my "HELP ME C.L."thread
07-15-12, 03:34 PM
#48
Ok. here is my turn. I would not trust any if the wiring since you didnt do it. Unplug the injectors, all six. check the polarity and see which side is getting ground and positive. write that down. now run NEW wires to the injectors, all six. wire them in batch mode, which is 1-4, 2-5, and 3-6. In other words when you run the wires, wire those together but on the trigger ground side. you can leave the positive side on the injectors from the stock wiring harness. if you still dont trust that, then run a seperate relay triggered on by the kick panel, then trigger the injectors that way, the way i did. does this make sense. if you run new wirez and check for ohm resistance and power, you have eliminated one less problem. if you cant figure it out, i will call you when i am back from vacation.
this totally went over my head. but yea, when you get back give me a ring.
07-15-12, 06:43 PM
#52
megamax, i respect the fact that you sent your harness off to account2x to have him make it power your car for you, but if you're going to be ripping into this stuff and trying to troubleshoot why it's not running, you need to understand how an ECU works -- and how these toyota ECUs work more specifically.
please read this entire long *** post.
you did not read my previous posts because already attempted to test your crank angle sensor and i told you it was working correctly if your car was sparking ---- you got it to run with starter fluid -dangerously might i add- in your first video. it was sparking when you did this or it wouldn't have fired at all.
now, about the ECU:
this is what is supposed to happen with your ECU/sensors/relays when you turn the key ON:
1. the ignition switch sends 12v+ to the IGSW pin at the ECU.
2. the ECU then powers 12v+ at MREL pin on the ecu
3. ^^^ MREL pin turns on the EFI relay, which sends 12v to your IACV, injectors, igniter, ignition coils, and B1 and B+ pins at your ecu.
4. ^^^ B1 and B+ get powered at this time to let the ecu know that the EFI relay and all the injection/ignition/iacv is turned on.
b1 and b+ only get 12v after the ECU triggers the EFI relay with the MREL pin.
^ let me say that again. MREL is an OUTPUT to trigger the EFI relay (EFI relay powers your injectors, ignition, IACV, B1, B+, and several other things).
B1 and B+ won't get powered when you have the ECU unplugged and sitting in the passenger seat.
the ECU controls the triggering of the EFI relay to keep the IACV on for 2-3 seconds after you turn the car off so it can reset the IACV or something. this seems weird, but this is how toyota did it.
BATT should have 12v all the time. (INPUT)
IGSW should have 12v only when the key is ON and in START. (INPUT)
MREL should have 12v only when the key is ON and in START. (OUTPUT)
B1 should have 12v only when the key is ON and in START. (INPUT)
B+ should have 12v only when the key is ON and in START. (INPUT)
i just re-wired a 1jz mercedes 190e for a friend last weekend and this MREL / B1 / B+ stuff is fresh on my mind.
OKAY, that has the ECU power stuff covered...
now, your crank angle sensor:
the ECU uses these as INPUTS. if you unplug the CAS and stick your multimeter terminals into the harness end of the plug it will show nothing, as it did in your video. (and did you have the ecu still sitting in the floor during this?) and if you're checking for voltage, the two pins on the sensor will also show nothing.
these cars use reluctor type crank/cam angle sensors, which are two pins and they make their own small amount of voltage and send sine wave pulses back to the ECU, which the ECU measures to determine what RPM the engine is at. i think the crank trigger wheel has 12 teeth and the cam has 2 teeth (one for each sensor). so every rpm the ECU sees 12 crank pulses and 1 cam pulse -- the cam sensor that sends a pulse back tells the ECU which stroke the engine is in.
if your car is sparking, these are working. your ECU uses the same RPM input pulses to fire the injectors as is does to fire the ignition coils. your engine is sparking (or it wouldnt have run when you dangerously sprayed starter fluid into the intake).
for future reference, the only simple way to test a reluctor sensor like this is to set your multimeter to OHMS and make sure there is resistance across the two pins of the sensor, which means it's probably not broken inside.
1. go back and check that there is power at the IGSW pin with the key ON and in CRANK
2. go back and check that MREL pin has 12v when the key is ON and the ECU is plugged in.
3. go back and check that MREL pin has continuity with your EFI RELAY trigger pin. (i think this is called IGNITION MAIN RELAY on the sc400) it's the big green relay in your fuse box.
4. go back and check that B1 and B+ are getting powered with the damn ECU plugged in. you'll have to use something like a safety pin or a needly to backprobe those pins from the wire side of that ECU plug.
0. talk to your boy account2x (why isn't he in here helping you?) and make sure he knows the difference between the sc300 EFI and sc400 EFI wiring and make sure he repinned your harness correctly for an SC400. this was the problem we had with Mark's. i had no idea the SC400 and SC300 EFI wiring was different til i got down there and melted my brain.
if none of this makes sense, good luck.
my paypal address is jacob.cartmill@gmail.com
please read this entire long *** post.
you did not read my previous posts because already attempted to test your crank angle sensor and i told you it was working correctly if your car was sparking ---- you got it to run with starter fluid -dangerously might i add- in your first video. it was sparking when you did this or it wouldn't have fired at all.
now, about the ECU:
this is what is supposed to happen with your ECU/sensors/relays when you turn the key ON:
1. the ignition switch sends 12v+ to the IGSW pin at the ECU.
2. the ECU then powers 12v+ at MREL pin on the ecu
3. ^^^ MREL pin turns on the EFI relay, which sends 12v to your IACV, injectors, igniter, ignition coils, and B1 and B+ pins at your ecu.
4. ^^^ B1 and B+ get powered at this time to let the ecu know that the EFI relay and all the injection/ignition/iacv is turned on.
b1 and b+ only get 12v after the ECU triggers the EFI relay with the MREL pin.
^ let me say that again. MREL is an OUTPUT to trigger the EFI relay (EFI relay powers your injectors, ignition, IACV, B1, B+, and several other things).
B1 and B+ won't get powered when you have the ECU unplugged and sitting in the passenger seat.
the ECU controls the triggering of the EFI relay to keep the IACV on for 2-3 seconds after you turn the car off so it can reset the IACV or something. this seems weird, but this is how toyota did it.
BATT should have 12v all the time. (INPUT)
IGSW should have 12v only when the key is ON and in START. (INPUT)
MREL should have 12v only when the key is ON and in START. (OUTPUT)
B1 should have 12v only when the key is ON and in START. (INPUT)
B+ should have 12v only when the key is ON and in START. (INPUT)
i just re-wired a 1jz mercedes 190e for a friend last weekend and this MREL / B1 / B+ stuff is fresh on my mind.
OKAY, that has the ECU power stuff covered...
now, your crank angle sensor:
the ECU uses these as INPUTS. if you unplug the CAS and stick your multimeter terminals into the harness end of the plug it will show nothing, as it did in your video. (and did you have the ecu still sitting in the floor during this?) and if you're checking for voltage, the two pins on the sensor will also show nothing.
these cars use reluctor type crank/cam angle sensors, which are two pins and they make their own small amount of voltage and send sine wave pulses back to the ECU, which the ECU measures to determine what RPM the engine is at. i think the crank trigger wheel has 12 teeth and the cam has 2 teeth (one for each sensor). so every rpm the ECU sees 12 crank pulses and 1 cam pulse -- the cam sensor that sends a pulse back tells the ECU which stroke the engine is in.
if your car is sparking, these are working. your ECU uses the same RPM input pulses to fire the injectors as is does to fire the ignition coils. your engine is sparking (or it wouldnt have run when you dangerously sprayed starter fluid into the intake).
for future reference, the only simple way to test a reluctor sensor like this is to set your multimeter to OHMS and make sure there is resistance across the two pins of the sensor, which means it's probably not broken inside.
1. go back and check that there is power at the IGSW pin with the key ON and in CRANK
2. go back and check that MREL pin has 12v when the key is ON and the ECU is plugged in.
3. go back and check that MREL pin has continuity with your EFI RELAY trigger pin. (i think this is called IGNITION MAIN RELAY on the sc400) it's the big green relay in your fuse box.
4. go back and check that B1 and B+ are getting powered with the damn ECU plugged in. you'll have to use something like a safety pin or a needly to backprobe those pins from the wire side of that ECU plug.
0. talk to your boy account2x (why isn't he in here helping you?) and make sure he knows the difference between the sc300 EFI and sc400 EFI wiring and make sure he repinned your harness correctly for an SC400. this was the problem we had with Mark's. i had no idea the SC400 and SC300 EFI wiring was different til i got down there and melted my brain.
if none of this makes sense, good luck.
my paypal address is jacob.cartmill@gmail.com
Last edited by cartmill; 07-15-12 at 06:53 PM.
07-15-12, 06:56 PM
#53
1JZ Single SC400
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Paypal sent.... Thanks Cartmill!!!! Lol
On the serious side, Jim double check everything that he is talking about. Jacob knows what is going on with this wiring and not starting issue. He, along with others on here, are pure geniuses when it comes to this wiring stuff. I was clueless when he started talking to me, I was ready to just fly someone down here and pay for food, pier diem, and expenses ... Again dont get frustrated as I did. Check everything he as taking the time out to type. If you have checked all this, and all is good,report back all your findings. Mine was more difficuk due to using an AEM. Good luck and let us know !!!
On the serious side, Jim double check everything that he is talking about. Jacob knows what is going on with this wiring and not starting issue. He, along with others on here, are pure geniuses when it comes to this wiring stuff. I was clueless when he started talking to me, I was ready to just fly someone down here and pay for food, pier diem, and expenses ... Again dont get frustrated as I did. Check everything he as taking the time out to type. If you have checked all this, and all is good,report back all your findings. Mine was more difficuk due to using an AEM. Good luck and let us know !!!
07-15-12, 07:34 PM
#54
did you check your ecu yet..
When the 1JZ ecu capacitors go, it usually affects the injectors.
your car is firing, but to me it doesn't sound like its firing at the right time.
so you could have a map sensor wired wrong + no fuel condition,
or more likely just a bad ecu.
also you have a resistor pack installed for the injectors right?
in this thread it was just a simple ground issue, make sure your intake ground is hooked up no joke.
http://www.supraforums.com/forum/sho...o-start-thread
When the 1JZ ecu capacitors go, it usually affects the injectors.
your car is firing, but to me it doesn't sound like its firing at the right time.
so you could have a map sensor wired wrong + no fuel condition,
or more likely just a bad ecu.
also you have a resistor pack installed for the injectors right?
in this thread it was just a simple ground issue, make sure your intake ground is hooked up no joke.
http://www.supraforums.com/forum/sho...o-start-thread
Last edited by Ali SC3; 07-15-12 at 07:57 PM.
07-16-12, 09:05 AM
#56
i knew that the JDM 2jzgte uses high impedance injectors, but i thought for some reason the 1jz used low impedance but i guess they use high impedance as well. thought it was worth a mention seeing as the OP has no fuel but proper voltage.
Last edited by Ali SC3; 07-16-12 at 09:10 AM.
07-16-12, 10:51 AM
#57
so in this thread pages and pages back i opened up the ecu when i got it ans the boards and caps looked good. not sure if they can look good and still be crapo??
so listening to cartmill iam at the passenger side with the ecu plugged up and checking the pins.
--1. the igsw switch pin dosen't have any power when in the on position or crank
--2. the mrel has no power when in on position or crank
--3. the main relay(green) does have contuinity
--4. b1 anf b+ does not have power.
so listening to cartmill iam at the passenger side with the ecu plugged up and checking the pins.
--1. the igsw switch pin dosen't have any power when in the on position or crank
--2. the mrel has no power when in on position or crank
--3. the main relay(green) does have contuinity
--4. b1 anf b+ does not have power.
07-16-12, 11:22 AM
#58
so your ECU has no power.
1. hook 12v straight up to that IGSW pin through the back of the wire with that safety pin like you have hooked up there. like run a wire straight from the + on the battery to that pin, and crank the car and see if it starts.
and be careful and make sure that wire doesnt ground out on anything when you hook it up. like wrap it in electrical tape or something. if you touch the battery + straight to the ECU case or something, it could totally fry the ECU.
2. MREL is dependent on the IGSW. igsw has no power, so that makes sense.
3. i meant check continuity between between the MREL pin AT THE ECU and the trigger pin on the RELAY, not checking two pins like whatever you're doing in that picture.
4. b1 and b+ don't get power til both IGSW and MREL are working, so that makes sense.
Last edited by cartmill; 07-16-12 at 11:27 AM.
07-16-12, 03:27 PM
#60
yes.
is any of this making sense?
that IGSW pin is supposed to get 12v+ when you turn the key to ON. that's not happening for whatever reason.
so make it happen by running a wire straight from the battery to see if that turns the ECU on
(and turns on the EFI relay and sensors)
is any of this making sense?
that IGSW pin is supposed to get 12v+ when you turn the key to ON. that's not happening for whatever reason.
so make it happen by running a wire straight from the battery to see if that turns the ECU on
(and turns on the EFI relay and sensors)