JFNash

I want iPod/mass storage integration with my '08 LS460 with the best audio quality possible.

Is VAISTech's VML compatible with my car? Where can it be hid? Where will the port be located to connect the external device? In the ashtray?

I prefer VML over SL2i-UP (difficult product names) for two major reasons: 1. digital audio transmission + 2. more input options (not only iSteveJobs). But I'm worried that the LS460 doesn't have enuf room to hide the boxy device as it looks bulky compared to the SL2i-UP.

Has anyone installed it on their LS460?

Do you think VAISTech will release a newer version of the device? It's on sale now. Not very excited about outdated technologies.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

yes, there is vml for ls460 as long as you have nav

http://www.vaistech.com/manuals/Application_Guide.pdf

hiding it is a challenge, not going to be easy. i guess below glove box on the passenger side is your best bet. you can run the usb port to glove box or the center armrest i guess, basically anywhere you want as long as the extension is long enough

i don't hear any words on newer vml so far

MeTrO

A very wise man told me the SL2i-UP is a better overall unit than the VML. Really, our ears will hardly (if at all) notice any difference in the car audio version of analog vs. digital from an ipod. Less expensive. Easier to hide. Who uses USB sticks/devices in a car, other than their ipod??

Now, if the ML+ actually worked like it was supposed to, that would be worth the upcharge.

Go with the SL2i-IP!

Chad

kitchamp

I had VML in my 460, the best place to hide IMHO is in the passenger footwell, behind the carpet. As far as sound quality, if you have the Mark Levinson, the difference is pretty big between analog and digital sound I think. I had a USB extension cable run from the box to the center console (I took out the AUX jack, and fed the USB cable thru that hole). Makes software upgrades a breeze.

I think the ML+ is considered the upgrade to VML, and I upgraded to ML+, and although it has a few bugs, they are working on the backup camera and fixing other bugs. Other than that, Vais puts out quality products.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

keep in mind though, the difference are more about the songs. you have to go lossless and other format to make sure the quality is good. otherwise digital or analog, it doesn't really matter as much anymore. another problem (imho) with the vml is that when using ipod, switching between playlists, artists, albums (categories) are not as easy as sl2i-up

you have ml+ in your car now? what is your car? ml+ is not fully working on all ls460 yet

kitchamp

Yea tell me about it. I have 07 LS460, and the ML+ is kinda working...let me clarify - everything works as far as the unit is concerned, except the steering wheel buttons and the backup camera. I understand there is a firmware update for the buttons, will try that this weekend. As far as the camera, every time I put the car in reverse, it either stays on the ML+ screen or gives me a black screen with white lines. Initially the install didn't work, but the tech support at Vais got me to the point where the iPod functionality works, video out works, so that part is peachy.

Back to the OP's remarks, I did notice a difference between VML and sl2i-up in another LS my buddy drives, but it could be me being partial to my own car. But the ability to use USB drives is a big plus to me, since I didn't always have an iPod on me. But rominl is definitely right--quality of the underlying music tracks is very important.

But rominl, let me say thanks for all the your comments on this site. I have lurked in the shadows for years, and picked up many tips from you. You don't happen to have a solution for ML+ in the LS do you?

JFNash

Thanks guys for the insights.

kitchamp: I would appreciate it very much if you gave me a few minutes and answered a few questions I have about the two devices (VML & ML+).

How do you compare VML with ML+ in terms of physical size? Were you able to conceal it? Where?
Would a software update resolve the backup camera issue? Or is it a permanent hardware limitation?
What functions that you're unable to use in the ML+?
Does ML+ use a single USB cable for everything (iPod, software updates, thumb drives...etc)?

Thanks.

rominl

iTrader: (4)

you are very welcome, all of us are just trying to help

yes, i learned about the ls460 problem the hard way. i got one for my client and was on the phone with vaistech support for a long while before figuring out there is a conflict.

there is no fix yet, everything is still pending, unfortunately

- vml and ml+ are the same size (length and width) but ml+ a bit thicker (not good). i spent good amount of time and couldn't find a perfect place to completely hide it. it can get pretty good, but not completely
- at this point vaistech says it's likely firmware fix (i had discussion with them in details), but as of now there is no fix yet
- yes, it's all the same usb port (for usb stick or ipod cable).

kitchamp

rominl is right on the money - the ML+ is a tad bit thicker. But I was able to tuck it vertically in the passenger footwell behind the carpet. The carpet bulges out, but not noticeable to anyone unless I point it out to them. As far as getting the unit up and running, I too was on the phone for hours, but we finally got the programming sequence right and it started working. I think Vais is now aware of some differences in the programming to get it working for the LS compared to other cars.

As far as the problems:
1. No backup camera for the LS460 as of now - like rominl said, Vais thinks this is a firmware issue, and they also feel that once the unit is compatible with 6th gen nav, then the camera will work on LS too
2. steering wheel track buttons and the phyiscal seek/track button on the radio only advance songs forwards, not backwards - the newest firmware is supposed to address this issue, but I can't confirm on the LS since I'm updating tomorrow. I'll report back
3. Minor distortion on the screen, looks like a scrolling blur top to bottom - new firmware addresses this as well I'm told

As far as USB, there is only one port. I have an extension from the unit into the center console, that way I can switch out the ipod cable for any flash drives. Batman has a good write up and review on this forum, and I basically set mine up in a similar manner. Other than the stuff I mentioned, the unit works great as an ipod solution. I think its interface leaps ahead of the old VML interface (if you have an ipod touch or iphone with OS4 or newer). If you are using any of the the other ipods or older units, the ML+ defaults to the same interface used on VML. Once that camera issue is fixed, it will be perfect.

MBR

I put the Vaistech VML in about a year ago and I'm very pleased with it. There's a large space behind the glovebox where it fits nicely and is also very close to the back of the audio unit where it needs to plug in. For the USB port, what worked best for me was to place it inside the center armrest console box just below the Aux port. Here are some pictures I took while I was doing it:

This shows the empty space below the airvent and above the front cabin air filter behind the glove box.


Here is the same space but now with the VML placed in it:


I made a simple bracket by bending a HYCO bar to ground the unit to the chassis and to hold it in place:


Here is the VML unit mounted and with cables connected:


This is a picture of the VML's connectors to the audio system, but they are wrapped in foam and electrical tape because they are hard plastic and I didn't want to risk them making any rattling noises:


This is what the plate for the Auxiliary port/12volt power plug looked like before adding the USB port:


Here is the same plate but with the USB port now in place. The port itself is just a short USB extension cable, inserted into a rectangle cut with a Dremel tool and secured from behind with some Quicksteel epoxy putty.


Since everything was all exposed, I installed a nav bypass relay nearby at the same time the VML went in. The switch location that was least obtrusive and that fit my hand best was on the vertical box panel right behind the driver's seat-temperature control. Here are the before/after photos of where the nav bypass switch went.
Before:

After:


Finally, here is a photo of the USB outlet in use with a thumb drive in place:


Hope this is helpful.

vancouverl

very good install thanks for the pics

rominl

iTrader: (4)

wow, very very cool install there, awesome!!

i wonder if ml+ can fit in that area too since it's thicker

MeTrO

MBR,

Great install and pics! Which nav relay/override are you using? Why did you go with the VML over the 2i-UP?

Chad

kitchamp

Wow, MBR, that is a great set of photos. I wish I had the guts to get into my car like that. Very clean results, I'm envious.

Just an update- I installed the newest firmware on my ML+. Still no backup camera, but screen flicker is gone and buttons work correctly.

MBR

Thank you all for your kind words.

MeTrO, I chose the VML over the SL2i-UP (ML+ wasn’t available at that time) because I felt having a generic USB port would be handy for charging up a cell phone or using other music players besides ipods. It turns out it’s just more convenient for me to leave that tiny 16gb thumb drive in there all the time so I rarely plug in my ipod. The ability to add your own hi-capacity hard drive inside the unit was also a factor. I also believed the VML would have better sound quality because of its all-digital signal path which some other reviewers have confirmed.

As far as which nav relay/override I am using, it is not any particular commercial product, if that is what you were asking. As others have posted, three wires (speed sensor, parking brake, and GPS antenna) control the blocking of address-entering, phone-dialing, audio-text-displaying, video playback, etc. It is fairly straightforward to tap into these wires and connect them to a switch. The speed sensor and antenna wires need only to be interrupted whereas the parking brake wire needs to be connected to ground. A simple three-pole/dual-throw switch could have been used, but I couldn’t find one small enough. So instead I used a momentary push button switch to trigger two relays ($5.49ea from radio shack) which do all the switching. If it hasn't already been done and there is a lot of interest, I will write up the install I did and post the pictures of it in a separate thread.

Hope this helps,
Martin