spark plugs
03-08-07 | 03:36 PM
#17
Super Moderator
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 17,250
Likes: 169
From: Miami, Florida
Fact - Iridiums have been proven in thousands of race applications and high hp street cars to work well AND last.
Fact - Torquemasters have not been proven outside of a few people saying they work on their website, actually they don't even have that. They have their own "claims" from John Doe and his 1978 Ford Bronco (Literally).
If Torquemasters were so great, and they have been around since at least 2002, then everybody would be using them don't you think? When everyone is out to get the last bit of horsepower and there was performance left to be had just sitting there in the form of a sparkplug I think it would have been common knowledge within the last 5 years.
Here is a review of someone with an Rx-7. You can read the different reviews but it is odd that the Torquemaster actually started to fall apart (literally). Or you can check with Pettite racing where they had to replace a couple customers motors because they decided to test Torquemasters and the plug disintegrated leading to massive engine failure. Torquemaster denied it was their fault of course. If you read to the conclusion it mentions people are having great results with NGK iridiums.
There is a nice review here of how they work and also mentions the fact of inresed gap leading to possibly improving mpg but also leading to misfire which takes away any mpg gains and performance gains you might have seen.
http://celicatech.com/forums/showthr...305#post240305
Here is a guy from our forums who installed Torquemasters and they failed within 300mi damaging other components of his car in the process
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=237457
There is more to be found out there with some looking. I'm in no way trying to start a fued over sparkplugs but when you are spending over $100 on something that "might" work then people need to know what they are buying. The forums is a good place to filter out the garbage products from the proven ones. I hope no one has any hard feelings over our disagreement
Either way, in the end, would you trust your motor to possibly making a few more hp (giving the TM plugs the benefit of the doubt that they could even do that) for $100+ worth of sparkplugs? I know I wouldn't.
Fact - Torquemasters have not been proven outside of a few people saying they work on their website, actually they don't even have that. They have their own "claims" from John Doe and his 1978 Ford Bronco (Literally).
If Torquemasters were so great, and they have been around since at least 2002, then everybody would be using them don't you think? When everyone is out to get the last bit of horsepower and there was performance left to be had just sitting there in the form of a sparkplug I think it would have been common knowledge within the last 5 years.
Here is a review of someone with an Rx-7. You can read the different reviews but it is odd that the Torquemaster actually started to fall apart (literally). Or you can check with Pettite racing where they had to replace a couple customers motors because they decided to test Torquemasters and the plug disintegrated leading to massive engine failure. Torquemaster denied it was their fault of course. If you read to the conclusion it mentions people are having great results with NGK iridiums.
There is a nice review here of how they work and also mentions the fact of inresed gap leading to possibly improving mpg but also leading to misfire which takes away any mpg gains and performance gains you might have seen.
http://celicatech.com/forums/showthr...305#post240305
Here is a guy from our forums who installed Torquemasters and they failed within 300mi damaging other components of his car in the process
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=237457
There is more to be found out there with some looking. I'm in no way trying to start a fued over sparkplugs but when you are spending over $100 on something that "might" work then people need to know what they are buying. The forums is a good place to filter out the garbage products from the proven ones. I hope no one has any hard feelings over our disagreement
Either way, in the end, would you trust your motor to possibly making a few more hp (giving the TM plugs the benefit of the doubt that they could even do that) for $100+ worth of sparkplugs? I know I wouldn't.
I tend to think also that even though they work with my exhaust/air modifications (compared to stock) they may have done a better job of burning the crummy gas that I have up here than Denso Iridium plugs. However, given that most CL members are from U.S. (or Canada) I don't think this situation applies and sure enough using TQs may not be noticeable to most. Won't know until I get to sea level (where I haven't been physically or with my RX) in over 2 years.
Now that RX-7, those cars burn hot and they love to burn oil. I have a friend of mine with one and he is very careful (as our most RX-7 owners who do more than stock) about what kind of plugs (how cold) and I remember the issues he faced when he had the car up here at this elevation. Had to go through several plugs to find something that worked...and it was some Greddy plugs of some sort that really made the difference.
Last edited by Lexmex; 03-09-07 at 10:20 AM.
03-08-07 | 04:03 PM
#18
Moderator - Electronics Forum
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 3,985
Likes: 12
From: Illinois
Fact - Iridiums have been proven in thousands of race applications and high hp street cars to work well AND last.
***But how well do they actually burn the fuel? Iridium is a conductor, but not anywhere nearly as efficient.***
Fact - Torquemasters have not been proven outside of a few people saying they work on their website, actually they don't even have that. They have their own "claims" from John Doe and his 1978 Ford Bronco (Literally).
***They used to send out paper literature - lots of it. Worked quite well on an older SCCA RX7. The letter used to be on the website. Another interesting fact is that a few of the larger auto manufacturers have tried to buy and then kill the patent. Why would you want a plug that was good for over 100,000 miles (back then with POINTS ignition) when you could sell more plugs that go out at 15 to 20,000? Bottom line for the car parts guys - they could sell more of the crappy stuff. ***
If Torquemasters were so great, and they have been around since at least 2002, then everybody would be using them don't you think?
***Depends on if they're sponsored or not. If you get them for free, then why not use them? Plus you get this nice pretty decal on the side of your race car saying "IRIDIUM" or something to that fact.***
When everyone is out to get the last bit of horsepower and there was performance left to be had just sitting there in the form of a sparkplug I think it would have been common knowledge within the last 5 years.
***Once again the sponsorship/politics come into play. TM doesn't have enough time or the money to sponsor anything. Their plugs are literally hand made, not punched out by the hundreds on an assembly machine line.***
Here is a review of someone with an Rx-7. You can read the different reviews but it is odd that the Torquemaster actually started to fall apart (literally). Or you can check with Pettite racing where they had to replace a couple customers motors because they decided to test Torquemasters and the plug disintegrated leading to massive engine failure. Torquemaster denied it was their fault of course. If you read to the conclusion it mentions people are having great results with NGK iridiums.
***Do you have the link? I would like to take a look.***
There is a nice review here of how they work and also mentions the fact of inresed gap leading to possibly improving mpg but also leading to misfire which takes away any mpg gains and performance gains you might have seen.
http://celicatech.com/forums/showthr...305#post240305
Here is a guy from our forums who installed Torquemasters and they failed within 300mi damaging other components of his car in the process
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=237457
There is more to be found out there with some looking. I'm in no way trying to start a fued over sparkplugs but when you are spending over $100 on something that "might" work then people need to know what they are buying. The forums is a good place to filter out the garbage products from the proven ones. I hope no one has any hard feelings over our disagreement
Either way, in the end, would you trust your motor to possibly making a few more hp (giving the TM plugs the benefit of the doubt that they could even do that) for $100+ worth of sparkplugs? I know I wouldn't.
***But how well do they actually burn the fuel? Iridium is a conductor, but not anywhere nearly as efficient.***
Fact - Torquemasters have not been proven outside of a few people saying they work on their website, actually they don't even have that. They have their own "claims" from John Doe and his 1978 Ford Bronco (Literally).
***They used to send out paper literature - lots of it. Worked quite well on an older SCCA RX7. The letter used to be on the website. Another interesting fact is that a few of the larger auto manufacturers have tried to buy and then kill the patent. Why would you want a plug that was good for over 100,000 miles (back then with POINTS ignition) when you could sell more plugs that go out at 15 to 20,000? Bottom line for the car parts guys - they could sell more of the crappy stuff. ***
If Torquemasters were so great, and they have been around since at least 2002, then everybody would be using them don't you think?
***Depends on if they're sponsored or not. If you get them for free, then why not use them? Plus you get this nice pretty decal on the side of your race car saying "IRIDIUM" or something to that fact.***
When everyone is out to get the last bit of horsepower and there was performance left to be had just sitting there in the form of a sparkplug I think it would have been common knowledge within the last 5 years.
***Once again the sponsorship/politics come into play. TM doesn't have enough time or the money to sponsor anything. Their plugs are literally hand made, not punched out by the hundreds on an assembly machine line.***
Here is a review of someone with an Rx-7. You can read the different reviews but it is odd that the Torquemaster actually started to fall apart (literally). Or you can check with Pettite racing where they had to replace a couple customers motors because they decided to test Torquemasters and the plug disintegrated leading to massive engine failure. Torquemaster denied it was their fault of course. If you read to the conclusion it mentions people are having great results with NGK iridiums.
***Do you have the link? I would like to take a look.***
There is a nice review here of how they work and also mentions the fact of inresed gap leading to possibly improving mpg but also leading to misfire which takes away any mpg gains and performance gains you might have seen.
http://celicatech.com/forums/showthr...305#post240305
Here is a guy from our forums who installed Torquemasters and they failed within 300mi damaging other components of his car in the process
https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=237457
There is more to be found out there with some looking. I'm in no way trying to start a fued over sparkplugs but when you are spending over $100 on something that "might" work then people need to know what they are buying. The forums is a good place to filter out the garbage products from the proven ones. I hope no one has any hard feelings over our disagreement
Either way, in the end, would you trust your motor to possibly making a few more hp (giving the TM plugs the benefit of the doubt that they could even do that) for $100+ worth of sparkplugs? I know I wouldn't.
Personally though, I would really like to see a real life dyno/drag out for the iridiums vs the TM. It would be quite intersesting, don't you think?
Last edited by Percy; 03-08-07 at 04:09 PM.
03-08-07 | 04:33 PM
#19
Lexus Champion
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 2,079
Likes: 2
From: Texas
***I've trusted these plugs from day 1. Been using them ever since 1990. TM has been around since the late 60's and the patent was filed for their design much earlier. I was still on my first set of iridiums for my GS4, only about 20k miles on it. Then dropped in the TMs and never looked back. Had my second set of TM plugs after the 100k mark...and the car has 150k on there now. Just for grins and giggles, I did drop in a set of iridiums (fresh ones) at 80k...just to make sure that I wasn't imagining things. New iridums vs Old TM...the old TM still pulled harder and faster to the redline. So, in went another set of the TMs, just because there was some slight wear.
Personally though, I would really like to see a real life dyno/drag out for the iridiums vs the TM. It would be quite intersesting, don't you think?
Personally though, I would really like to see a real life dyno/drag out for the iridiums vs the TM. It would be quite intersesting, don't you think?
. Anyone? JPI
03-08-07 | 08:35 PM
#21
i just replaced my plugs which i believe to be OEMs with 95k [Denso Iridium] with NGK Iridiums. to my surprise, they cured a slight ping i had going. go figure. FYI i got my plugs from ebay seller autodinamics for $56 shipped in less than a week. thats 8 spark plugs btw.
03-10-07 | 02:08 PM
#23
maybe, but all of them looked the same. if you check this link, mine all looked like number 14 http://www.4secondsflat.com/plug_chart.html
i did re-gap them from 0.050 to 0.040. is that the proper spark plug gap for GS400?
i did re-gap them from 0.050 to 0.040. is that the proper spark plug gap for GS400?
03-10-07 | 02:11 PM
#24
Guess Iridiums at 95k werent so bad after all 
lol. Of course they could use to be changed but we are talking basically 100k. If you had a Gm they would have outlasted your car, lol... (Just kidding )
lol. Of course they could use to be changed but we are talking basically 100k. If you had a Gm they would have outlasted your car, lol... (Just kidding )
03-13-07 | 05:18 PM
#26
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 6,947
Likes: 4
From: Florida
my GS430 has 38k. I wonder if it'd run better with fresh Iridiums. As far as Iridiums, ND Denso or NGK? ND is oem, right?
my svc. manual for an 05 GS430 shows- Denso SK20R11- NGK IFR6A11 WITH "STANDARD GAP 1.0-1.1(.O934-.043 IN.)MM AND MAX GAP 1.3MM(.051)"
Denso's website shows 2 plugs for GS430, the one listed above and a IK20????? What's the difference? IK20 is more expensive.
http://www.densoproducts.com/results...ctCategoryID=1
also, are you guys using anti seize on the threads?
my svc. manual for an 05 GS430 shows- Denso SK20R11- NGK IFR6A11 WITH "STANDARD GAP 1.0-1.1(.O934-.043 IN.)MM AND MAX GAP 1.3MM(.051)"
Denso's website shows 2 plugs for GS430, the one listed above and a IK20????? What's the difference? IK20 is more expensive.
http://www.densoproducts.com/results...ctCategoryID=1
also, are you guys using anti seize on the threads?
Last edited by chuckb; 03-13-07 at 05:24 PM.
03-13-07 | 05:21 PM
#27
my GS430 has 38k. I wonder if it'd run better with fresh Iridiums. As far as Iridiums, ND Denso or NGK? ND is oem, right?
my svc. manual for an 05 GS430 shows- Denso SK20R11- NGK IFR6A11 WITH "STANDARD GAP 1.0-1.1(.O934-.043 IN.)MM AND MAX GAP 1.3MM(.051)"
also, are you guys using anti seize on the threads?
my svc. manual for an 05 GS430 shows- Denso SK20R11- NGK IFR6A11 WITH "STANDARD GAP 1.0-1.1(.O934-.043 IN.)MM AND MAX GAP 1.3MM(.051)"
also, are you guys using anti seize on the threads?
Yes, use a light layer of antisieze on the threads when you put them in. Be careful not to get it on the electrode.
03-13-07 | 06:00 PM
#28
Lexus Fanatic
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 6,947
Likes: 4
From: Florida
^ thanks. you quoted while I was editing...
RE: Densos-
the IK20 is "u-groove" and the SK20R11 is not???
SK20R11 supposedly last longer. I wonder does the really IK20 perform better??
and it looks like that NGK part # is discontinued....
I've always had great luck with NGKs too, but I'm leaning towards Denso this time.
RE: Densos-
the IK20 is "u-groove" and the SK20R11 is not???
SK20R11 supposedly last longer. I wonder does the really IK20 perform better??
and it looks like that NGK part # is discontinued....
I've always had great luck with NGKs too, but I'm leaning towards Denso this time.