Calling All EOS Daizen Bushing Winners
11-15-05, 11:43 AM
#31
Lexus Champion
Originally Posted by RMMGS4
The price he gave is an estimate. I hope it goes down from there. Once he and Todd work out the fastest way to remove / replace these bushings, my hopes are that they can knock down the price.
I am still waiting to have mine done first. Once he gets through mine we'll have a solid price.
Cross you fingers it will be less.
For sure this is the kind of job where the labor costs much more than the price. Same thing happens if you have your timing belt replaced in a gs4. Labor is way more than the cost of the belt.
I am still waiting to have mine done first. Once he gets through mine we'll have a solid price.
Cross you fingers it will be less.
For sure this is the kind of job where the labor costs much more than the price. Same thing happens if you have your timing belt replaced in a gs4. Labor is way more than the cost of the belt.
I've been stalling, hoping that someone else would be the guinea pig.
11-22-05, 03:17 PM
#32
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Originally Posted by rominl
technically, yes, practically, it's hard. the whole idea is to push out the bushing, but it's very hard to get them pushed out.
and i talked to john on friday. he's going to work on my car next sat so he will take a look a the bushings, and then he will do glen's as well. there are 4 bushings on each side (front), so the install time should be a bit less than that for the sc
and i talked to john on friday. he's going to work on my car next sat so he will take a look a the bushings, and then he will do glen's as well. there are 4 bushings on each side (front), so the install time should be a bit less than that for the sc
What's the verdict fellas?
How did things go?
11-22-05, 06:15 PM
#33
Originally Posted by GS wanted
Glen/Henry,
What's the verdict fellas? How did things go?
What's the verdict fellas?
How did things go?Pretty slow progress. John has been in some physical pain. So his ability to do work has been limited.
Since I am in no rush I told him to take his time.
Well let's hope he feels better soon.
I'll post as soon as it's done for sure.
11-22-05, 09:18 PM
#34
actually glen, you should take your car in. john was in pain two weeks ago, but i went on sat for service and he's all good again. we actually talked about the bushings and he looked at my car with the bushings. he said he's ready to have your car worked on!
11-23-05, 08:17 AM
#35
Originally Posted by rominl
actually glen, you should take your car in. john was in pain two weeks ago, but i went on sat for service and he's all good again. we actually talked about the bushings and he looked at my car with the bushings. he said he's ready to have your car worked on!
I'll check with him. He also has all those Supra motor projects to do, so I don't know if those are done.
11-23-05, 09:56 PM
#37
OK, I'm all set to have the bushings installed this Friday. Anyone in the neighborhood, perhaps we can meet at Exact and do lunch near by like the Great Mall , etc.
Since my car is relatively low mileage and my bushings are in good shape , it will be interesting to see what my driving impressions are.
Oh and John and Todd@ TM Engineering talked about their install experiences with the bushings. Looks like the labor time for this job will be 6 hours.
On a side note, Exact will be stocking the Daizen line, so anyone interested in sway bars, bushings , etc,. down the road, give him a call let him know what model car you have so he can have an idea what to stock.
Since my car is relatively low mileage and my bushings are in good shape , it will be interesting to see what my driving impressions are.
Oh and John and Todd@ TM Engineering talked about their install experiences with the bushings. Looks like the labor time for this job will be 6 hours.
On a side note, Exact will be stocking the Daizen line, so anyone interested in sway bars, bushings , etc,. down the road, give him a call let him know what model car you have so he can have an idea what to stock.
Last edited by RMMGS4; 11-23-05 at 10:01 PM.
11-28-05, 01:41 PM
#39
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Originally Posted by RMMGS4
OK, I'm all set to have the bushings installed this Friday. Anyone in the neighborhood, perhaps we can meet at Exact and do lunch near by like the Great Mall , etc.
Since my car is relatively low mileage and my bushings are in good shape , it will be interesting to see what my driving impressions are.
Oh and John and Todd@ TM Engineering talked about their install experiences with the bushings. Looks like the labor time for this job will be 6 hours.
On a side note, Exact will be stocking the Daizen line, so anyone interested in sway bars, bushings , etc,. down the road, give him a call let him know what model car you have so he can have an idea what to stock.
Since my car is relatively low mileage and my bushings are in good shape , it will be interesting to see what my driving impressions are.
Oh and John and Todd@ TM Engineering talked about their install experiences with the bushings. Looks like the labor time for this job will be 6 hours.
On a side note, Exact will be stocking the Daizen line, so anyone interested in sway bars, bushings , etc,. down the road, give him a call let him know what model car you have so he can have an idea what to stock.
12-15-05, 12:54 AM
#40
Bushing Install Completed !
Ok sorry for the late response, but I had the bushings installed a couple of weeks back by John at Exact.
I had a nice detailed discussion with John about the install and I also compared notes with other local members who have the Daizen bushing install and another who just replaced the entire a-arm / bushing assembly, so here's my opinion about the install and other impressions:
- Installation: John charges 5 hours labor to get this done. Those who have the 20% discount coupons from the EOS meet should take advantage, before the coupon deal expires. Those who want to know more about labor discount coupons can just post here and I'll let you in on a little secret.
NO PM's please. Could John do this job in less than 5 hours? Probably, but my motto is "do you want the job done right or right now?" Those who know John, know he prefers taking the appropriate time to do it right. 
- As far as doing the install yourself, I strongly suggest you don't try, unless you really need to save $$ and are willing to spend 8+ hours of your time. Secondly, you will need access to a press and air tools wouldn't hurt either. Lastly, you are pretty much on your own if you run into a problem. As of the date of this post, I would venture to guess only a few people in the country have done this job themselves and no one in NorCal. It's not like you can post a question online when you are installing, then run into a problem on a Saturday night and then expect to get a quick answer and your car completed the next day. Those who know me, know I do a lot of custom work and most of the maintenance on my car, but in this case, I had no desire to do this job. Could I do this install myself? Yes, but I don't think it would be worth my time and effort. In this case I'd rather pay.
- Tricks to the install? Yes, John has done the SC and GS bushings and has compared notes with Todd at TM Engineering on the install tricks they've learned. If you assume your Lexus dealer is more experienced with replacing bushings, I will dare say you are wrong. To make this very clear, your Lexus dealer does not normally replace bushings because they typically change the whole arm which includes the bushings already installed from the manufacturer. I don't even think you can order OEM bushings for replacement. (Will, please chime in on my comments) Why, because the GS bushings were not designed to be replaced, just change out the whole arm. The removal of the bushings is the hard part, but pressing them in isn't fun either.
- Other shops who have replaced bushings on other cars CANNOT expect the GS install to be just another piece of cake. The bushings on the GS are not the same as on a Honda, BMW, etc. Will these shops be able to do the install? Probably, but until they have a couple of GS installs under their belt I'm sure the install time and install quality will improve, but I wouldn't want to be the Guinea Pig.
- My best advice is take it to a shop that has previously install Daizen bushings in a GS/SC/etc. Currently, Exact is the only confirmed shop. If people have tried other shops, please post your experience. Second choice would be to select a shop that has done performance bushings on other cars. As I said earlier, pressing the new bushings in is one thing, but removing them is another story. I would say that any shop that quotes between 6 and 8 hours is charging a fair price. It could even take longer if they haven't done a GS before. My rule of thumb would be if they say they've done bushings before and only charge for 3 hours or less, then I'd say they don't know what they are getting themselves into. If a shop under-estimates a job and then it takes twice as long or the install has a problem, what do you think they will do?
- Performance? Well go to Henry's thread on the GS Suspension section and read up on it. I pretty much have the same comments.
- Do note that I only had 50k miles on my car , so my bushings were only mildly worn. Could I tell the difference anyway? Heck Yeah!!! Do note that I already have the L-Tuned Steering ECU, adjustable sway bars,Tein coilovers, Rod millen front STB, Toms Lower front brace, Tom's rear lower brace and Tom's six link braces, not to mention I have 30 series profile tires up front and 25 series in the rear. If anyone comment's how their car handles like it's on rails, I'd like to think my car is more than qualified to make that statement as well . So with all these mods, all I can say is that my steering response is tighter than ever. I don't feel any added ride harshness as well.
- And that front warped rotor feel is GONE !!!!!!!!
- Henry (Rominl) and I both have AP racing 6 pot front brakes. I can tell you replacement rotors cost something over $700. When my front end started shaking during hard braking, I thought it was time for my second rotor change, but the bushing change seems to have eliminated it.
- If you have front end shake and have checked alignment , tire balance and warped rotors, you need to seriously think about changing bushings, even if your car has under 50k of mileage.
- Alignment? Well the good thing is that John at Exact marks all the parts so that the alignment will not be changed significantly when he puts the suspension back together. The bad part is, even though my bushings didn't feel bad or worn, my alignment has now changed because one of the bushings had worn and was softer than the other side.
- How do bushings affect alignment? Well in my case it affects the camber. All of those who are eating their front tires because the camber is already maxed out and is still too negative, these bushings will help. Chances are the camber will now be able to be adjusted to a more positive angle than ever before.
- Overall Impressions? Well if you read this far, you can see that spending $500+ P & L on bushings may sound like a lot of money, but if it keeps me from replacing $700 rotors and keeps me from wearing down a $600 pair of front tires, I'd say you are crazy not to do this .
The improved handling is just icing on the cake.
- Last advice. If you decide to just purchase new A-arms with stock bushings, you better calculate what your final cost will be P & L, as it probably won't be far off from doing the Daizen bushing upgrade. I would also venture to guess that the Daizen bushings will last longer than the factory bushings.
Overall, it's a win win situation.
I had a nice detailed discussion with John about the install and I also compared notes with other local members who have the Daizen bushing install and another who just replaced the entire a-arm / bushing assembly, so here's my opinion about the install and other impressions:
- Installation: John charges 5 hours labor to get this done. Those who have the 20% discount coupons from the EOS meet should take advantage, before the coupon deal expires. Those who want to know more about labor discount coupons can just post here and I'll let you in on a little secret.
NO PM's please. Could John do this job in less than 5 hours? Probably, but my motto is "do you want the job done right or right now?" Those who know John, know he prefers taking the appropriate time to do it right. - As far as doing the install yourself, I strongly suggest you don't try, unless you really need to save $$ and are willing to spend 8+ hours of your time. Secondly, you will need access to a press and air tools wouldn't hurt either. Lastly, you are pretty much on your own if you run into a problem. As of the date of this post, I would venture to guess only a few people in the country have done this job themselves and no one in NorCal. It's not like you can post a question online when you are installing, then run into a problem on a Saturday night and then expect to get a quick answer and your car completed the next day. Those who know me, know I do a lot of custom work and most of the maintenance on my car, but in this case, I had no desire to do this job. Could I do this install myself? Yes, but I don't think it would be worth my time and effort. In this case I'd rather pay.
- Tricks to the install? Yes, John has done the SC and GS bushings and has compared notes with Todd at TM Engineering on the install tricks they've learned. If you assume your Lexus dealer is more experienced with replacing bushings, I will dare say you are wrong. To make this very clear, your Lexus dealer does not normally replace bushings because they typically change the whole arm which includes the bushings already installed from the manufacturer. I don't even think you can order OEM bushings for replacement. (Will, please chime in on my comments) Why, because the GS bushings were not designed to be replaced, just change out the whole arm. The removal of the bushings is the hard part, but pressing them in isn't fun either.
- Other shops who have replaced bushings on other cars CANNOT expect the GS install to be just another piece of cake. The bushings on the GS are not the same as on a Honda, BMW, etc. Will these shops be able to do the install? Probably, but until they have a couple of GS installs under their belt I'm sure the install time and install quality will improve, but I wouldn't want to be the Guinea Pig.
- My best advice is take it to a shop that has previously install Daizen bushings in a GS/SC/etc. Currently, Exact is the only confirmed shop. If people have tried other shops, please post your experience. Second choice would be to select a shop that has done performance bushings on other cars. As I said earlier, pressing the new bushings in is one thing, but removing them is another story. I would say that any shop that quotes between 6 and 8 hours is charging a fair price. It could even take longer if they haven't done a GS before. My rule of thumb would be if they say they've done bushings before and only charge for 3 hours or less, then I'd say they don't know what they are getting themselves into. If a shop under-estimates a job and then it takes twice as long or the install has a problem, what do you think they will do?
- Performance? Well go to Henry's thread on the GS Suspension section and read up on it. I pretty much have the same comments.
- Do note that I only had 50k miles on my car , so my bushings were only mildly worn. Could I tell the difference anyway? Heck Yeah!!! Do note that I already have the L-Tuned Steering ECU, adjustable sway bars,Tein coilovers, Rod millen front STB, Toms Lower front brace, Tom's rear lower brace and Tom's six link braces, not to mention I have 30 series profile tires up front and 25 series in the rear. If anyone comment's how their car handles like it's on rails, I'd like to think my car is more than qualified to make that statement as well . So with all these mods, all I can say is that my steering response is tighter than ever. I don't feel any added ride harshness as well.
- And that front warped rotor feel is GONE !!!!!!!!
- Henry (Rominl) and I both have AP racing 6 pot front brakes. I can tell you replacement rotors cost something over $700. When my front end started shaking during hard braking, I thought it was time for my second rotor change, but the bushing change seems to have eliminated it.
- If you have front end shake and have checked alignment , tire balance and warped rotors, you need to seriously think about changing bushings, even if your car has under 50k of mileage.
- Alignment? Well the good thing is that John at Exact marks all the parts so that the alignment will not be changed significantly when he puts the suspension back together. The bad part is, even though my bushings didn't feel bad or worn, my alignment has now changed because one of the bushings had worn and was softer than the other side.
- How do bushings affect alignment? Well in my case it affects the camber. All of those who are eating their front tires because the camber is already maxed out and is still too negative, these bushings will help. Chances are the camber will now be able to be adjusted to a more positive angle than ever before.
- Overall Impressions? Well if you read this far, you can see that spending $500+ P & L on bushings may sound like a lot of money, but if it keeps me from replacing $700 rotors and keeps me from wearing down a $600 pair of front tires, I'd say you are crazy not to do this .
The improved handling is just icing on the cake. - Last advice. If you decide to just purchase new A-arms with stock bushings, you better calculate what your final cost will be P & L, as it probably won't be far off from doing the Daizen bushing upgrade. I would also venture to guess that the Daizen bushings will last longer than the factory bushings.
Overall, it's a win win situation.
Last edited by RMMGS4; 12-15-05 at 02:23 AM.
12-15-05, 01:37 AM
#41
my short notes:
- my thread on the bushing is here: https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=176231
- correct, you cannot purchase just bushings from dealership, it's not an option, there is no part number as far as i know. you can only get the whole new arm
- i am surprised that the braking warping feel was gone. the way your car vibrate was very similar to how mine was, and my rotors were warpped (new ones now). if you said your bushings are bad, i am surprised it was vibrating so bad due to suspension play?
- but i agree the bushings helps take out sooo much play (especially those little vibration at speed). that's what i noticed most after my install
- you NEED alignment, i still recommend that. the problem is you will take off the lowr control arm and you basically take out that whole bolt used for camber adjustment. you can mark it, but it could be ever so slightly off, and that will change the camber right the way already
- and just to clarify, these bushings will NOT help on camber, it's not camber kits. so after the bushings you most likely still going to max out your camber and still out of spec. mine is (pretty much same as before) but sometimes (like for glen), if your stock bushings are so soft already, alignment might be very slightly affected. but don't expect things to go miracle.
- doing full new oem control arms + labor is probably about the same as doing the daizen bushings + labor. but the new bushings are a lot more durable and performs a lot better than stock.
- my thread on the bushing is here: https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=176231
- correct, you cannot purchase just bushings from dealership, it's not an option, there is no part number as far as i know. you can only get the whole new arm
- i am surprised that the braking warping feel was gone. the way your car vibrate was very similar to how mine was, and my rotors were warpped (new ones now). if you said your bushings are bad, i am surprised it was vibrating so bad due to suspension play?
- but i agree the bushings helps take out sooo much play (especially those little vibration at speed). that's what i noticed most after my install
- you NEED alignment, i still recommend that. the problem is you will take off the lowr control arm and you basically take out that whole bolt used for camber adjustment. you can mark it, but it could be ever so slightly off, and that will change the camber right the way already
- and just to clarify, these bushings will NOT help on camber, it's not camber kits. so after the bushings you most likely still going to max out your camber and still out of spec. mine is (pretty much same as before) but sometimes (like for glen), if your stock bushings are so soft already, alignment might be very slightly affected. but don't expect things to go miracle.
- doing full new oem control arms + labor is probably about the same as doing the daizen bushings + labor. but the new bushings are a lot more durable and performs a lot better than stock.
12-15-05, 02:02 AM
#42
Originally Posted by rominl
- i am surprised that the braking warping feel was gone. the way your car vibrate was very similar to how mine was, and my rotors were warpped (new ones now). if you said your bushings are bad, i am surprised it was vibrating so bad due to suspension play?
Originally Posted by rominl
--
- you NEED alignment, i still recommend that. the problem is you will take off the lowr control arm and you basically take out that whole bolt used for camber adjustment. you can mark it, but it could be ever so slightly off, and that will change the camber right the way already
- you NEED alignment, i still recommend that. the problem is you will take off the lowr control arm and you basically take out that whole bolt used for camber adjustment. you can mark it, but it could be ever so slightly off, and that will change the camber right the way already
Originally Posted by rominl
- and just to clarify, these bushings will NOT help on camber, it's not camber kits. so after the bushings you most likely still going to max out your camber and still out of spec. mine is (pretty much same as before) but sometimes (like for glen), if your stock bushings are so soft already, alignment might be very slightly affected. but don't expect things to go miracle.
Visually, it appeared that my camber was more positive on the right side than before. This is what "I think" is happening.
I am not saying this is a camber kit, only that I believe worn bushings "in some cases" can make the camber more negative. Not claiming this as a guaranteed fix all. Just a hopeful improvement, however small.
Yes , let's talk about this more offline and even better sketch a drawing to show you what I am thinking.
Going to sleep now.
Last edited by RMMGS4; 12-15-05 at 02:05 AM.
12-15-05, 09:01 AM
#43
i know what you talking about, and it's very possible. and actually, if you worry about the upper and lower control arms, you should worry about the caster arm bushing, which is often times worn out even faster. that will seriously affect the toe settings, and that's what affect the vibration and also wear on tires
the reason i clarify was not to give people an impression that this is a camber kit. this kit COULD (and possibly) help alignment, but it wont' make it any better than if you get say new control arms
the reason i clarify was not to give people an impression that this is a camber kit. this kit COULD (and possibly) help alignment, but it wont' make it any better than if you get say new control arms
12-15-05, 10:50 AM
#44
Hey Glen,
Just wanted to throw out for the SC owners that lexus does offer replacement bushings for us now. So Daizen, Vlamos, or replacement of the whole arm are not the only options. Also from what I gathered when I talked to John just yesterday, he said that the suspension design makes it harder on the GS than the SC. So for those SC owners out there, 5 hours for the front for the GS cannot be transferred over to be the same for the SC. The SC can have all 8 arms redone in 8 hours, the rears being the hardest from what I recall.
So Glen, enjoying those bushings? Wait til Daizen comes out with the rears... I'm pretty sure they should, it'll make the whole car feel a whole lot different and not just the front.
Just wanted to throw out for the SC owners that lexus does offer replacement bushings for us now. So Daizen, Vlamos, or replacement of the whole arm are not the only options. Also from what I gathered when I talked to John just yesterday, he said that the suspension design makes it harder on the GS than the SC. So for those SC owners out there, 5 hours for the front for the GS cannot be transferred over to be the same for the SC. The SC can have all 8 arms redone in 8 hours, the rears being the hardest from what I recall.
So Glen, enjoying those bushings? Wait til Daizen comes out with the rears... I'm pretty sure they should, it'll make the whole car feel a whole lot different and not just the front.
12-15-05, 01:04 PM
#45
Originally Posted by LexAnt
Hey Glen,
Just wanted to throw out for the SC owners that lexus does offer replacement bushings for us now. So Daizen, Vlamos, or replacement of the whole arm are not the only options. Also from what I gathered when I talked to John just yesterday, he said that the suspension design makes it harder on the GS than the SC. So for those SC owners out there, 5 hours for the front for the GS cannot be transferred over to be the same for the SC. The SC can have all 8 arms redone in 8 hours, the rears being the hardest from what I recall.
So Glen, enjoying those bushings? Wait til Daizen comes out with the rears... I'm pretty sure they should, it'll make the whole car feel a whole lot different and not just the front.
Just wanted to throw out for the SC owners that lexus does offer replacement bushings for us now. So Daizen, Vlamos, or replacement of the whole arm are not the only options. Also from what I gathered when I talked to John just yesterday, he said that the suspension design makes it harder on the GS than the SC. So for those SC owners out there, 5 hours for the front for the GS cannot be transferred over to be the same for the SC. The SC can have all 8 arms redone in 8 hours, the rears being the hardest from what I recall.
So Glen, enjoying those bushings? Wait til Daizen comes out with the rears... I'm pretty sure they should, it'll make the whole car feel a whole lot different and not just the front.
anyway, yeah rear bushings would be cool, though i know that's not the next step for daizen yet
