Anthracite SC

We had this discussion a LONG time ago, and I can't find it in the archives, and since it's basically a new generation of members here, I thought it would be cool to start a new discussion about it.

Turbocharging vs Supercharging?

what's better?

I've heard conflicting points on both sides.
Some people say supercharging is better for low end and turbocharging is better for top end.

That's a very basic statement.

Can any more experienced owners or operators of supercharged or turbocharged cars come into this discussion and help me understand the pros and cons of each again?

thanks.

jpmotdyn

Pros of turbo : Adjustable boost control, Very good top end power and can be good mid power depending on what size turbo is used.

Cons of turbo : turbo lag (takes a little time for turbo to spool up and produce power), have to run oil lines into turbo

pros of supercharging : pretty much instant power since belt is always turning the supercharger pulley.

Cons : One pulley size = one boost pressure level = non adjustable.

Anthracite, I hope this helps for you.

Anthracite SC

Thanks for the pros and cons but which method is actually better?
I'd like to hear people's opinions on that.

BriGuyMax

I would say turbo is better....especially on a car that's not forced induction to begin with.

Turbos aren't parasitic like S/Cers...and therefore for a given boost level they produce more power.

For example, the reason that turbo cars from the factory tend to have "lag" is becuase they run a lower compression ratio that N/A cars, so when not "in boost" they will feel REALLY doggy...if you stick a turbo on an N/A car and don't lower compression (you don't have to lower compression unless you are going to run really high boost levels) you won't have any "lag" at all...out of boost the car will just feel like it would normally aspirated...but as soon and boost hits...it will PULL HARD!

For these reasons, I like turbos better.

Anthracite SC

So a supercharger will help you better from 0-60 but will lose to a turbo car to the 1/4 mile..lb for lb?

LexCiting

Use a turbo on 4 and 6 cylinder cars. Use a S/C on a V8. A V8 will not have a problem with a S/C pulley attached to it. On a 4 or 6 cylinder car that could be a problem. IMHO

mcnelson

I have driven both alot (most were 4 cylinders, Honda, Acura), and I would have to go all the way with a turbo over the supercharger. I think it is the best way to go to get maximum power and speed. The turbo is AMAZING on the freeway! :eek:

wwest

Both are compromises.

The old saw about the turbo boost being "free" simply doesn't hold water. If you want to PUMP a specific volume of air up to a certain pressure level that will take a finite level of energy, WORK!

Most turbos will not come on-line until the exhaust gas volume/pressure is sufficient, enough "waste" HP, to do the work of compressing the incoming airflow. And on the high end many, if not most, turbos have a pressure bypass so as not to overboost the engine, more "wasted" energy.

The main problem with SCs lies in the very same area. SCs can be "geared" to provide sufficient boost pressure even at idle, but unless it has a clutch that pressure must be bypassed after doing the work of pumping it, not very efficient.

Secondarily if the SC is so geared then by the time the engine speed is mid-range and beyond tremendous amounts of pressurized airflow is being bypassed, DUMPED!

The best of ALL worlds would be a variable speed constant dispalcement SC driven by a hydraulic servo motor with the hydraulic pressure/flow supplied by the power steering pump and metered by an electronic servo valve so the SC rotation rate always exactly matches the engine's need for pressurized airflow throughout its RPM range.

One of the diesel engine manufacturers has now done exactly that.

Since there is no way a turbo can be brought on-line quickly at the low end an SC is obviously the best solution if its output can be somehow modulated to match the engine's airflow needs as dictated by the position of your throttle foot, of course.

wwest

Oh, almost forgot.

Guess what your power steering pump is doing when you're driving straight ahead at 60 MPH?

Pumping the power steering, hydraulic, fluid up to 3000 PSI just so it can be immediately by-passed right back into the sump/reservoir.

Power steering pumps much have enough low speed pumping capacity to provide 3000 PSi of volume even at idle when you're manuvering into a parking space. Can you imagine how much energy is being bypassed, wasted, at 60 MPH, 3500 RPM?

BriGuyMax

No one ever said engines were efficient in stock trim. Ok...yes a turbo DOES take a SMALL amount of power away from the engine in order to operate it....but NOWHERE near what a S/Cer robs the engine of. For example, I am very familiar with the nissan maxima since I own and modify one. As of VERY recently a turbo kit has become available for the maxima. For a long time the only forced induction option was a Stillen Supercharger kit. Well a few guys have dynoed cars with similar boost levels (both intercooled) with the S/Cer and the turbo. Running a 10psi the S/Ced maxima put out 311fwhp while the turbo maxima running at 9 psi put out 352fwhp...and A LOT more TORQUE....now if that's not a significant difference....I don't know what is. Both cars were dyno tuned...and had stock internals, and the same exhaust set-up

ok..so it's true that a S/Cer that could be run like you said would be the most efficient...but the fact is...for performance cars it DOESN'T EXSIST!

I'll still stick with a turbo....

BriGuyMax

please explain your reasoning here....

CamRen

Turbo's Pros : takes less input gives more Output, smaller the SC so twin turbo or quad turbo is very possible euqaling more power, the sound of a blow-off vaulve heh heh heh

Cons: Lag Lag Lag oh and lag

SC pros: Instant power

Cons: horrible MPG , more input to equal an Ok output.


So if your racing sum one on the highway turbod car with your SC'd car the turbod car would kik ur A$$
If your racing short distances (light to light) then you would prolly win sence you have instant power.



I would go with turbo, its just awsome...

ShowGSLuVv

Does anyone make a Turbo Charger a lexus V8?? is it even possible?

ShOwGS

JAC JZS

ShOw, theres a few out there. Here is a link to show you not only that it possible but it's been done.


https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...400+Twin+Turbo

JAC JZS

Here is another, it is a Supra but with a Lexus V-8 outfitted with Garret turbos

https://www.clublexus.com/forums/sho...&highlight=HKS