Mischievious GS

Hello...

i have a 1st gen GS, which i've been thinking of ways to try and get more power out of it. First of all, i'm not a "racer" looking to make my gs into a 800hp animal. I bought this car last April, and still use it as a daily driver to get to and from work. Since April, i've mostly got it to how I want the car to basically look, but still lacking in the power dept. I'm no mechanical genius and admit a newbie to forced induction, which is why i'm here...to learn from u speed guru's .

I've done a few searches about what could be done to increase power, but just wanted some opinions. I've read a few posts about how ppl did a 2jz-gte swap from a TT Supra with a motor costing about $4500. I've heard its not a simple swap, and honestly, i'm not too sure too many ppl in Hawaii are able to do such a swap successfully. I also read there are issues with not being able to fit the twin turbo's because of the firewall. This option seems to be the hardest, but the upgradeablity with the 2jz-gte seems endless.

Then theres turbo. I've only come across one company that makes a turbo kit called F-Max , which comes with pretty much everything you need to install it. I found the kit retailing for about $4000-$4500. As for shops able to install turbo, there are a few reliable shops that could make this work. I've heard some mixed reviews about this kit as far as reliablity issues. Pricewise, the kit is the same as the 2jz-gte motor, but I take it much easier to install. i know you can also go the custom fabrication route, but i can't seem to find any info about this.

Lastly there's nitrous. I know very little on this subject except that it makes anywhere from 50-150hp depending on the amount of gas you pump into the engine. I've heard different things about nitrous ranging from it'll blow your engine up and it not being good for the engine in the long run, to it's supposedly safe up to half of what you engine can produce (ie: 220hp engine, so safe for 100hp shot of nitrous). I know nitrous systems range from $500-$1000, so pricewise, its the cheapest way to get the most power...well...at least for like 15 seconds or something .

can anyone help this newbie out . any info that i can get about the subject will help alot. prices, facts, experiences, anything to help me get a better understanding. my main concern is to keep the car the way it is reliablity-wise. i don't want to end up in a shop if i decide to floor it one day and my engine blows up .

v300

realistically, how much horsepower and torque do you want to have on tap. what are your driving habits? how much do you have to spend?

jaymode

I would go with a nitrous setup, most likely a dry setup. Because if you ever have to sell the car or want to have more power in there later on it will be pretty easy to change, if you decide to the swap or the turbo later.

Because say you get that fmax turbo setup and decide later on that you want more power, you may want to do the swap, the nitrous kit can still work for the car with the swap. I think if your not sure, then go with nitrous because it is a little more flexible. Trust everytime you get more hp and tq you keep wanting more.

Mischievious GS

honestly, i'm still in the beginning stages. i haven't set a budget, but i read in other posts that it should be anywhere from $6000 and up for the turbo and higher for the swap...after labor that is . most likely more $$ will equal more hp...and i really don't have a clue as to how much i will end up spending. Honestly, I'm trying for whichever is safest for the engine in the long run. ie: if i end up running nitrous, and i have to replace my engine in like 3 years or something because nitrous blew something in the engine...then thats outta the question. i know i know...too much fast and the furious , but its just an example. i know as i go, i'm going to want to add more hp here and there, but i'm just looking for more info, so at least i have a starting place. its not like i'm going to spend $10g and buy a 2jz-gte swap tomorrow .

jaymode

Ok the gs has a very strong engine. First question how many miles on the engine?? Are you running premium gas?

Also, how is the tranny holding up?
All these question come into play when upgrading performance. How are you driving habits. Scenario if you are gonna use the nitrous every single time you drive your car, then you may be better off with the swap or turbo kit. The 2jzgte engine is a very strong engine, it can handle 800hp stock with upgraded turbos. If your engine is high mileage and you want more performance everytime you step on the gas then what you want is the swap/turbo. But if you just want power on tap, just there for necessary situations then nitrous is you choice. Most nitrous systems can be self-installed. They may require a retardation of the timing and one stage colder plugs, ngk or denso. If you decide to go nitrous then you have to decide what type of system you want dry, direct port, or fogger.

Mischievious GS

i've heard that the 2jz-ge engine can handle up to 300 hp or 400 hp with stock internals. i'm not really looking to going all out like changing pistons and rods and etc.

my car has about 85000 miles and i've been using premium gas since i've bought the car in april. i'm guessing that the car itself has been maintained pretty well before me. the only thing i've had changed in the car since i've gotten it was the valve cover gaskets. other things like TM plugs, new wires, and such were just put in as well when the gasket was changed. the car itself such as the tranny seems to be in top condition.

as for my driving habits, its not like i'm planning to gun it as soon as i leave my driveway . i just want more power so i can burn that 2.5 altima that comes flying it past me . but other than that, i usually drive conservatively...somewhat .

i've read that the Venom nitrous system is pretty foolproof and relatively safe for newbies like myself. computer controlled to automatically release nitrous at certain rpms or something along those lines. my concern with that is, wouldn't that use up the tank pretty quickly? i mean, seems nice, but if i have to refill the tank every week...that doesn't really seem feasible.

jaymode

Ok well i would not recommend boost on a car getting up there with miles, withouth an engine rebuild which is not what you want to do.
The 2jzgte does not need to have internal changed if you want to boost insane amounts it just needs bigger turbos. Because there are many stock supras out there running 700+ hp with just a turbo upgrade. If you are gonna do turbo charger I recommend you try this if you can find a place experienced enough to do it.

The fmax turbo kit, would not be that great of an idea. I do not like the idea of boosting engines with around 100,000 miles on it. Even though it only has 85,000 you said you will not be getting it right this moment.

As for nitrous. I have heard about the venom kits and do not like them that much, they are new in the game and I would want more control over the nitrous system. People say ZEX is crap n for RICERS but I do not think so. They are respectable as is NOS.

If you have kept up with maintenance on the car, you should have no problems with nitrous. I like to use high mileage oil for my cars after they are over about 90,000 miles. That helps the seals last longer.

dizoita

Dude youll get nos youll play with it, but turbo is so much more fun plus the sound, a nice front mount ic, bov, and the cool factor of having probibly the only turbo gs in Hi. Dont worry too much about boosting even a 2jz-ge engine with high miles if you stay under 17 psi you should be fine, plenty of na-t supra guys pushing boost, with high miles.

jmecbr900

I have 0 exp with Lexus engines and nitrous, but tons with the Nissan 3.0L V-6 and nitrous.

I started running nitrous in my 95 Max when it had 150k. I ran a dry NOS setup from 50 shot all the way up to 70 shot. I ran numerous bottles thru like that. I ran at the track atleast 20-30 times.

I then upgraded to direct port @ 125 shot wet still on all STOCK internals. I ran even more bottles thru like that. I did both installs myself of both the system and all the other add-ons that are necessary at those power levels.

I tell you this for only one reason. I like nitrous. I don't think nitrous is the bogey man. I KNOW it will NOT blow your engine, IF DONE CORRECTLY. Problem comes in that people get greedy and go beyond the capabilities of their engine. My car has over 165K+ mi now and it still passes emissions tests every year on the first try (even with aftermarket Y pipe that eliminated 2 pre-cats, RT cat, no resonator, and custom cat-back).

BTW, this was a 95 max GLE that being an auto, with full leather interior, full aftermarket stereo (amps, sub box, etc..), spare, jack, 1/4 tank of gas, and street tires managed to run a best time of 13.3 @ 108mph. Most stock 95 GLE's run in the mid to upper 15's on a good day, if not 16's normally.

Not all the gains in that car can I chalk up to N2O, but it was the BIG difference. I'm a big believer and user of N2O if you couldn't tell that by now.....

Mischievious GS

hmm...seems to be a mixed reaction to this. i've been thinking about this, and i'm most likely ruling out the 2jz-gte swap because of the sheer work and down time the car would see. if i was a mechanic and knew more about the engine's internals and such...no doubt, this would be a more viable option, but for me...i don't think i could undertake such a task...nor would i have the funds available to do something like this.

i've been leaning toward the turbo...specifically the f-max kit because it's pretty much bolt on and supposedly boosts the stock 160-175 bhp output to a 320 bhp output according to the website. but still not sure as nitrous still seems like a possiblity. seems to me that nitrous would be good if i ran my car on the 1/4 mile because the boost would last about 15 secs. with all morals aside, in a road race, i would most likely get toasted by, lets say a honda with turbo, after the nitrous stops. am i correct about this

?

jaymode

Not exactly true.

read this:
Q: How long can I hold the nitrous button down?
A: It is possible to hold the button down until the bottle is empty. However 15 continuous seconds at a time, or less, is recommend.
http://500cid.com/mts/caduse/nitro/

The first gen gs have a v6 or a v8?? I think nitrous is your answer. I believe in it and with a lot of upgrading/tuning you can run bigger shots safely.

cyclemax

Herein lies the problem with nitrous, IMO. You won't be filling it every week. You'll be filling it every day. Sometimes even several times a day. It doesn't last long at all.

I recall one time on my NOS Fogger direct-port CBR900, I went for a ride with some guys, and within 15 miles of hiway I was out of juice, just from doing roll-ons. Meanwhile, the ones with big-bore kits and other "non-depleting" mods still enjoyed their power for the rest of the night.

For the occasional blast, or drag race, it's hard to beat, but it sounds like you want the power all the time, so I'd suggest the turbo for you. Why buy bottled air when you can keep compressing your own?

jmecbr900

That may be so for the very small bottles for motorcycles, but for car applications where a 10lb bottle is used it just isn't so.

I run 125 wet shot, as previously stated, and that's even direct port (which will "flow" susbtantially more/faster than single fogger nozzles since there is a nozzle to each cylinder), and I can get at least 7-8 1/4 mi passes on a full bottle before it starts to fizzle out. On a "small" 50-75 shot dry setup, you should be able to get atleast 15 passes on one bottle. These numbers are from personal experience having ran both setups at the track.

I agree with you that nitrous is only to be used 15 secs. max at a time, unless you want to start picking up engine parts off the street. I also agree that nitrous, as much as I like it, is in reality a temporary "boost". It's not true forced induction either.

With all that said, nitrous does give you the option of maintaining your car's stock engine/internals and "boosting" performance by an unbelievable amount, all be-it momentary only. The bang for the buck just cannot be beat for drag purposes period. You can't get the same numbers nitrous gives you unless you spend many thousands more on s/c or turbo, and both those mods are much more permanent. I could install a nitrous kit in your car and later take it out and noone would ever know you had ever had it in.

Just more food for thought.

cyclemax

Actually, it is so.

I think we're talking about the same thing, just in different perspectives. My 2lb bottle on the bike running ~35hp is pretty close to your 10 lb with 125. I would get about 7-8 1/4 mile runs in before it would start surging, which is the same as you stated.

Problem is, that's only 96 seconds of use assuming you flow for 12 sec each pass. At the track that's fine, and may last you all night if that's all the runs you can get in.

On the street, it's much different though. If you start playing on the hiway with a car that's faster than U, doing rolls, etc. That 96 seconds will be gone b4 you know it. Kind of like the way your 500 cell phone minutes get used up when you think you're only at 100.

If you live in the city (or an island, I suppose) you may not have the room to go thru that kind of juice, but around here, I can burn thru bottles in minutes. Literally.

If you just want it for occasional blast, then it is by far the best bang for the buck. If you want more than 8 12-sec runs before you have to fill the bottle, then I recommend the turbo.

As far as installation goes, yes the N2O is much easier, but I also believe a comparable turbo system can be installed w/o any internal mods. I think you could also remove it without any evidence as well.

Bottom line is that nitrous is cheaper and easier at the expense of being a limited boost. Great for drag racing. Turbo is more expensive and difficult to install/tune, but the gains are permanent.

Mischievious GS:
If you are happy with the performance of your vehicle now, but would like to add a little more for occasional events, go with the nitrous. But it sounds to me like you want more power all the time, and therefore, again, I'm gonna suggest the turbo.

tzu911

wow, it's been really educational reading all the posts about forced inducing the GS engine. I recently purchased a pre-owned 2000 GS. After putting on flamboyant but absolutely impracticle undercar neons and strobes, I'm now utilizing the resource of this forum and am seriously considering putting nitrous system on my ride. Anywhere that's recommanded in the central coast or socal (805, 714, 626, 949, 0r 909)? Please fill this reply.

what's the approximate cost to say, put on a dry nitrous system on my 2000gs 300 with 55K on it?:eek: