Guru

Obviously these guys did not engineer their intakes. They just took whatever diameter pipe they had lying around so befroe install just measure your stock MAF housing internal diameter and the new one. If they are different, do not install without tuning.

Stage3

iTrader: (3)

wait, wait, wait... You are telling me that i am going to have to tune the car after just installing an intake Conical filter????? for some reason (maybe because i am a newbie to the whole "tuning around the MAF") that just doesnt seem very logical. no where that i have read on the RMM site, does it ever say anything about that...

redgs4

Guru's opening statement may be a tad extreme. Many people have the RMM and most do not have to perform any added tuning. If you are not having any problems, be happy and know that at least a little extra power awaits if you want to tune. If you are having problems, this thread could apply to you.

Guru

Well you can bolt it on without tuning, but looking at what the ECU is doing when you do that, I don't recommend it. I ended up having to add 25% on the s-AFC across the board at part throttle just to get it back to 0% correction because the larger MAF leaned it out due to changes in MAF voltage (not really due to intake). It is the MAF housing which is crititcal here, not the actual filter. These are things I notice but some kits out there which obviously are not engineered very well. If your intake has the exact same internal diameter as the stock unit, than very little correction wil be necessary as the MAF voltage scale is left untouched. I sincerely doubt most of the guys here even thought about checking their ECU values with an OBD II logger, nor did they check AF mixtures with a wideband. SInce this is what I do everyday (I sometimes even eat lunch on the dyno), I may have been more akin to seeing these glaring errors, but in the back of my mind I knew I would have to retune this thing completely even before bolting it on. That is the reason I had the intake here for 6 months before installing. I knew I had to get my car on the dyno before driving it and this was the first chance I have had (been super busy). Bottom line? Not all intakes are the same so before you take my comments as being universal, take a nice set of calipers and measure your MAF housing. If it is same diameter as stock, you shouldn't have any major problems bolting it on but knowing these cars and how sensitive they are, I wouldn't. Even SRT includes an ECU with their intakes and I know why. Same reason I will not install one here at the shop without tuning the fuel curve. The cars are tuned right to their limit in tems of fuel and timing. Detonation is common if you are not tuned in properly and make any drastic changes to the airflow. All I'm saying is be careful. I don't trust what the manufacturer says, I test things here myself with my own equipment and dyno. I suggest you guys be careful with intakes but if you have a good dyno tuner, you can get great results and still be safe, just do things correctly is all. If you do not know enough to mess with it, take the car to someone who is good with these things. Good luck.

lexusondubs

iTrader: (9)

so if i add the srt intake with the piggyback ecu i should be ok ???

l3xu5

dan...good to see another michigan member...

i've been thinking about getting a s-afc. My Injen intake was installed last year and haven't had any trouble but i;m starting to think i should have it check out and make sure its fine.

Dragon at autowerks helped me install the intake so i'm sure he did a good job.
I think you recently dynoed my friends jeffs eclipse. Right now jeff is trying to find me a used safc that someone is trying to sell...so i may be in sometime this summer to get my gs3 tuned.

redgs4

Well, I'll defer to the man who eats lunch on the dyno. It may not help the power output, and heck, it may even hurt the output. All I'm saying is that many people have it and it does not appear to have damaged their cars in any way.

I think there were at least two versions of the RMM intake. And I have read about some folks having issues with intakes in general when they switch from the stock aftermarket filter to something else. Not sure if either of these points make a difference here.

Guru

I actually tune a lot of Autowerks cars. We have a good working relationship and we help each other out. Nice guys and do good work. Yes I tune a lot of EVO's/Eclipses. Jeff is the one with the T28 right? I have done an Injen intake on an IS300 and yes there were a lot of problems with AF mixture. A very lean condition at very low RPM. Very wierd and not the same problem I encountered with my RMM intake. The RMM was due to the MAF housing so the lean condition was across the board. ON the IS300, it was only in spots which leads me to believe it was turbulence or just plain got good airflow at low RPM. EIther way, we gained over 20 ft lbs of torque at low RPM's and a good 8-10 whp across the board just by tuning. Probably more than the intake made so yes it would most likely be beneficial. Let me know if you need any help.

l3xu5

jeff is the one with the 16g with 6-bolt in a 2nd gen eclipse.
He wants to know if you have fresh ink for your printer yet. He's still looking for a better print out for his dyno.
His results:301whp 280ft/lbs of torque at 21psi w/ Net 98 Octane fuel

I'm defintaly going to need your help in tuning sometime this summer. As soon as i get my hands on a s-afcII. I would like to redyno my car after i get another piece of exhaust from carton toyota. I already have the cat back exhaust. I'm just waiting for the midpipe.


I'll have Dragon contact you as soon as possible.

Jim

Guru

No problem Jim. I just installed my Fujitsubo Legalis R on my own car. Sounds awesome and super quiet. I love it. Now time to make my custom test pipes.

GILLEXUS

iTrader: (14)

Guru,
Since you've done alot of dyno's & know about wideband O2's Is the wideband O'2 reading that is taken from the tail pipe on the dyno that acurate? The factory O'2 sensors take thrir reading in the exhaust pre-catalytic. It seems like the O2 level would be different at the tail pipe after the catalytic than before the the cat.

I thought about getting an air-fuel meter w/ a wide band sensor and everyone I've talked to said the sensor should place before the cat.. Is this correct?

Guru

Well usually on the cars we test there is a turbo and no cats so it is a none issue but that is correct. If you are trying to tune a very involved setup or are using closed loop wideband fuel control it is always best to have the wideband right after the turbine exit. As for testing, it is best to have it in the exhaust somewhere but I did not feel like welding an extra bung on my downpipe so I didn't bother. It makes little difference if it is before or after the cat for the testing we were doing. The more critical thing is reversion from the outside air. We put the O2 in a pipe to keep this to a minimum but I do get a little at idle. At WOT during testing it does not make any major difference.

koreanpers

hmm...so maybe i should get mine tuned too. i have the weapon r intake. and when i put it on...i felt a loss in low end torque. i dont have the afc controller. how much are those?

l3xu5

i'm about to get one..so far i've found it for around 400 + installation.. 350 +install if you look hard.
My safc is on hold right now cause ive got tein coilovers coming in.

koreanpers

what brand are ppl buying? and its a air/fuel controller correct?