Lets Drive

iTrader: (3)

Because it depends on the area of the metal that you're talking about. An intercooler core is far larger than a 1 foot tube, with fins designed to cool the air inside as air is passed through. I don't want to stray too much into FI, but after air hits the compressor blades, it heats up to a given temp rather quickly, regardless of ambient air temps. After going WOT a few times, there is just no way incoming air is going to cool down the blades by much- the end result of compressed air means a turbochargers efficiency won't be near 100%. Paying more attention to the intercooler (ducting, spraying fins with N2O, etc.) will have more effect on power (hence why heatsoak saps power so quickly).

Ramon

Is there a tool like that for the IS350?

Lets Drive

iTrader: (3)

Nothing thats available to the public to my knowledge.

al503

My point was that people are claiming that the air is moving too fast for it to be affected. Efficiency (between an IC and intake tube) aside, the principle is the same. That's what I'm trying to get at.

caymandive

iTrader: (2)

Using an intercooler is also not a good example for this as they also use what I mentioned earlier with the hair dryers. (FORCED CONVECTION) Yes the air is still traveling at a high speed through an intercooler, but it is designed to cool the hot compressed air from the turbo that flows through many tubes inside the intercooler. The turbo air transfers heat to the tubes, warming the tubes and cooling the turbo air. Outside air (or water) passes over the tubes and between fins that are attached to the tubes. Heat is transferred from the hot tubes and fins to the cool outside air. This heats the outside air while cooling the tubes. Cooling of that air is what is removed by both the flowing outside air and the absorption of the intercooler body. You can transfer more heat (and have cooler outlet temps) with more heat transfer area. That means buying a new intercooler with more tubes, more fins, longer tubes, or all three. Heat transfer goes really well when there is a large temperature difference, or driving force and we just don't have that in a naturally aspirated car.

We are talking about a measely 1 foot long aluminum tube here. No way is it possible to heat the air with this tube to a degree where it would negatively affect performance. The design once again is the key factor here and obtaining cooler outside air.

caymandive

iTrader: (2)

It's not the same, but only slightly similar.

Ramon

Ok, well I just got back from work and here are my conclusions...

-When the vehicle is simply idling, or off after being drivin, both intakes get hot but the Joe Z gets significantly hotter.

-During my lunch break today, I put the Joe Z intake back on. At the end of the day I made the 20 mile trip home, mostly freeway driving with the last 3 miles being city driving, but very little stop and go. Outside temps peaked at 86 degrees, but was at 83 most of the the time. It was a couple of degrees warmer than when I did this whith the stock pipe. Once I pulled into my driveway I popped the hood and felt the Joe Z intake and to my surprise, it was quite cool. Actually felt a little cooler than the stock rubber pipe did right after a drive.

During slow stop and go traffic, I am convinced the Joe Z would have a warmer intake charge, but as was pointed out before, in that situation you are not producing anywhere near max HP anyway so it's a moot point.

It also appears that the aluminum pipe is able to rid itself of the heat rather quickly, so provided that the reason it stayed so cool was because of the air flow in and around the engine bay and not necessarily the increased air flowing through it, then I'm a happy man. Obviously the only real way to know that is by measuring the intake charge, but as it stands right now I have no way of doing that. Judging by Joe Z intake setups for the 1IS, and no reports of problems, as well as Joe Z's confidance in his product, I am willing to give it the benfiit of the doubt.

casey225

Ramon, do you notice a difference with Joe Z? I can't measure bhp, and anyone who thinks they will notice an extra 5 on top of 305 is kidding themselves. Pretty much everyone I've seen on here has noticed improved throttle response, wouldn't you have to assume there has been some improvement, even if we don't have the means to measure it?

caymandive

iTrader: (2)

You are right about not being able to notice a 5hp difference. I havne't noticed a power gain (butt dyno isn't that senstive), but it's there when I confirmed it on my dyno test, throttle response is better and it adds a more aggressive sound to the engine.

Ramon

Honestly, the only difference I can tell is the very slight change in how the car sounds. The butt dyno does not feel any extra HP, nor does it feel a loss.

I learned many years ago that most people's butt dyno's are horrendously inaccurate so I try not to make any assumptions based on that. Just look at the people who claim they felt a difference with the LMS style intake, when in reality it loses about 10 HP if I remember correctly.

The good news is that we have dyno charts already for the JoeZ that prove it makes power. I was just concerened if it was possible that it may lose power if heat becomes a factor. After performing my not so scientific test, it would seem that while the car is in motion that the Joe Z intake is not any more prone to heat soak then the stock intake. Again, the only way to know for sure is to measure the intake charge and since we currently don't have a way of doing that I'm simply making an educated guess based on the evidence there is available. I currently have the Joe Z intake installed and plan on keeping it on the car based on two main factors.

1) Dyno shows a ~5hp/tq increase through out the rev band
2) After a 20 mile trip in warm weather, there was no appreciable difference in temps between the stock rubber and the Joe Z aluminum

4TehNguyen

iTrader: (1)

combine this when a K&N drop in filter comes out, probably get a few more horses out

caymandive

iTrader: (2)

We aren't going to find a single part that gives us a felt gain in power, but the total of the parts added really will add up in the end. Intake, exhaust, cams?, pulleys?, ECU flash? will all eventually be available for the car I think. Once they are all available and proven to perform, I'm sure that if you were to drive a stock IS350 you would then feel the difference in power. Just sitting back patiently here and waiting for parts to come out and to be sure I have a part that performs you better believe I'll be doing my own dyno tests. Also trying to hit the 1/4 when I can. I'm actually planning to go to the track this evening, but the weather isn't looking too promising, but I'm itching to go have some fun.

meteoro

Great discussion!!

I am pretty happy with my Joe Z intake. And to top it all off, having the only gun metal one is cool!

As far as performance, yeah, it may feel as it has a bit more power, but kinda hard to tell. What I do clearly feel is an improved throttle response. Plus at high revs, past 4.5K, it sounds sweet!

phatboyc

Anyone used a heat wrap of some sort around their Joe Z? Or perhaps some ceramic thermal paint? I would like to ad a thermal layer of some sort without being to noticeable.

p.s. The engine heat issue has already been discussed. I realize the temperature difference of the air inside the tube is minimal. But I'm thinking more of when idling and stop and go traffic.

al503

You can get thermal tape from most of the auto parts supply shops in town. It definitely detracts from the looks but it will help (to what degree is obviously debatable) with the temp especially in stop and go and gridlock situations.