evil00017

I have been thinking for awhile that maybe I might want to supercharge my GS400. After looking into it (like many of you have) I found that you cant really buy a new kit because they are discontinued, I could get one custom made for 7-10k dollars (a little to pricey for me), Or I can wait for a used one to pop up on the classified forum which is like waiting for pigs to fly.

So I started analyzing exactly what are the major components that go into these supercharger kits.
1. Is the charger. Most people use centrifugel superchargers which are normally Vortechs or Prochargers.
2. Supercharger mounting bracket. Probably the most unique part of these kits is the bracket, it lets you mount the charger exactly where you want to in the car.
3. Is the FMU which from what I can be done a few ways using a standalone ecu or a piggyback such as the Emanage or even by using a SAFC (which from what I can tell really isnt recommended). And then you need to get it tuned.
4. Is not necissarily needed but recommended. A intercooler, most kits have a front mount.

After looking at all this I decided these things are not worth 10k and that I could probably build one myself. At first I thought a non intercooled setup might be the easiest and least expensive if you have a bracket like this


you can see how easy it would be to bypass all the intercooler piping and run it directly to the intake manifold. With a non intercooled charger I would figure you could run 5-6psi. A sc430 guy made 286 wheel with 3psi intercooled so i figure that 5-6 would be good for atleast 300wheel with no other mods. maybe 330 with exhaust and headers. So with the idea of runing something like this I emailed SRT about possibly buying a mounting bracket like the one on this setup

They never emailed me back. So than I thought of possibly using the lextreme bracket that they made for the SC400 which supposedly works with the GS400 with little or no mods. http://www.lextreme.com/supercharger-bracket.html
There are 2 ways I was thinking of approaching the Lextreme bracket idea. One was seeing if the bracket would mount on the passenger side of the engine. On the SC400 they show it mounting on the driver side of the engine like shown on there website. Im not sure if it will work on the passenger side, it looks like it was designed for the drivers side. The second idea was relocating the battery into the trunk and mounting it on the driverside of the GS engine and runing a front mount intercooler piping it in from the drivers side where the SC would be located going infront of the bumper coming out on the passenger side of the engine where the intake would normally be and piping it directly into the intake manifold.

Any of these setups I would control with a Emanage.

So what do you all think? Im looking for some constructive critisizm. Which Idea do you think would work or wouldnt work? Am I looking over anything?

PureDrifter

iTrader: (10)

intercool it or you will regret it.

especially here in cali where it gets HOT, no intercooling at ALL on that low boost, even with premium fuel will likely lead to detonation from too high a charge temp.

evil00017

Well greddy made a prototype kit for the 3rd gen gs430 that is nonintercooled that pushes 6psi. Sam430 bought it its the post below this 1. The other thing is that there are mustang cobra kits that push 8psi non intercooled. I even read about someone pushing 11psi on a cobra nonintercooled. If I did start detonating I would probably run some kind of water injection while I figured out how to run a intercooler. But as of right now I am probably going to go with the lextreme bracket and intercooler setup because of the lack of being able to get ahold of any other bracket.

sam430

iTrader: (10)

Don't forget to tally up the price. This is interesting... are you going through with the non-intercooled setup? It'll alleviate all the piping issue and could be an affordable build for all of us. The cool thing is, it could be very cheap.

evil00017

Im not exactly sure what I am going to go through with yet. As of right now I am probably going to go with a intercooled setup with the lextreme fish bracket. The reason I have chosen this is because the fish bracket is basically the only bracket I can come across. The thing with the fish bracket is it puts the charger on the opposite side of the block from where all the other chargers are pictured above. So to pipe that out I would probably have to run it right behind the bumper and come out on the passenger side of the engine bay and straight into the manifold. However there may be a way to go straight from the supercharger and maybe over the radiator line and straight into the intake. That would make things alot easier. Id probably have to get a longer radiator line so it doesnt go straight across like that.

From some research last night I did find out that the fish bracket does fit on a GS430. Which means it should fit on a 400. However the biggest problem is that big black box on the driver side of the engine bay. Basically its in the way and I might have to relocate it. I heard it is part of the ecu or has something to do with the ecu so its not really something that is probably a good idea to move.

A rough price out I would say just by a quick search. Non intercooled the charger itself is the most expensive part if you bought a used charger you could probably get it for less than 1k. However right now the lowest one I could find was a procharger P1SC for 1200, Its a kit off a 5.0 but all I need off of it is the charger. Next expensive is the Greddy Emanage Ultimate. On ebay I saw them going for 5-750. The bracket itself is like 400. Than tuning which im not sure how much it is to tune the emanage but lets throw in another 500. I will round up and say roughly 3k. . If you threw a intercooler on it id add another 600 for piping and the core. Really depends on the core.
Sourcing the Supercharger is really what makes it or brakes it. I looked at how much vortech s1/s2 were new from vortech and they are like 2300+.

Anyways yes this could be a much cheaper more affordable avenue for us 400/430 guys to go down. And Im pretty sure its do able.

GILLEXUS

iTrader: (14)

Do you have a way or can you you do the intercooler and piping to and from the intercooler?

Rock-a-Lex

iTrader: (4)

I tell you something right now...I have spent a good amount of dough on my ride since I bought her in '03. IF I decide to keep her indefinitely (i.e. past 2 more years) I will definitely supercharge her in a year or so. Great research so far EVIL!!!

ZippyGuy

iTrader: (9)

I'm a GS300 guy with a Powerdyne SC and can tell you that it IS doable on the GS400 and/or 430. I noodled buying a SC430 and looked heavily into turbo charging vs supercharging.

For my GS300 I looked into this for a long time and went the SC way mostly due to their sound reliablity. This is NOT a big power direction IMO and........cheaper, it is not.

For the bracket and intercooler you might call Steve at LMW (super nice guy). I spoke with him a early this summer and he had a few brackets s/intercooler left that he might deal on. I believe the bracket was designed for the Powerdyne BD-11a SC which you can buy online for fairly cheap and have rebuilt at a REPUTABLE shop like www.928motorsports.com (those people have been outstanding to me).

Fuel/air management. Initially you will probably not need to deal with this is you're running low boost but you'll need to figure out a stategy for delivering more fuel. I went with a Walboro drop in and a rising rate fuel regulator buttoned up with braided steel lines. Long term you'll need to have a tuner build a black box for the ECU or look into a management system. GReddy is a really expensive way to go, you could probably go AEM instead. Check out www.suprastore.com, they have some of the most ompetitive pricing out there.

3UZFTE

Right idea, I have also wondered about the fish bracket on our GS, unfortunately I have a 430. I am in for this build, let us know of any updates. Also you can pick up an intercoolor, depending on the size and manufacture on eBay from $20 to $500, I'd go with something around $150 just because its about the right size for the 4 liter. Also, I was cruising around for superchargers, found a few... Paxton, Vortech, Procharger, powerdyne. A few for < $1000, here's the links. Let us know what you come up with.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/87-93...Q5fAccessories
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/PROCH...Q5fAccessories

passnu2

iTrader: (33)

so where is everyone getting this bracket to mount the S/C from

ZippyGuy

iTrader: (9)

Lextreme
RMM might have the plans or "yet to be sold" bracket around
LMW

OR......

Someone might use there SC bracket as model to create a template.

evil00017

Thats kind of where I was at. For awhile I was looking at alot of other cars contemplating getting something faster. Which is what I have always wanted. Than my credit got raped a bit (not my fault). And to make things worse, in Dec I get a nice raise. So I decided instead of paying a higher APR for a stock car that I will want to mod anyways. Ill just throw a bunch of money at the GS and make it what I want. The car has the potential to be everything I want. It just needs some work.....mainly a S/C and a manual tranny.

Passnu there is no specific bracket that we are refering to. The fish bracket is made by lextreme for the sc400/ls400. However the other day I read on the lextreme forum from lextreme himself saying that he got a call from a guy that put the fish bracket on his gs430 and that it does fit with no mods. The problem with it its on the least desirable side of the engine, right next to the ECU.

But yea I am still looking into this affordable s/c kit possibility for the masses, and think i might be onto something.

YOO

great ideas guys... i've been doing much research myself. i'll post anything that may help.

thanks

evil00017

What have you found out yoo?

GILLEXUS

iTrader: (14)

Are you opposed to the Procharger S/C and Do you have a way or can you you do the intercooler and piping to and from the intercooler?