Which Intake has the most HP gain?
07-12-08, 10:53 PM
#16
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Dynoing an intake doesn't mean anything. When was the last time you drove with your hood up?
Dynos are supposed to relate to real world - real world means your car goes from A to B faster. Unfortunately, dynos do not relate to getting from A to B faster, they relate to spinning up a roller faster while stationary.
Finally, comparing your dyno to a "typical dyno" is a complete waste of time. You need to know what YOUR car did before and after to know anything.
Dynos are supposed to relate to real world - real world means your car goes from A to B faster. Unfortunately, dynos do not relate to getting from A to B faster, they relate to spinning up a roller faster while stationary.
Finally, comparing your dyno to a "typical dyno" is a complete waste of time. You need to know what YOUR car did before and after to know anything.
07-13-08, 05:49 PM
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I LOL at this. TRD has a multi-million dollar budget to design performance products for the IS. They decide to screw it and copy the design of (from what I understand) a single person who sells his intake through one dealership on CL (No offense JoeZ). Plus, intakes have a general design. I am sure JoeZ used the stock Lexus IS intake as a base and made improvements off of that.
07-13-08, 11:55 PM
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from what i saw in comparison of joe z's pipe and the stock pipe, it retains a similar sized pipe. that being said, if i remember correctly, when airflow goes into the stock pipe initially, the pipe is smooth but when it curves, there are ridges built in to allow flexibility. since the ridges go in and out, it causes air turbulence when the airflow touches the ridges. thus, turbulent air would create an inconsistent airflow into the engine, which is inefficent. it may or may not cause peaks with engine power as the flow of air may be low for a millisecond and then high for another millisecond.
we can also apply Bernoulli's principle to this. Turbulence aside, theoretically, the airflow will also be slow going into the engine. Each time the ridges go inward, it creates a smaller path for the air. With the smaller path and a flow of air, the pressure of the air is higher between the inward ridges. With the law, higher pressure air flows slower and vice versa. Thus not only do the ridges create turbulence, but the air going in slows down between inward ridges and speeds up in the outward ridges. This creates more inconsistency.
This is where joe's pipe shines. Since the engine cannot use as much air as the intake pipe supplies, joe's pipe retains a similar pipe diameter as to the stock pipe's outward ridges. With a smooth design, the airflow passing through will always be passing through at the same rate as 1) there's no significant turbulence except for the mild bend and 2) the consistent diameter maintains a consistent air pressure, thus the air flows at a constant rate according to bernoulli's law. With this design, joe's pipe is pumping in slightly more air (though not by too much) as the ridges are not there to slow down flow. Thus at peak power, the slightly higher air rate will create that slightly higher peak power. also, with the smooth design, the power created will have a smoother power and torque line. SO that also means the average power through the powerband will be slightly higher with the higher rate.
so by theory, joe's pipe is the optimum design in relation to where the airbox's air exits and at the other engine of the pipe where it enters the engine. i believe lexus engineers may not have necessarily copied joe's design but have come to same conclusion as the only other way to have a more effective intake system is to have a larger hole for the airbox's air to exit as well as where the engine takes in the air. if both those holes are larger, then more air can pass through at a higher rate. Also, the intake pipe would have to match the two hole's diamater (or at least the measurement of area)
So looking at other intake systems, joe's and the f-sport are probably the best for an increase in power albeit very little. open element types of intakes take fault in that the open element may end up sucking in hotter air, which the molecules will be further apart, thus less air is going in with the same volume.
now i know this is quite technical and the theory applies in a static world with little to no variables. minute differences in every engine and the real world will create differences. so if you must have the most power gain with an intake, use joe-z's. if you want sound, similar power to joe's as well as an OE number, get the f-sport.
and lastly, joe, did you think about the design of your pipe like i did? or did you use other theorems?
we can also apply Bernoulli's principle to this. Turbulence aside, theoretically, the airflow will also be slow going into the engine. Each time the ridges go inward, it creates a smaller path for the air. With the smaller path and a flow of air, the pressure of the air is higher between the inward ridges. With the law, higher pressure air flows slower and vice versa. Thus not only do the ridges create turbulence, but the air going in slows down between inward ridges and speeds up in the outward ridges. This creates more inconsistency.
This is where joe's pipe shines. Since the engine cannot use as much air as the intake pipe supplies, joe's pipe retains a similar pipe diameter as to the stock pipe's outward ridges. With a smooth design, the airflow passing through will always be passing through at the same rate as 1) there's no significant turbulence except for the mild bend and 2) the consistent diameter maintains a consistent air pressure, thus the air flows at a constant rate according to bernoulli's law. With this design, joe's pipe is pumping in slightly more air (though not by too much) as the ridges are not there to slow down flow. Thus at peak power, the slightly higher air rate will create that slightly higher peak power. also, with the smooth design, the power created will have a smoother power and torque line. SO that also means the average power through the powerband will be slightly higher with the higher rate.
so by theory, joe's pipe is the optimum design in relation to where the airbox's air exits and at the other engine of the pipe where it enters the engine. i believe lexus engineers may not have necessarily copied joe's design but have come to same conclusion as the only other way to have a more effective intake system is to have a larger hole for the airbox's air to exit as well as where the engine takes in the air. if both those holes are larger, then more air can pass through at a higher rate. Also, the intake pipe would have to match the two hole's diamater (or at least the measurement of area)
So looking at other intake systems, joe's and the f-sport are probably the best for an increase in power albeit very little. open element types of intakes take fault in that the open element may end up sucking in hotter air, which the molecules will be further apart, thus less air is going in with the same volume.
now i know this is quite technical and the theory applies in a static world with little to no variables. minute differences in every engine and the real world will create differences. so if you must have the most power gain with an intake, use joe-z's. if you want sound, similar power to joe's as well as an OE number, get the f-sport.
and lastly, joe, did you think about the design of your pipe like i did? or did you use other theorems?
07-14-08, 08:26 AM
#20
I LOL at this. TRD has a multi-million dollar budget to design performance products for the IS. They decide to screw it and copy the design of (from what I understand) a single person who sells his intake through one dealership on CL (No offense JoeZ). Plus, intakes have a general design. I am sure JoeZ used the stock Lexus IS intake as a base and made improvements off of that.
Or maybe you should've read the -later- remark I made on the topic before laughing about it?
"Lexus engineers eventually reached the same conclusions about what works best and thus the F-sport looks like the Joe Z, with logos on it, the filter included, and a noisier (but no different performing) bottom airbox replacement because people paying $300-400 for an intake expect a lot of noise apparently."
So, as I said, the F-sport _is_ basically a copy of the Joe Z.
That's not to say they literally went out, bought a Joe Z pipe, and slapped their name on it.
It means that after their millions in research they reached the same conclusion Joe Z did, and ended up offering a product, after Joe Z did, that looks and works exactly the same except for the logo, including an air filter, and adding a lower-box that adds nothing but more noise.
To be fair, they did also add an EO number, which means a lot if you're stuck in California, but not much otherwise.
07-14-08, 11:38 PM
#21
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from what i saw in comparison of joe z's pipe and the stock pipe, it retains a similar sized pipe. that being said, if i remember correctly, when airflow goes into the stock pipe initially, the pipe is smooth but when it curves, there are ridges built in to allow flexibility. since the ridges go in and out, it causes air turbulence when the airflow touches the ridges. thus, turbulent air would create an inconsistent airflow into the engine, which is inefficent. it may or may not cause peaks with engine power as the flow of air may be low for a millisecond and then high for another millisecond.
we can also apply Bernoulli's principle to this. Turbulence aside, theoretically, the airflow will also be slow going into the engine. Each time the ridges go inward, it creates a smaller path for the air. With the smaller path and a flow of air, the pressure of the air is higher between the inward ridges. With the law, higher pressure air flows slower and vice versa. Thus not only do the ridges create turbulence, but the air going in slows down between inward ridges and speeds up in the outward ridges. This creates more inconsistency.
This is where joe's pipe shines. Since the engine cannot use as much air as the intake pipe supplies, joe's pipe retains a similar pipe diameter as to the stock pipe's outward ridges. With a smooth design, the airflow passing through will always be passing through at the same rate as 1) there's no significant turbulence except for the mild bend and 2) the consistent diameter maintains a consistent air pressure, thus the air flows at a constant rate according to bernoulli's law. With this design, joe's pipe is pumping in slightly more air (though not by too much) as the ridges are not there to slow down flow. Thus at peak power, the slightly higher air rate will create that slightly higher peak power. also, with the smooth design, the power created will have a smoother power and torque line. SO that also means the average power through the powerband will be slightly higher with the higher rate.
so by theory, joe's pipe is the optimum design in relation to where the airbox's air exits and at the other engine of the pipe where it enters the engine. i believe lexus engineers may not have necessarily copied joe's design but have come to same conclusion as the only other way to have a more effective intake system is to have a larger hole for the airbox's air to exit as well as where the engine takes in the air. if both those holes are larger, then more air can pass through at a higher rate. Also, the intake pipe would have to match the two hole's diamater (or at least the measurement of area)
So looking at other intake systems, joe's and the f-sport are probably the best for an increase in power albeit very little. open element types of intakes take fault in that the open element may end up sucking in hotter air, which the molecules will be further apart, thus less air is going in with the same volume.
now i know this is quite technical and the theory applies in a static world with little to no variables. minute differences in every engine and the real world will create differences. so if you must have the most power gain with an intake, use joe-z's. if you want sound, similar power to joe's as well as an OE number, get the f-sport.
and lastly, joe, did you think about the design of your pipe like i did? or did you use other theorems?
we can also apply Bernoulli's principle to this. Turbulence aside, theoretically, the airflow will also be slow going into the engine. Each time the ridges go inward, it creates a smaller path for the air. With the smaller path and a flow of air, the pressure of the air is higher between the inward ridges. With the law, higher pressure air flows slower and vice versa. Thus not only do the ridges create turbulence, but the air going in slows down between inward ridges and speeds up in the outward ridges. This creates more inconsistency.
This is where joe's pipe shines. Since the engine cannot use as much air as the intake pipe supplies, joe's pipe retains a similar pipe diameter as to the stock pipe's outward ridges. With a smooth design, the airflow passing through will always be passing through at the same rate as 1) there's no significant turbulence except for the mild bend and 2) the consistent diameter maintains a consistent air pressure, thus the air flows at a constant rate according to bernoulli's law. With this design, joe's pipe is pumping in slightly more air (though not by too much) as the ridges are not there to slow down flow. Thus at peak power, the slightly higher air rate will create that slightly higher peak power. also, with the smooth design, the power created will have a smoother power and torque line. SO that also means the average power through the powerband will be slightly higher with the higher rate.
so by theory, joe's pipe is the optimum design in relation to where the airbox's air exits and at the other engine of the pipe where it enters the engine. i believe lexus engineers may not have necessarily copied joe's design but have come to same conclusion as the only other way to have a more effective intake system is to have a larger hole for the airbox's air to exit as well as where the engine takes in the air. if both those holes are larger, then more air can pass through at a higher rate. Also, the intake pipe would have to match the two hole's diamater (or at least the measurement of area)
So looking at other intake systems, joe's and the f-sport are probably the best for an increase in power albeit very little. open element types of intakes take fault in that the open element may end up sucking in hotter air, which the molecules will be further apart, thus less air is going in with the same volume.
now i know this is quite technical and the theory applies in a static world with little to no variables. minute differences in every engine and the real world will create differences. so if you must have the most power gain with an intake, use joe-z's. if you want sound, similar power to joe's as well as an OE number, get the f-sport.
and lastly, joe, did you think about the design of your pipe like i did? or did you use other theorems?
If you want more flow through this engine, you're going to have to pull the heads and clean them up. It's the ports and valves themselves that are the biggest restriction to additional power in the 2GR and 4GR engines.
Last edited by lobuxracer; 07-14-08 at 11:42 PM.
07-14-08, 11:39 PM
#22
Well put Kurtz 
So what this comes down to is your preference, both intakes give you the performance gain, one is quieter more low profile and costs less, while the other one gives your car a louder groan while at WOT, also it costs more, there are dealerships that sell the intake rather cheaper, Sewell, Westminster to name some. Go for what makes you happy
As for my personal choice I went with the F-Sport intake, there are several reasons but I'll name the more obvious one, I have an IS250, it's not the fastest car in the track, but, the sound I get from my intake makes up for the speed my car lacks
My respects to Joe Z
So what this comes down to is your preference, both intakes give you the performance gain, one is quieter more low profile and costs less, while the other one gives your car a louder groan while at WOT, also it costs more, there are dealerships that sell the intake rather cheaper, Sewell, Westminster to name some. Go for what makes you happy
As for my personal choice I went with the F-Sport intake, there are several reasons but I'll name the more obvious one, I have an IS250, it's not the fastest car in the track, but, the sound I get from my intake makes up for the speed my car lacks
My respects to Joe Z
07-15-08, 10:09 PM
#23
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Let me preface this by saying that I am sure the Joe Z intake is great. I have never put one on my car, but from the members on here it seems to get the job done. IMO, I don't have an interest in putting any intake in my car as it won't provide any significant power gains and I don't like the sound.
You are insinuating that TRD copied the intake design of JoeZ. I haven't seen a comparison on here, so I am sure there are plenty of differences in they way they are manufactured, the sleeves, the metal composition, power gains etc.... From what I understand there are not many routes in making an intake for this car. The design JoeZ uses is fairly common in the aftermarket world and you make it sound like Joe Z reinvented the wheel with his intake.
You are insinuating that TRD copied the intake design of JoeZ. I haven't seen a comparison on here, so I am sure there are plenty of differences in they way they are manufactured, the sleeves, the metal composition, power gains etc.... From what I understand there are not many routes in making an intake for this car. The design JoeZ uses is fairly common in the aftermarket world and you make it sound like Joe Z reinvented the wheel with his intake.
07-15-08, 10:53 PM
#24
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^^ LoL....
I encourage you to look up just a few pics on both...
My design is NOT common at all. It is very different from all the rest... Well except the F-Sport pipe that is..
********************************************************
Needless to say I am very happy that Lexus / F-Sport did not create another Open Element Air Intake system..
For the record I have been selling my intake design for the IS300 since 2002 and the ISx50 since 2006...
Also, Lexus and/or TRD have access to these message boards and I am sure are quite aware of what members are buying or wanting...
Just look at the entire F-Sport line up... Intake, Springs, Shocks, Sways, Exhaust, Wheels, etc, etc.....
Trust me when I tell you they are VERY AWARE of what potential members are buying or wanting for their Lexus ISx50
Thank You
Joe Z
P.S. - Very well put Kurtz.... very well put!!!!
I encourage you to look up just a few pics on both...
My design is NOT common at all. It is very different from all the rest... Well except the F-Sport pipe that is..
********************************************************
Needless to say I am very happy that Lexus / F-Sport did not create another Open Element Air Intake system..
For the record I have been selling my intake design for the IS300 since 2002 and the ISx50 since 2006...
Also, Lexus and/or TRD have access to these message boards and I am sure are quite aware of what members are buying or wanting...
Just look at the entire F-Sport line up... Intake, Springs, Shocks, Sways, Exhaust, Wheels, etc, etc.....
Trust me when I tell you they are VERY AWARE of what potential members are buying or wanting for their Lexus ISx50
Thank You
Joe Z
P.S. - Very well put Kurtz.... very well put!!!!
07-16-08, 05:39 AM
#25
Care to explain in DETAIL how yours is so different from the ones who MFG and not outsoure like you? All these pipes are the same! Been through each and every MFG "the ones who actually MFG themselves". They all do NOTHING but sound & look cool if you are at a car show and have your hood popped
Others have followed this concept in the past where they "ONLY" replace the tube and not the airfilter box. Interesting about 8 years or so ago my NSX had the same "design"
They must have copied you and your theory! Very well said buy lobuxracer
Someone that is HONEST and not biased to "say" what others want to hearlol....
More brownie points for you Kurtz...I think that more sponsorships may be on the way for you
07-16-08, 06:47 AM
#26
For the record, I don't own a single Joe Z part. My car is bone stock. I just recognize quality and value.
I generally don't buy after market parts for my car unless they offer a significant improvement for the cost.
My first mod will be the F sport sway bars. I doubt I'll be doing much else anytime soon because almost nothing else is worth doing on this car to my way of thinking.
I think Joe Z makes an -outstanding- quality exhaust, with a great design. Comparing it to the other systems that cost similar amounts it's certainly a great purchase, but that's not my basis for comparison. I don't think 8-10 hp is worth $1500 so it's not something I'm ever going to buy.
I have no interest whatsoever in making my car louder, otherwise the cost might be easier to justify as the system also sounds great.
I have no interest in bodykits or anything else cosmetic except, possibly, wheels. Even then I'd be doing it both for a nice looking wheel -and- to lose rotating mass. My problem there is I really like 5-spoke wheels and have yet to see pics of somebody with a 2IS with nice clean 5-spoke wheel that doesn't have those, I dunno what they are called, "bolts" I guess all around the rim and I hate those bolts that seem to be the style on rims now.
As for an intake, I haven't bought one at all because none of them do much. If I was going to buy one, it'd be the Joe Z, because even though you're looking at 5 hp tops from ANY intake, Joes is of excellent quality, and the lowest cost, while keeping the colder design of the stock box. It's only 5 hp, but for $110 that's not bad. Since I plan to stop taking my car to Lexus after 10k (ie once I have to pay for the service) I'll likely seriously consider putting his pipe on at that time.
The only advantages the F-sport offer over this are:
A carb number, which doesn't matter since I'm not in CA.
More noise. Which is of no appeal to me. And if it was I'd just dremmel a second hole in the box and get the same result while still saving about $200.
My previous car made over 500 hp, naturally aspirated. I picked out (and installed most of) the mods myself after a lot of thought and research, and put nothing on the car that wasn't excellent bang/buck, and usually the best you could get. Best isn't always the most expensive.
I understand some folks want their cars a lot louder and flashier, and they're welcome to make them that way. Just isn't my thing.
I generally don't buy after market parts for my car unless they offer a significant improvement for the cost.
My first mod will be the F sport sway bars. I doubt I'll be doing much else anytime soon because almost nothing else is worth doing on this car to my way of thinking.
I think Joe Z makes an -outstanding- quality exhaust, with a great design. Comparing it to the other systems that cost similar amounts it's certainly a great purchase, but that's not my basis for comparison. I don't think 8-10 hp is worth $1500 so it's not something I'm ever going to buy.
I have no interest whatsoever in making my car louder, otherwise the cost might be easier to justify as the system also sounds great.
I have no interest in bodykits or anything else cosmetic except, possibly, wheels. Even then I'd be doing it both for a nice looking wheel -and- to lose rotating mass. My problem there is I really like 5-spoke wheels and have yet to see pics of somebody with a 2IS with nice clean 5-spoke wheel that doesn't have those, I dunno what they are called, "bolts" I guess all around the rim and I hate those bolts that seem to be the style on rims now.
As for an intake, I haven't bought one at all because none of them do much. If I was going to buy one, it'd be the Joe Z, because even though you're looking at 5 hp tops from ANY intake, Joes is of excellent quality, and the lowest cost, while keeping the colder design of the stock box. It's only 5 hp, but for $110 that's not bad. Since I plan to stop taking my car to Lexus after 10k (ie once I have to pay for the service) I'll likely seriously consider putting his pipe on at that time.
The only advantages the F-sport offer over this are:
A carb number, which doesn't matter since I'm not in CA.
More noise. Which is of no appeal to me. And if it was I'd just dremmel a second hole in the box and get the same result while still saving about $200.
My previous car made over 500 hp, naturally aspirated. I picked out (and installed most of) the mods myself after a lot of thought and research, and put nothing on the car that wasn't excellent bang/buck, and usually the best you could get. Best isn't always the most expensive.
I understand some folks want their cars a lot louder and flashier, and they're welcome to make them that way. Just isn't my thing.
07-16-08, 07:48 AM
#27
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. As noted below, it is a sacrilege to do this is in the R&D world because of the liability.The fact that your intake is built in the USA and the F-Sport is built in Japan is a major difference.
If you say your intake is the same. It could be. The intake pipe runs form point A to point B. There is only 1 direct route from A to B and obviously most intakes will have the same shape. However, you and Kurtsie are constantly ranting that they are EXACTLY the same without any facts. I don't like hearing that and the CL members (your customers) deserve to see proof. Metal analysis, dyno runs of both on the same car, shape analysis (angles), thickness of the metals...etc. Obviously this should be done by a third party to avoid any bias.
P.S. If your design is patented and TRD copied it, why are you not suing? I know I would be pissed if I came up with a "revolutionary" design, just to have a large corporation copy it and distribute it to the masses
What? You don't even own one? How can you constantly rant that they are exactly the same??? You haven't even seen one in person. You have no experience with either Joe Z or F-Sport intake.
07-16-08, 08:16 AM
#28
Can we still agree with comments on this board? I asked if we were still allowed the laugh the other day.
I agree with above post(vikh). What is so revolutionary about any of the above designs? They are designs that have been around for a while now. There is nothing ground breaking about using an xpipe and resonators, and cats.
I agree that JoeZ's intake/ exhaust looks very pretty. The welds are on par with some of the japanese manufactures; however, is it worth the extra $$$$ for welds that no one will ever see? Yes/No I guess it depends on if you drive around on a lift or have mirrors under your car or drive around with your hood open
Kurtz, that is great you think Joez's exhaust is a great buy. I am glad you have a positive opintion (which seem to be the only opinions allowed on this forum), however, I totally disagree. I don't think it's great purchase considering you can get something made by a major manufacture or build your own for a lot less $$$$. Again this is a just a counter view. and again joez 's exhaust loooks very pretty. Is it worth that price for 8-10hp, let your pocketbook decide?
These comments are also for the joez intake. same applies. there is nothing ground breaking about the design.
I agree with above post(vikh). What is so revolutionary about any of the above designs? They are designs that have been around for a while now. There is nothing ground breaking about using an xpipe and resonators, and cats.
I agree that JoeZ's intake/ exhaust looks very pretty. The welds are on par with some of the japanese manufactures; however, is it worth the extra $$$$ for welds that no one will ever see? Yes/No I guess it depends on if you drive around on a lift or have mirrors under your car or drive around with your hood open
Kurtz, that is great you think Joez's exhaust is a great buy. I am glad you have a positive opintion (which seem to be the only opinions allowed on this forum), however, I totally disagree. I don't think it's great purchase considering you can get something made by a major manufacture or build your own for a lot less $$$$. Again this is a just a counter view. and again joez 's exhaust loooks very pretty. Is it worth that price for 8-10hp, let your pocketbook decide?
These comments are also for the joez intake. same applies. there is nothing ground breaking about the design.
Last edited by combfilter; 07-16-08 at 08:23 AM.
07-16-08, 08:31 AM
#29
Combfilter,
Except that's exactly the opposite of what I said.
What I said was that while it's a high quality exhaust system I do -not- think that 8-10 hp is worth $1500 no matter who makes it.
In other words, exactly what you later said.
The intake on the other hand, 5 hp for $110 isn't that bad.
Vikh,
Why in the world would you assume I haven't -seen- either product despite the fact I don't own the product?
I don't own a G35 either, but can certainly comment, fairly knowledgeably, about them, to use one example.
I don't own a magnetic fuel minder either and can tell you pretty reliably why you shouldn't buy one of those too.
Except that's exactly the opposite of what I said.
What I said was that while it's a high quality exhaust system I do -not- think that 8-10 hp is worth $1500 no matter who makes it.
In other words, exactly what you later said.
The intake on the other hand, 5 hp for $110 isn't that bad.
Vikh,
Why in the world would you assume I haven't -seen- either product despite the fact I don't own the product?
I don't own a G35 either, but can certainly comment, fairly knowledgeably, about them, to use one example.
I don't own a magnetic fuel minder either and can tell you pretty reliably why you shouldn't buy one of those too.
Last edited by Kurtz; 07-16-08 at 08:38 AM.
07-16-08, 11:56 AM
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from what i saw in comparison of joe z's pipe and the stock pipe, it retains a similar sized pipe. that being said, if i remember correctly, when airflow goes into the stock pipe initially, the pipe is smooth but when it curves, there are ridges built in to allow flexibility. since the ridges go in and out, it causes air turbulence when the airflow touches the ridges. thus, turbulent air would create an inconsistent airflow into the engine, which is inefficent. it may or may not cause peaks with engine power as the flow of air may be low for a millisecond and then high for another millisecond.
we can also apply Bernoulli's principle to this. Turbulence aside, theoretically, the airflow will also be slow going into the engine. Each time the ridges go inward, it creates a smaller path for the air. With the smaller path and a flow of air, the pressure of the air is higher between the inward ridges. With the law, higher pressure air flows slower and vice versa. Thus not only do the ridges create turbulence, but the air going in slows down between inward ridges and speeds up in the outward ridges. This creates more inconsistency.
This is where joe's pipe shines. Since the engine cannot use as much air as the intake pipe supplies, joe's pipe retains a similar pipe diameter as to the stock pipe's outward ridges. With a smooth design, the airflow passing through will always be passing through at the same rate as 1) there's no significant turbulence except for the mild bend and 2) the consistent diameter maintains a consistent air pressure, thus the air flows at a constant rate according to bernoulli's law. With this design, joe's pipe is pumping in slightly more air (though not by too much) as the ridges are not there to slow down flow. Thus at peak power, the slightly higher air rate will create that slightly higher peak power. also, with the smooth design, the power created will have a smoother power and torque line. SO that also means the average power through the powerband will be slightly higher with the higher rate.
so by theory, joe's pipe is the optimum design in relation to where the airbox's air exits and at the other engine of the pipe where it enters the engine. i believe lexus engineers may not have necessarily copied joe's design but have come to same conclusion as the only other way to have a more effective intake system is to have a larger hole for the airbox's air to exit as well as where the engine takes in the air. if both those holes are larger, then more air can pass through at a higher rate. Also, the intake pipe would have to match the two hole's diamater (or at least the measurement of area)
So looking at other intake systems, joe's and the f-sport are probably the best for an increase in power albeit very little. open element types of intakes take fault in that the open element may end up sucking in hotter air, which the molecules will be further apart, thus less air is going in with the same volume.
now i know this is quite technical and the theory applies in a static world with little to no variables. minute differences in every engine and the real world will create differences. so if you must have the most power gain with an intake, use joe-z's. if you want sound, similar power to joe's as well as an OE number, get the f-sport.
and lastly, joe, did you think about the design of your pipe like i did? or did you use other theorems?
we can also apply Bernoulli's principle to this. Turbulence aside, theoretically, the airflow will also be slow going into the engine. Each time the ridges go inward, it creates a smaller path for the air. With the smaller path and a flow of air, the pressure of the air is higher between the inward ridges. With the law, higher pressure air flows slower and vice versa. Thus not only do the ridges create turbulence, but the air going in slows down between inward ridges and speeds up in the outward ridges. This creates more inconsistency.
This is where joe's pipe shines. Since the engine cannot use as much air as the intake pipe supplies, joe's pipe retains a similar pipe diameter as to the stock pipe's outward ridges. With a smooth design, the airflow passing through will always be passing through at the same rate as 1) there's no significant turbulence except for the mild bend and 2) the consistent diameter maintains a consistent air pressure, thus the air flows at a constant rate according to bernoulli's law. With this design, joe's pipe is pumping in slightly more air (though not by too much) as the ridges are not there to slow down flow. Thus at peak power, the slightly higher air rate will create that slightly higher peak power. also, with the smooth design, the power created will have a smoother power and torque line. SO that also means the average power through the powerband will be slightly higher with the higher rate.
so by theory, joe's pipe is the optimum design in relation to where the airbox's air exits and at the other engine of the pipe where it enters the engine. i believe lexus engineers may not have necessarily copied joe's design but have come to same conclusion as the only other way to have a more effective intake system is to have a larger hole for the airbox's air to exit as well as where the engine takes in the air. if both those holes are larger, then more air can pass through at a higher rate. Also, the intake pipe would have to match the two hole's diamater (or at least the measurement of area)
So looking at other intake systems, joe's and the f-sport are probably the best for an increase in power albeit very little. open element types of intakes take fault in that the open element may end up sucking in hotter air, which the molecules will be further apart, thus less air is going in with the same volume.
now i know this is quite technical and the theory applies in a static world with little to no variables. minute differences in every engine and the real world will create differences. so if you must have the most power gain with an intake, use joe-z's. if you want sound, similar power to joe's as well as an OE number, get the f-sport.
and lastly, joe, did you think about the design of your pipe like i did? or did you use other theorems?
The ridges would not have the effect you described, however they can result in turbulent rather than laminar flow, which is another discussion of fluid dynamics that I won't get in to.