460, handling is much better, car is very rigid, but it retains almost all of the LS460's ride compliance (at least with air suspension) which I found remarkable.
I have also driven the G90 and the G90 and LS500 are very different cars. The G90 is very similar to the LS460L, a ride biased car with enough handling competence to make it easy and confidence inspiring to drive, but not a car you would push or choose to take on a twisty mountain road. The LS500 is that car.
I'm a more traditional buyer, and I prefer the LS460 mainly for interior room and packaging, and the smoother V8 power plant. Having driven both I'd pay the extra to get the LS500 over the G90 though.
As for the ride and drive, its excellent. The LS500 is MUCH sportier than the LS460, handling is much better, car is very rigid, but it retains almost all of the LS460's ride compliance (at least with air suspension) which I found remarkable.
I have also driven the G90 and the G90 and LS500 are very different cars. The G90 is very similar to the LS460L, a ride biased car with enough handling competence to make it easy and confidence inspiring to drive, but not a car you would push or choose to take on a twisty mountain road. The LS500 is that car.
I'm a more traditional buyer, and I prefer the LS460 mainly for interior room and packaging, and the smoother V8 power plant. Having driven both I'd pay the extra to get the LS500 over the G90 though.
02-24-18, 10:09 PM
#3
Rookie
Thread Starter
more comments on leg room and ride
Thanks for your feedback. My comments are in italics
> Seems to me they went overboard to make it "sporty". If they didn't have the LC, that would make more sense. For the ride/comfort/feature people who prefer a more "classic" look (e.g. s560), they will look elsewhere. We'll see what the sales numbers are in a year from now. I hope they are good enough to maintain the model. Competition makes everyone better.
Having driven the car, front legroom is reduced but I did not find it problematic. I was more disappointed in the reduction in rear space and legroom, and front headroom.
> Leg room is obviously not negotiable. weird because I've been in small cars that have a surplus of leg room. Hard to understand why they would eliminate tall buyers - especially in a car that long.
As for the ride and drive, its excellent. The LS500 is MUCH sportier than the LS460, handling is much better, car is very rigid, but it retains almost all of the LS460's ride compliance (at least with air suspension) which I found remarkable.
> From the Motor Trend comparison in DE issue referring to the LS:
Our test car’s air suspension sorted out big bumps but struggled with small, high-frequency bumps such as the Botts’ dots that line California lanes. “We’re on pretty new pavement here, and I’m still getting lots of small vibrations from all the little bumps in the road you can’t see from the driver’s seat,” Evans said.
> From the Motor Trend referring to the g90:
"Its ride falls between the 740e and LS 500; it doesn’t have the BMW’s solidity, but it handles bumps both large and small ever so slightly better than the Lexus. "
So they're saying the 740 has the best ride, g90 2nd, LS third
Especially surprising since the LS they tested had air suspension and it's not avail. on the g90. Makes one wonder what setting they had the suspensions on when doing the bump absorption eval. Personally, mine is in COMFORT 99% of the time.
Looking fwd to Car and Driver comparison and hope they include an S560. Even if it is more expensive, people want to know how much of performance gap there is. I would also like to see a comparison of the cars "self driving" capabilities. Specifically how well it will stay centered in the lane and how often it strays.
I have also driven the G90 and the G90 and LS500 are very different cars. The G90 is very similar to the LS460L, a ride biased car with enough handling competence to make it easy and confidence inspiring to drive, but not a car you would push or choose to take on a twisty mountain road. The LS500 is that car.
I'm a more traditional buyer, and I prefer the LS460 mainly for interior room and packaging, and the smoother V8 power plant. Having driven both I'd pay the extra to get the LS500 over the G90 though.
> Leg room is obviously not negotiable. weird because I've been in small cars that have a surplus of leg room. Hard to understand why they would eliminate tall buyers - especially in a car that long.
As for the ride and drive, its excellent. The LS500 is MUCH sportier than the LS460, handling is much better, car is very rigid, but it retains almost all of the LS460's ride compliance (at least with air suspension) which I found remarkable.
> From the Motor Trend comparison in DE issue referring to the LS:
Our test car’s air suspension sorted out big bumps but struggled with small, high-frequency bumps such as the Botts’ dots that line California lanes. “We’re on pretty new pavement here, and I’m still getting lots of small vibrations from all the little bumps in the road you can’t see from the driver’s seat,” Evans said.
> From the Motor Trend referring to the g90:
"Its ride falls between the 740e and LS 500; it doesn’t have the BMW’s solidity, but it handles bumps both large and small ever so slightly better than the Lexus. "
So they're saying the 740 has the best ride, g90 2nd, LS third
Especially surprising since the LS they tested had air suspension and it's not avail. on the g90. Makes one wonder what setting they had the suspensions on when doing the bump absorption eval. Personally, mine is in COMFORT 99% of the time.
Looking fwd to Car and Driver comparison and hope they include an S560. Even if it is more expensive, people want to know how much of performance gap there is. I would also like to see a comparison of the cars "self driving" capabilities. Specifically how well it will stay centered in the lane and how often it strays.
I have also driven the G90 and the G90 and LS500 are very different cars. The G90 is very similar to the LS460L, a ride biased car with enough handling competence to make it easy and confidence inspiring to drive, but not a car you would push or choose to take on a twisty mountain road. The LS500 is that car.
I'm a more traditional buyer, and I prefer the LS460 mainly for interior room and packaging, and the smoother V8 power plant. Having driven both I'd pay the extra to get the LS500 over the G90 though.
02-25-18, 07:20 AM
#4
Lexus Fanatic
Originally Posted by jzgj55
Leg room is obviously not negotiable. weird because I've been in small cars that have a surplus of leg room. Hard to understand why they would eliminate tall buyers - especially in a car that long.
> From the Motor Trend comparison in DE issue referring to the LS:
Our test car’s air suspension sorted out big bumps but struggled with small, high-frequency bumps such as the Botts’ dots that line California lanes. “We’re on pretty new pavement here, and I’m still getting lots of small vibrations from all the little bumps in the road you can’t see from the driver’s seat,” Evans said.
Our test car’s air suspension sorted out big bumps but struggled with small, high-frequency bumps such as the Botts’ dots that line California lanes. “We’re on pretty new pavement here, and I’m still getting lots of small vibrations from all the little bumps in the road you can’t see from the driver’s seat,” Evans said.
I felt the same and I agree with that, but I think a lot of that has to do with runflat tires. I think if you replaced those runflat tires with regular tires you would solve that issue. Like I said in my review, "rides 90% as well", that would be the missing 10%.
Its ride falls between the 740e and LS 500; it doesn’t have the BMW’s solidity, but it handles bumps both large and small ever so slightly better than the Lexus. "
So they're saying the 740 has the best ride, g90 2nd, LS third
Especially surprising since the LS they tested had air suspension and it's not avail. on the g90. Makes one wonder what setting they had the suspensions on when doing the bump absorption eval. Personally, mine is in COMFORT 99% of the time.
So they're saying the 740 has the best ride, g90 2nd, LS third
Especially surprising since the LS they tested had air suspension and it's not avail. on the g90. Makes one wonder what setting they had the suspensions on when doing the bump absorption eval. Personally, mine is in COMFORT 99% of the time.
Having driven all of them I would agree with that as they are spec'ed by the factory. The G90 is on regular, soft Continental tires and the LS on UHP Bridgestone runflats. I think if you replaced the tires on the LS with what is on the G90 you'd find the ride on the LS improves.
Seems to me they went overboard to make it "sporty". If they didn't have the LC, that would make more sense. For the ride/comfort/feature people who prefer a more "classic" look (e.g. s560), they will look elsewhere. We'll see what the sales numbers are in a year from now. I hope they are good enough to maintain the model. Competition makes everyone better.
You should drive it before you totally made that statement. It is much sportier yes, and I think the compromises they made in the interior and size packaging to make it feel "sporty" are more problematic than any reductions in ride quality.
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