Lexus Considering More Potent RC F Variant
09-30-14 | 07:27 AM
#1
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Lexus Considering More Potent RC F Variant
http://www.gtspirit.com/2014/09/30/lexus-considering-more-potent-rc-f-variant/
Lexus is apparently already working on a tuned variant of the RC F Coupe with a new model set for a launch next year.
Details about a more potent Lexus RC F remain scarce at the moment but such a model will be more focused on driver involvement and enjoyment rather than simply additional power and speed.
While discussing this with Motoring, chief engineer of the RC F, Yukihiro Yaguchi said, “The objective is to make the car more fun to drive. If you make the car go too fast then the human being won’t be able to catch up with it. It will be a different approach from other manufacturers… We see their components and our components are quite different … and really it all depends on what sort of technology will evolve at the time and have to match the pace of that.”
Despite this, Yaguchi revealed that the current 5.0-litre V8 can be uprated to deliver even more powerful if necessary.
“We think we can get a little more out of it. It’s really about increasing the rpm to be able to gain more horsepower, so if we were to increase the rpm then we would have to look at using what components to be able to meet the rpm increase… so at that time we would also have to review the cost etcetera. So right now it is set.”
[Via Motoring]
Lexus is apparently already working on a tuned variant of the RC F Coupe with a new model set for a launch next year.
Details about a more potent Lexus RC F remain scarce at the moment but such a model will be more focused on driver involvement and enjoyment rather than simply additional power and speed.
While discussing this with Motoring, chief engineer of the RC F, Yukihiro Yaguchi said, “The objective is to make the car more fun to drive. If you make the car go too fast then the human being won’t be able to catch up with it. It will be a different approach from other manufacturers… We see their components and our components are quite different … and really it all depends on what sort of technology will evolve at the time and have to match the pace of that.”
Despite this, Yaguchi revealed that the current 5.0-litre V8 can be uprated to deliver even more powerful if necessary.
“We think we can get a little more out of it. It’s really about increasing the rpm to be able to gain more horsepower, so if we were to increase the rpm then we would have to look at using what components to be able to meet the rpm increase… so at that time we would also have to review the cost etcetera. So right now it is set.”
[Via Motoring]
09-30-14 | 01:34 PM
#3
Lexus Champion
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,083
Likes: 3
From: PA
As One of the moderators pointed out, Lexus will run with the RCF for the foreseeable future.
Lexus is not into a power battle. They are into redefining the driver experience and delighting the driver through new interfaces and pure fun.
If I wanted a track only vehicle, it would be a Porsche Cayman S that is stripped down--no AC, Nav, handles, spare, etc.
For my needs, the new radical coupe works perfectly, but I realize we all have different driving needs. Honestly, the new carbon with TVD has much more than I will ever tap into during my rides.
09-30-14 | 02:01 PM
#4
I think we are potentially looking at a street-legal version of the RC-F CCS-R with an emphasis on lighter weight rather than significantly increased horsepower:
http://www.motoring.com.au/news/spor...ter-rc-f-45711
Lexus plotting hotter RC F
Chief engineer confirms more developments for new mid-size Lexus coupe before it even arrives
Lexus' new RC F Coupe doesn't hit Australian showrooms until earlier next year, but further developments for the all-new V8 coupe are already in the pipeline -- led by a CCS-R club racer scheduled for launch later in 2015.
Speaking in the US at this week's international launch of the RC F, our first drive review of which will be published at 1:00pm on Friday, chief engineer Yukihiro Yaguchi declared development of the BMW M4 Coupe rival would be ongoing.
“We are already thinking about some changes to make for next year,” he confirmed via an interpreter.
But while that statement instantly conjures up images of a more powerful version of the RC F to take on a future Black Series edition of the Mercedes-Benz C 63 AMG or a hotter M4 CSL Coupe from BMW, Yaguchi says the emphasis will be on making the car more enjoyable, not necessarily more powerful.
“The objective is to make the car more fun to drive. If you make the car go too fast then the human being won’t be able to catch up with it.
“It will be a different approach from other manufacturers… We see their components and our components are quite different … and really it all depends on what sort of technology will evolve at the time and have to match the pace of that.”
While the embargo on RC F details means we can’t say exactly what the key specs of the two-door coupe are, we can confirm earlier reports that its naturally-aspirated 5.0-litre V8 engine will produce in excess of 335kW in launch form, exceeding the M3/M4 and Audi RS5, but falling short of Merc's run-out C 63 AMG 507 Edition's 6.2-litre V8.
Intriguingly, he did concede there was more power to be eked from the engine, without resorting to forced induction.
“We think we can get a little more out of it,” he said.
“It’s really about increasing the rpm to be able to gain more horsepower, so if we were to increase the rpm then we would have to look at using what components to be able to meet the rpm increase… so at that time we would also have to review the cost etcetera. So right now it is set.”
Yaguchi made the point that continual evolution of the RC F follows the path of its IS F sedan predecessor, which he also chief engineered.
“That car actually had some model changes each year and that would most likely happen with the RC F,” he confirmed.
Significantly, the IS F’s power and torque outputs of 311kW and 505Nm never varied from launch in 2008 through to its recent demise. It went through a suspension geometry change in 2010 and changed dampers in 2012.
The RC F CCS-R (or Circuit Club Sports Racer) will take over from the IS F CCSR, which has been around in one form or another since 2010 and gained global publicity when it won the exhibition class at the legendary Pikes Peak Hill Climb in 2013.
Yaguchi told motoring.com.au last November that the enjoyable and accessible dynamics of the IS F CCSR were the basis of what he aimed to achieve with the RC F driving experience.
It follows that the RC F CCS-R will give us a clue on where Yaguchi would like to head with the standard RC F.
Yaguchi confirmed the two RC Fs would share the same engine and eight-speed automatic transmission and the same outputs. If it follows the example of the IS F CCS-R, then the RC F version will be considerably lightened, have bigger brakes and substantial suspension tuning capability for motorsport.
“The CCS-R will carry over the stock engine and transmission and basically be suited for track driving, but for someone to be able to hop in and drive quite easily and be able to get comfortable.”
The CCS-R will be the third motorsport-oriented RC F derivative, following on from the Japanese GT version and the GT3, which will start racing in 2015.
Chief engineer confirms more developments for new mid-size Lexus coupe before it even arrives
Lexus' new RC F Coupe doesn't hit Australian showrooms until earlier next year, but further developments for the all-new V8 coupe are already in the pipeline -- led by a CCS-R club racer scheduled for launch later in 2015.
Speaking in the US at this week's international launch of the RC F, our first drive review of which will be published at 1:00pm on Friday, chief engineer Yukihiro Yaguchi declared development of the BMW M4 Coupe rival would be ongoing.
“We are already thinking about some changes to make for next year,” he confirmed via an interpreter.
But while that statement instantly conjures up images of a more powerful version of the RC F to take on a future Black Series edition of the Mercedes-Benz C 63 AMG or a hotter M4 CSL Coupe from BMW, Yaguchi says the emphasis will be on making the car more enjoyable, not necessarily more powerful.
“The objective is to make the car more fun to drive. If you make the car go too fast then the human being won’t be able to catch up with it.
“It will be a different approach from other manufacturers… We see their components and our components are quite different … and really it all depends on what sort of technology will evolve at the time and have to match the pace of that.”
While the embargo on RC F details means we can’t say exactly what the key specs of the two-door coupe are, we can confirm earlier reports that its naturally-aspirated 5.0-litre V8 engine will produce in excess of 335kW in launch form, exceeding the M3/M4 and Audi RS5, but falling short of Merc's run-out C 63 AMG 507 Edition's 6.2-litre V8.
Intriguingly, he did concede there was more power to be eked from the engine, without resorting to forced induction.
“We think we can get a little more out of it,” he said.
“It’s really about increasing the rpm to be able to gain more horsepower, so if we were to increase the rpm then we would have to look at using what components to be able to meet the rpm increase… so at that time we would also have to review the cost etcetera. So right now it is set.”
Yaguchi made the point that continual evolution of the RC F follows the path of its IS F sedan predecessor, which he also chief engineered.
“That car actually had some model changes each year and that would most likely happen with the RC F,” he confirmed.
Significantly, the IS F’s power and torque outputs of 311kW and 505Nm never varied from launch in 2008 through to its recent demise. It went through a suspension geometry change in 2010 and changed dampers in 2012.
The RC F CCS-R (or Circuit Club Sports Racer) will take over from the IS F CCSR, which has been around in one form or another since 2010 and gained global publicity when it won the exhibition class at the legendary Pikes Peak Hill Climb in 2013.
Yaguchi told motoring.com.au last November that the enjoyable and accessible dynamics of the IS F CCSR were the basis of what he aimed to achieve with the RC F driving experience.
It follows that the RC F CCS-R will give us a clue on where Yaguchi would like to head with the standard RC F.
Yaguchi confirmed the two RC Fs would share the same engine and eight-speed automatic transmission and the same outputs. If it follows the example of the IS F CCS-R, then the RC F version will be considerably lightened, have bigger brakes and substantial suspension tuning capability for motorsport.
“The CCS-R will carry over the stock engine and transmission and basically be suited for track driving, but for someone to be able to hop in and drive quite easily and be able to get comfortable.”
The CCS-R will be the third motorsport-oriented RC F derivative, following on from the Japanese GT version and the GT3, which will start racing in 2015.
09-30-14 | 02:43 PM
#5
more than likely the same engine is going to be in the gsf with slight power bump, so it's very possible that it will make it into this variant car (if it happens).
i personally am not too worried about power, i think it's just fine (and good). i would focus more on other aspects. biggest one is weight, then more high end components like brakes and suspension tuning, etc... making the car more involved to drive is another good thing imho. yaguchi says the rcf is a car that drivers of any level would enjoy, part of that makes me wonder if that means there are more computer involvements.
on the other hand there are cars like porsche that are harder to drive but once you do it, it's one hell of a car. i personally like that kind of "challenge"
i personally am not too worried about power, i think it's just fine (and good). i would focus more on other aspects. biggest one is weight, then more high end components like brakes and suspension tuning, etc... making the car more involved to drive is another good thing imho. yaguchi says the rcf is a car that drivers of any level would enjoy, part of that makes me wonder if that means there are more computer involvements.
on the other hand there are cars like porsche that are harder to drive but once you do it, it's one hell of a car. i personally like that kind of "challenge"
09-30-14 | 05:51 PM
#6
Lexus Champion
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,083
Likes: 3
From: PA
more than likely the same engine is going to be in the gsf with slight power bump, so it's very possible that it will make it into this variant car (if it happens).
i personally am not too worried about power, i think it's just fine (and good). i would focus more on other aspects. biggest one is weight, then more high end components like brakes and suspension tuning, etc... making the car more involved to drive is another good thing imho. yaguchi says the rcf is a car that drivers of any level would enjoy, part of that makes me wonder if that means there are more computer involvements.
on the other hand there are cars like porsche that are harder to drive but once you do it, it's one hell of a car. i personally like that kind of "challenge"
i personally am not too worried about power, i think it's just fine (and good). i would focus more on other aspects. biggest one is weight, then more high end components like brakes and suspension tuning, etc... making the car more involved to drive is another good thing imho. yaguchi says the rcf is a car that drivers of any level would enjoy, part of that makes me wonder if that means there are more computer involvements.
on the other hand there are cars like porsche that are harder to drive but once you do it, it's one hell of a car. i personally like that kind of "challenge"
It's a luxury GT coupe with plenty of bite. This is the vision for the car.
10-02-14 | 10:02 PM
#7
More engaging to drive means we don't want to scare people with racecar level acceleration. If you dig deep into the ECM on the IS-F you will find it measures engine acceleration and limits it. Read up on the Norwood project and you'll find they could not run the boost they wanted because the ECM choked it down. I'm sure they are doing the same thing for the RCF. Why do you think the base throttle response in the IS-F is so lame that everyone wants a throttle controller? Acceleration scares newbs. So we'll dumb down the performance and call it "more accessible" because more people won't be scared by the performance we offer. So very Lexus like.
It's pretty much time to leave the brand for me. Lexus isn't going to make something taking it to the next level, they want to make sure the slow folks won't be scared, so the next level is unobtainable.
And please don't say "but they have four modes now" because they've neutered performance at the engine in the ECM.
It's pretty much time to leave the brand for me. Lexus isn't going to make something taking it to the next level, they want to make sure the slow folks won't be scared, so the next level is unobtainable.
And please don't say "but they have four modes now" because they've neutered performance at the engine in the ECM.
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10-03-14 | 03:38 AM
#8
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Joined: Sep 2014
Posts: 299
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From: Prague
More engaging to drive means we don't want to scare people with racecar level acceleration. If you dig deep into the ECM on the IS-F you will find it measures engine acceleration and limits it. Read up on the Norwood project and you'll find they could not run the boost they wanted because the ECM choked it down. I'm sure they are doing the same thing for the RCF. Why do you think the base throttle response in the IS-F is so lame that everyone wants a throttle controller? Acceleration scares newbs. So we'll dumb down the performance and call it "more accessible" because more people won't be scared by the performance we offer. So very Lexus like.
It's pretty much time to leave the brand for me. Lexus isn't going to make something taking it to the next level, they want to make sure the slow folks won't be scared, so the next level is unobtainable.
And please don't say "but they have four modes now" because they've neutered performance at the engine in the ECM.
It's pretty much time to leave the brand for me. Lexus isn't going to make something taking it to the next level, they want to make sure the slow folks won't be scared, so the next level is unobtainable.
And please don't say "but they have four modes now" because they've neutered performance at the engine in the ECM.
If that is true, it means Lexus cars have even more potential. If they could offer full potential as option for those customers that want it, it would be really nice.
10-03-14 | 06:33 AM
#9
Lexus Champion
Joined: Dec 2011
Posts: 2,083
Likes: 3
From: PA
More engaging to drive means we don't want to scare people with racecar level acceleration. If you dig deep into the ECM on the IS-F you will find it measures engine acceleration and limits it. Read up on the Norwood project and you'll find they could not run the boost they wanted because the ECM choked it down. I'm sure they are doing the same thing for the RCF. Why do you think the base throttle response in the IS-F is so lame that everyone wants a throttle controller? Acceleration scares newbs. So we'll dumb down the performance and call it "more accessible" because more people won't be scared by the performance we offer. So very Lexus like.
It's pretty much time to leave the brand for me. Lexus isn't going to make something taking it to the next level, they want to make sure the slow folks won't be scared, so the next level is unobtainable.
And please don't say "but they have four modes now" because they've neutered performance at the engine in the ECM.
It's pretty much time to leave the brand for me. Lexus isn't going to make something taking it to the next level, they want to make sure the slow folks won't be scared, so the next level is unobtainable.
And please don't say "but they have four modes now" because they've neutered performance at the engine in the ECM.
I mean really...how friggin fast does one need to go on the roads? A few of us are looking for the track animal--I'm not one of them--you are. I want a luxury GT--super styling and great performance.
There are plenty of folks killing themselves these days doing absolutely ASININE crap on the roads. I see it every day.
One famous TV star killed himself and a friend in a Porsche GT3 in my neck of the woods, trying to negotiate a curve well into the 3 digits.
Lexus is just responsible about what they offer the public--with good reason in my opinion.
This is the Lexus brand, and I would not expect them to make excuses for what they view as their "mission."
Before you jump ship, test drive a production carbon TVD in the spring.
10-03-14 | 07:53 AM
#10
More engaging to drive means we don't want to scare people with racecar level acceleration. If you dig deep into the ECM on the IS-F you will find it measures engine acceleration and limits it. Read up on the Norwood project and you'll find they could not run the boost they wanted because the ECM choked it down. I'm sure they are doing the same thing for the RCF. Why do you think the base throttle response in the IS-F is so lame that everyone wants a throttle controller? Acceleration scares newbs. So we'll dumb down the performance and call it "more accessible" because more people won't be scared by the performance we offer. So very Lexus like.
It's pretty much time to leave the brand for me. Lexus isn't going to make something taking it to the next level, they want to make sure the slow folks won't be scared, so the next level is unobtainable.
And please don't say "but they have four modes now" because they've neutered performance at the engine in the ECM.
It's pretty much time to leave the brand for me. Lexus isn't going to make something taking it to the next level, they want to make sure the slow folks won't be scared, so the next level is unobtainable.
And please don't say "but they have four modes now" because they've neutered performance at the engine in the ECM.
10-03-14 | 08:47 AM
#11
Lexus Champion
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 19,966
Likes: 180
more than likely the same engine is going to be in the gsf with slight power bump, so it's very possible that it will make it into this variant car (if it happens).
i personally am not too worried about power, i think it's just fine (and good). i would focus more on other aspects. biggest one is weight, then more high end components like brakes and suspension tuning, etc... making the car more involved to drive is another good thing imho. yaguchi says the rcf is a car that drivers of any level would enjoy, part of that makes me wonder if that means there are more computer involvements.
on the other hand there are cars like porsche that are harder to drive but once you do it, it's one hell of a car. i personally like that kind of "challenge"
i personally am not too worried about power, i think it's just fine (and good). i would focus more on other aspects. biggest one is weight, then more high end components like brakes and suspension tuning, etc... making the car more involved to drive is another good thing imho. yaguchi says the rcf is a car that drivers of any level would enjoy, part of that makes me wonder if that means there are more computer involvements.
on the other hand there are cars like porsche that are harder to drive but once you do it, it's one hell of a car. i personally like that kind of "challenge"
As to the "making it easy" to drive fast, that was their moto with IS/GS and GT86 as well.
10-03-14 | 04:38 PM
#12
they could do what BMW did and strip some luxury out of it... CCSR would be good for this car I guess... strip half of the sound proofing, and limit some options for lower weight, they will easily drop 200lbs out of heaviest.
As to the "making it easy" to drive fast, that was their moto with IS/GS and GT86 as well.
As to the "making it easy" to drive fast, that was their moto with IS/GS and GT86 as well.
making it easy to drive in the IS and GS is good imho, i loev that moto. but on cars on their ultimate sports car? i don't know. well at least personally i think if you are building an exclusive car, make it a higher requirement. lfa is a great car to drive but i don't call it an easy car to drive, it requires respect to the car and also reasonable skills. that's the direction i like. i surely hope ISF001 doesn't say lexus is irresponsible with the lfa
10-03-14 | 06:08 PM
#14
If being a near 4 second car with 170 top end is for "slow folks" like me and the other serious buyers in the club, they yes, you probably need to move to the Bugatti brand.
I mean really...how friggin fast does one need to go on the roads? A few of us are looking for the track animal--I'm not one of them--you are. I want a luxury GT--super styling and great performance.
There are plenty of folks killing themselves these days doing absolutely ASININE crap on the roads. I see it every day.
One famous TV star killed himself and a friend in a Porsche GT3 in my neck of the woods, trying to negotiate a curve well into the 3 digits.
Lexus is just responsible about what they offer the public--with good reason in my opinion.
This is the Lexus brand, and I would not expect them to make excuses for what they view as their "mission."
Before you jump ship, test drive a production carbon TVD in the spring.
I mean really...how friggin fast does one need to go on the roads? A few of us are looking for the track animal--I'm not one of them--you are. I want a luxury GT--super styling and great performance.
There are plenty of folks killing themselves these days doing absolutely ASININE crap on the roads. I see it every day.
One famous TV star killed himself and a friend in a Porsche GT3 in my neck of the woods, trying to negotiate a curve well into the 3 digits.
Lexus is just responsible about what they offer the public--with good reason in my opinion.
This is the Lexus brand, and I would not expect them to make excuses for what they view as their "mission."
Before you jump ship, test drive a production carbon TVD in the spring.
I'll test drive an RCF, you can count on that, but I won't expect it to be anything like the Supras of yore. Even they were difficult to tune at first, and impossible to tune with the factory ECM. With the advent of Toyota's own operating system, I really doubt there is any hope for getting more from any Toyota platform without massively breaking functionality because they design so much interdependence into their multitude of ECUs in their late model cars.
10-03-14 | 06:10 PM
#15