is a vvti head swap on a non vvti GE possible?
03-28-20, 03:04 AM
#1
10th Gear
Thread Starter
is a vvti head swap on a non vvti GE possible?
i have a 97 SC300 with the stock non vvti 2JZ GE engine. i want to get a supra intake modified for the GE, as well as coil packs as opposed to the distributor. what are some good options for an intake, and could i vvti swap the head?
03-28-20, 02:10 PM
#2
The VVTI head will bolt to a ge block but the VVTI won't work. It needs a line from the oil pump to the head but the ge computer won't work correctly with it. Having owned both a regular ge and a VVTI ge the power difference isn't worth the effort.
Now, if you ever go to a turbo an aftermarket engine management system can run the VVTI and it does help with low end power.
There are forward facing intakes that fit the ge head that start around $700-$800 on ebay.
Now, if you ever go to a turbo an aftermarket engine management system can run the VVTI and it does help with low end power.
There are forward facing intakes that fit the ge head that start around $700-$800 on ebay.
Last edited by FatBrian81; 03-28-20 at 02:18 PM.
03-28-20, 02:15 PM
#3
You absolutely can. It's just a little more work for this configuration. You can do this with a 2JZ-GE VVT-i head or a 2JZ-GTE VVT-i head. The ARP head bolts you'll need are the same and so are your head gasket options. We usually recommend an OEM Toyota 2JZ-GTE head gasket.
For the VVT-i system you will need an additional oil feed adapter kit from either PHR or Titan (I can't recall who makes this part) that pulls oil feed from your non-vvt-i block up to the VVT-i cylinder head.
From there you will need an ECU that can control the VVT-i system. One of the most common solutions is an JDM Aristo 2JZ-GTE VVT-i ECU although if you can find one a JDM Supra 2JZ-GTE VVT-i ECU in automatic or manual version will work as well (note that the Aristo ECU requires a little additional circuitry for A/C function but it's not a big deal to do).
With the right tune your turbocharged 2JZ engine with VVT-i on the intake cam can deliver improved low end power and very slightly better fuel economy (again, depending on the tune). Since you are almost undoubtedly going with a single turbo setup this only helps.
Take a look at Gerrb's build thread and look at one of his recent cars where he builds an NA-T from my old 200k+ mile 2JZ-GE Non-VVT-i block, a 2JZ-GE VVT-i head, Treadstone exhaust manifold and (I think) something like a modern 58mm or 61mm turbo. Very good combination.
The usual other SC300 NA-T requirements still apply regarding the drilling out and tapping of your upper oil pan for the turbo oil return and any applicable modification to your wiring harness to switch totally from distributor ignition to coil pack ignition.
However it is notable that a 1998-2000 2JZ-GE VVT-i engine harness already is set up for coil pack distributor-less ignition albeit in a slightly different form (I think) compared to how a 2JZ-GTE's coil pack ignition is set up. Please look into what specific ignition wiring configuration your ECU of choice will require for this... but it should be less to convert over if starting with a 2JZ-GE VVT-i wiring harness. This would extend to the tachometer output signal since 98-00 VVT-i SC300's output a lower voltage tach signal to the dash directly from their ECUs that is the same as those on Supra MKIV TT's and Soarer 1JZ-GTE's.
Also, for this type of configuration and ECU control you will need a crank sensor signal. 1996-1997 SC300 Non-VVT-i engine blocks already have this sensor in place for their OBD2 electronics but 1992-1995 SC300 Non-VVT-i engine blocks do not.
To correct this you will need to purchase a new OEM 2JZ-GE VVT-i oil pump (also carries the same part number as for 1996-1997 SC300's and GS300's) which has the mounting location for a factory crank angle sensor.
And you'll also need the correct oil pump crank gear with the correct number of teeth. There is one version of the oil pump crank gear for 2JZ-GTE Non-VVT-i's, another version for 2JZ-GTE VVT-i's and I think another version for 2JZ-GE VVT-i's. Please someone correct me if I'm wrong about there being three different crank sensor compatible oil pump gears.
There is more info on it in this big thread:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/per...e-guru-11.html
Anyway you just need the correct crank sensor gear, the 2JZ-GE VVT-i oil pump, an OEM crank angle sensor and that part of the swap is good to go. I would recommend doing that part of the conversion at the same time you remove, drill and tap your GE oil pan's turbo oil return area. Also at the same time it's a perfect opportunity to throw on a brand new OEM crank dampener pulley or Fluidampr.
Pay close attention to the TSRM procedure for how Toyota wants you to apply the FIPG gasket forming material when you re-set the oil pan into place and prior to that, carefully clean that upper oil pan of ALL metal shaving debris and dry it off completely before you reinstall it. Also when you clean off the oil FIPG gasket material use plastic scraping tools *only* and be careful not to allow any of the old gasket material to get into the crankshaft area.
Just take your time with it patiently. Use a little old newspaper over the rotating assembly and cavities if necessary to keep it clean while you work. I believe a little isopropyl alcohol on a disposable blue shop rag will do to fully remove any remaining gasket material residue before you apply new FIPG in the pattern the TSRM requires. Also remember that the FIPG material has a finite setup time. Again, follow the SC300 or Supra MKIV TSRM guide for full instructions.
For the VVT-i system you will need an additional oil feed adapter kit from either PHR or Titan (I can't recall who makes this part) that pulls oil feed from your non-vvt-i block up to the VVT-i cylinder head.
From there you will need an ECU that can control the VVT-i system. One of the most common solutions is an JDM Aristo 2JZ-GTE VVT-i ECU although if you can find one a JDM Supra 2JZ-GTE VVT-i ECU in automatic or manual version will work as well (note that the Aristo ECU requires a little additional circuitry for A/C function but it's not a big deal to do).
With the right tune your turbocharged 2JZ engine with VVT-i on the intake cam can deliver improved low end power and very slightly better fuel economy (again, depending on the tune). Since you are almost undoubtedly going with a single turbo setup this only helps.
Take a look at Gerrb's build thread and look at one of his recent cars where he builds an NA-T from my old 200k+ mile 2JZ-GE Non-VVT-i block, a 2JZ-GE VVT-i head, Treadstone exhaust manifold and (I think) something like a modern 58mm or 61mm turbo. Very good combination.
The usual other SC300 NA-T requirements still apply regarding the drilling out and tapping of your upper oil pan for the turbo oil return and any applicable modification to your wiring harness to switch totally from distributor ignition to coil pack ignition.
However it is notable that a 1998-2000 2JZ-GE VVT-i engine harness already is set up for coil pack distributor-less ignition albeit in a slightly different form (I think) compared to how a 2JZ-GTE's coil pack ignition is set up. Please look into what specific ignition wiring configuration your ECU of choice will require for this... but it should be less to convert over if starting with a 2JZ-GE VVT-i wiring harness. This would extend to the tachometer output signal since 98-00 VVT-i SC300's output a lower voltage tach signal to the dash directly from their ECUs that is the same as those on Supra MKIV TT's and Soarer 1JZ-GTE's.
Also, for this type of configuration and ECU control you will need a crank sensor signal. 1996-1997 SC300 Non-VVT-i engine blocks already have this sensor in place for their OBD2 electronics but 1992-1995 SC300 Non-VVT-i engine blocks do not.
To correct this you will need to purchase a new OEM 2JZ-GE VVT-i oil pump (also carries the same part number as for 1996-1997 SC300's and GS300's) which has the mounting location for a factory crank angle sensor.
And you'll also need the correct oil pump crank gear with the correct number of teeth. There is one version of the oil pump crank gear for 2JZ-GTE Non-VVT-i's, another version for 2JZ-GTE VVT-i's and I think another version for 2JZ-GE VVT-i's. Please someone correct me if I'm wrong about there being three different crank sensor compatible oil pump gears.
There is more info on it in this big thread:
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/per...e-guru-11.html
Anyway you just need the correct crank sensor gear, the 2JZ-GE VVT-i oil pump, an OEM crank angle sensor and that part of the swap is good to go. I would recommend doing that part of the conversion at the same time you remove, drill and tap your GE oil pan's turbo oil return area. Also at the same time it's a perfect opportunity to throw on a brand new OEM crank dampener pulley or Fluidampr.
Pay close attention to the TSRM procedure for how Toyota wants you to apply the FIPG gasket forming material when you re-set the oil pan into place and prior to that, carefully clean that upper oil pan of ALL metal shaving debris and dry it off completely before you reinstall it. Also when you clean off the oil FIPG gasket material use plastic scraping tools *only* and be careful not to allow any of the old gasket material to get into the crankshaft area.
Just take your time with it patiently. Use a little old newspaper over the rotating assembly and cavities if necessary to keep it clean while you work. I believe a little isopropyl alcohol on a disposable blue shop rag will do to fully remove any remaining gasket material residue before you apply new FIPG in the pattern the TSRM requires. Also remember that the FIPG material has a finite setup time. Again, follow the SC300 or Supra MKIV TSRM guide for full instructions.
Last edited by KahnBB6; 03-28-20 at 02:45 PM.
04-16-20, 01:24 PM
#5
depends who you ask, if you don't have a bunch of extra oil coolers etc.. things that drop pressure, then just use the GE vvti oil pump to keep the right oil pressure (pevent front/rear main seal issues).
If you have more coolers etc.. remote filter blah blah or just need more oil pressure, then use the GTE oil pump. Since the GE block doesn't have oil squirters, this can be a little much pressure just really depends on lots of factors.
A lot of really built motors will use higher oil pressure pumps, so it really just depends but a basic na-t I always say match the pump to the block unless you have extra time to chase oil leaks.
If you have more coolers etc.. remote filter blah blah or just need more oil pressure, then use the GTE oil pump. Since the GE block doesn't have oil squirters, this can be a little much pressure just really depends on lots of factors.
A lot of really built motors will use higher oil pressure pumps, so it really just depends but a basic na-t I always say match the pump to the block unless you have extra time to chase oil leaks.
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KahnBB6 (04-16-20)
04-16-20, 02:49 PM
#6
^^ I’m in agreement with Ali.
Generally if you’re building a 2JZ-GE block (no built in piston oil squirters) then use the 1996+ GE VVT-i oil pump that has the crank sensor mounting provision.
The GTE oil pump puts out more pressure. It was intended by Toyota for the extra requirements of the GTE block’s piston oil squirters, extra twin turbo oil feed and return piping and GTE oil cooler.
A GTE oil pump on a mild NA-T GE block has in some cases and under certain conditions caused (as mentioned above) front main seal blowout issues. It is overkill in most GE block scenarios.
But the exceptions of having a lot of oil coolers, a remote oil filter apparatus, etc. in a high HP engine all together *might* warrant a higher pressure GTE oil pump for some builds. But how that is determined really depends.
Generally if you’re building a GE block you should stick with the GE VVT-i oil pump (exactly the same as the 92-95 non-vvt-i oil pump. It just has the extra spot for a crank sensor and also a spot for mounting an IS300/Supra M/T accessory belt dampener).
If you install an aftermarket oil pressure sender for a gauge at either the IS300 Union Bolt location or with an oil filter sandwich plate you should be seeing a normal oil pressure of around 20-25psi at idle which will raise reasonably to a point while under load. The GE oil pump should maintain that range normally on a GE block.
An oil pump that flows more than the GTE I know little about but even with high HP builds, to my knowledge the factory Toyota pumps are still what most people recommend using.
Generally if you’re building a 2JZ-GE block (no built in piston oil squirters) then use the 1996+ GE VVT-i oil pump that has the crank sensor mounting provision.
The GTE oil pump puts out more pressure. It was intended by Toyota for the extra requirements of the GTE block’s piston oil squirters, extra twin turbo oil feed and return piping and GTE oil cooler.
A GTE oil pump on a mild NA-T GE block has in some cases and under certain conditions caused (as mentioned above) front main seal blowout issues. It is overkill in most GE block scenarios.
But the exceptions of having a lot of oil coolers, a remote oil filter apparatus, etc. in a high HP engine all together *might* warrant a higher pressure GTE oil pump for some builds. But how that is determined really depends.
Generally if you’re building a GE block you should stick with the GE VVT-i oil pump (exactly the same as the 92-95 non-vvt-i oil pump. It just has the extra spot for a crank sensor and also a spot for mounting an IS300/Supra M/T accessory belt dampener).
If you install an aftermarket oil pressure sender for a gauge at either the IS300 Union Bolt location or with an oil filter sandwich plate you should be seeing a normal oil pressure of around 20-25psi at idle which will raise reasonably to a point while under load. The GE oil pump should maintain that range normally on a GE block.
An oil pump that flows more than the GTE I know little about but even with high HP builds, to my knowledge the factory Toyota pumps are still what most people recommend using.
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Kris9884 (08-07-21)
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