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Why use my post? Do your own UOAs. If you read the thread, I said many times, you need to do your OWN UOA to determine the intervals that fit your driving, your climate, and your choice of oil.
Blindly following anyone, including the manufacturer, is not optimal and might be hazardous. Just like following the manufacturer's recommendations for break-in almost universally leads to less power and more oil consumption.
... Spotty service records will devalue the car. Going 15k miles between oil changes? I wouldn't touch it.
BTW, Once you go past 100k nobody is going to pitch a fuss over service records. Do you really think the "spotty" service records on my Supra will impact the value? I don't. You wouldn't believe the offers I get for it.
BTW, Once you go past 100k nobody is going to pitch a fuss over service records. Do you really think the "spotty" service records on my Supra will impact the value? I don't. You wouldn't believe the offers I get for it.
I guess you don't have much experience in the Lexus market. Especially now that Lexus has the maintenance database. People are looking at service records. I only buy used cars and I always ask for the service records. People know that Lexus is reliable but only if the maintenance is done on time. As I said, I wouldn't touch a car that went 15k miles between oil changes. Maybe you would? That doesn't mean everyone else would. Most people don't know anything other than to follow the manufacturer's schedule. The thinking would be along the lines of; Lexus is the most reliable make in the world, but you know more than they do about how to properly maintain the engine? It is what it is...
The offers you are getting on your Supra is like comparing apples to oranges. The Supra is a classic (and most people who are interested likely expect to be rebuilding the engine for more turbo boost anyway). The RC F is not, yet. The IS F is even less appealing in my opinion. Which is why I've never owned one and never will, regardless of service records.
Why mess with your car's value? With the cost of doing a UOA every single oil change (like $30) how much money are you really saving vs. the money you are losing in value? I may go to synthetic at some point, but it will still be changed every 5k miles. You can do as you wish. I don't fault you. But it's not something I will do.
It is a brand new car so I have no idea if the oil in the car is real or synthetic. Would some dealers put in real oil and other synthetic. That does not seem normal. Seems to me all dealers would follow the same protocol.
Dino juice or synthetic, today's oils are rather soup of chemicals, just do regular oil/filter change which ever kind you use.
In my whole life I never had smoking car. I always stick with regular scheduled maintenance including oil/filter change.
Dave, I think most people are forgetting the primary reason for oil analysis. It is to track and follow the wear of the engine and being able to correct significant issues before they become catastrophic issues. I'll give a good example......09 Civic, no check engine lights or signs of issues. owner complained about poor fuel economy, so I ran a sample and sure enough a significant amount of fuel dilution(7.12%), figure it shouldn't be higher than 0.5% in Honda's 1.8L. had the owner not sampled, he would have continued driving until the engine gave way. Also found significant traces of his timing chain and cams in the sample and what was likely signs of a dirty air filter. If you're doing oil analysis to stretch out drain intervals on a car, you're entirely missing the point. You want to increase the drain intervals when you're talking about a $15,000 oil change on a turbine with 397 passengers on board. Lexus doesn't care about the oil so much, they want to see the car every 5,000 to make sure everything else is ok and so they can sell you more things.
An ambulance company of mine, found even though they stretched their oil change intervals by double, their vehicles fell apart much faster than before, why? Because they were no longer being seen as often and 22 year old EMT's will drive on shot rotors and bad suspension. Their solution? go back to the cheap oil because they rather see the ambulance more often than not. That doesn't mean there was no value in the analysis, I saved the company close to $325,000~ that year in blown engines and transmissions, but they just didn't care about how long they could stretch their oil for.
I think you need to reread the thread. The guy I was replying to was trying to sell changing the oil at 14k miles using synthetic rather than at 5k miles following the manufacturer's maintenance schedule and was using a oil analysis as proof it was okay.
Take your brand new RC F to a dealer at 30k miles and let them see it's only had 2 oil changes. Then see what they offer you for it.
But seriously. I have a $80k sports car. $60 for an oil change every 5k miles is chump change (and I put 3k miles per month on it). The ends some people will go to in an attempt to save a few bucks simply amazes me. If you can't afford the maintenance, get a lower maintenance car... I've made my point here and anything beyond this post will be redundant. Take care.
Me sell a 14k mile OCI? Pretty bold misinterpretation of what I said in this thread and the Blackstone thread.
Not familiar with the Lexus market? Neither is Lexus. They have to give their F cars away for them to move. Despite your disdain for four doors, the IS F was the first Lexus F car made. It was poorly marketed, and even today, is not well known in performance automotive circles. The RC F even less, and the GS F I just bought brand new sold for over $20k off sticker.
See what they will offer because it only had two oil changes? The number of oil changes will be inconsequential because none of these cars are attracting buyers in any significant quantities. If they were, none of us would be complaining about resale values. Also, the Supra was just another Japanese sports car from the 90's until Fast n' Furious. I bought my '93 TT hardtop with 32k miles on it in January of 1997 for $28k. At that time, Supras were sitting on the showroom floor for 8 - 10 months - NA or TT - because Toyota's marketing failed to gather enough steam to make the cars move off the lot. Also, let's see, a fully documented wear analysis over the entire life of the engine vs. regular visits to dealers who don't even know to put 5w-30 in the crankcase. Not a hard decision for anyone who understands what UOA means, and that's the person who will be interested in my car. Not the ES350 buyer who wants to see the maintenance records to be sure the car was "properly maintained."
Good point but if Lexus states regularly oil is used what reason would a dealer change to synthetic ? I will use regular but this baffles me...thanks again.
How about educating yourself. Google the difference betweeen two oils. It's you to decide depending on under what condition you drive and
your driving style(like are you gentle driver? Lead footed?)I live in cold climate, I use synthetic oil from day 1. My son's Bimmer M-series always
uses synthetic drving in summer only. Wife's little run about is OK with regular 5W-20 since day one. Twice oil change a year.
Dave, sorry I think I got lost, I'm not familiar with forums and I get lost with the 20 emails from notifications I get, my point was maybe addressing the forum rather than you in particular, I apologize if I came off rude.
I wouldn't suggest pushing the oil changes for one reason, sure it's cool and fun to get to say you ran 14k on an oil change, but truth be told, there's a lot of contaminants that get absorbed in that oil during the 14k. Also, all it takes if for one fuel injector to become faulty during an interval that long and because you don't have on board fuel dilution detection in the crank case, you F*&*ed up your motor because you pushed it longer than you had the chance to look at it. Hence back to the drawing board, Lexus wanted to see their cars every 5k for a reason. You can probably run Renewable Lubricants Biosynthetic 5W-30 HD oil in your RC F for 20,000 miles. It's that good, but what might not be that good is when your injector or head gasket blow in the middle of that interval and wipe out your engine.
Also, most oil companies spend more money on marketing rather than R&D. Why is it that no one on these forums ever talks about a non brand name oil? Renewable Lubricants, short of a custom formula, is in my humble opinion the best oil for the 2UR-GSE, not the best for every lexus and honda and ferrari ever made. Every engine has a different need and a different oil that would work best for it. finding the best oil for your engine is the true game.
Recently saw an F series truck with 6.7 power stroke, guy kept pushing the oil intervals, completely missed the corroding timing chain cover, wiped out the engine and his pocket book to the tune of $19,239.19. Get some lab results and shot them to me, I'll let you know what you might be missing......so Cash the oil, how bow dah?
Me sell a 14k mile OCI? Pretty bold misinterpretation of what I said in this thread and the Blackstone thread.
Not familiar with the Lexus market? Neither is Lexus. They have to give their F cars away for them to move. Despite your disdain for four doors, the IS F was the first Lexus F car made. It was poorly marketed, and even today, is not well known in performance automotive circles. The RC F even less, and the GS F I just bought brand new sold for over $20k off sticker.
See what they will offer because it only had two oil changes? The number of oil changes will be inconsequential because none of these cars are attracting buyers in any significant quantities. If they were, none of us would be complaining about resale values. Also, the Supra was just another Japanese sports car from the 90's until Fast n' Furious. I bought my '93 TT hardtop with 32k miles on it in January of 1997 for $28k. At that time, Supras were sitting on the showroom floor for 8 - 10 months - NA or TT - because Toyota's marketing failed to gather enough steam to make the cars move off the lot. Also, let's see, a fully documented wear analysis over the entire life of the engine vs. regular visits to dealers who don't even know to put 5w-30 in the crankcase. Not a hard decision for anyone who understands what UOA means, and that's the person who will be interested in my car. Not the ES350 buyer who wants to see the maintenance records to be sure the car was "properly maintained."
Who do you think is going to be interested in our RC F? Don't forget that this is not the IS F forum. Our cars are not taken seriously by most performance enthusiasts. The ES350 buyer is the bulk of our already small market...
Also, your analysis is for the IS F engine. The RC F engine is in the same family, but it is not the same. In a laboratory environment nothing is to be assumed.
You have made your case. I never denied anything about your oil analysis. But I feel it is my job to inform the less knowledgeable crowd of the potential drawbacks of deviating from the manufacturer's maintenance schedule. Keep in mind a lot of owners here are leasing and/or will probably be trading in their cars before the warranty is up... and the ES350 buyers are going to be shopping for their cars. Not the same people looking at your Supra.
Even still, I've always been a fan of frequent oil changes regardless of whether or not they can be pushed out further. Back in the old days all they had was dino oil, and it wasn't nearly as good as it is today. Many of those cars ran for 100,000's of miles too. If you were to follow the manufacturer's schedule for our Fs, I can pretty much bet that the car will fail for reasons other than using dino oil and having it changed every 5k miles.
Originally Posted by danielTRLK
Dave, sorry I think I got lost, I'm not familiar with forums and I get lost with the 20 emails from notifications I get, my point was maybe addressing the forum rather than you in particular, I apologize if I came off rude.
I wouldn't suggest pushing the oil changes for one reason, sure it's cool and fun to get to say you ran 14k on an oil change, but truth be told, there's a lot of contaminants that get absorbed in that oil during the 14k. Also, all it takes if for one fuel injector to become faulty during an interval that long and because you don't have on board fuel dilution detection in the crank case, you F*&*ed up your motor because you pushed it longer than you had the chance to look at it. Hence back to the drawing board, Lexus wanted to see their cars every 5k for a reason. You can probably run Renewable Lubricants Biosynthetic 5W-30 HD oil in your RC F for 20,000 miles. It's that good, but what might not be that good is when your injector or head gasket blow in the middle of that interval and wipe out your engine.
Also, most oil companies spend more money on marketing rather than R&D. Why is it that no one on these forums ever talks about a non brand name oil? Renewable Lubricants, short of a custom formula, is in my humble opinion the best oil for the 2UR-GSE, not the best for every lexus and honda and ferrari ever made. Every engine has a different need and a different oil that would work best for it. finding the best oil for your engine is the true game.
Recently saw an F series truck with 6.7 power stroke, guy kept pushing the oil intervals, completely missed the corroding timing chain cover, wiped out the engine and his pocket book to the tune of $19,239.19. Get some lab results and shot them to me, I'll let you know what you might be missing......so Cash the oil, how bow dah?
I apologize if I came off rude. I'm at work and it's been a little stressful today.
Railway Diesel locomotives oil is analyzed every time they have a run. After the run engineer has to take an engine oil sample to the maintenance shop. There a chemist analyze the oil using chromatography machine. As soon as they find some signal indicating an oil change or some other mechanical repair the loco. grounded until necessary work is done. Most locos. are made by GE and the condition of engine warranty is carrying out the routine oil analysis.
02-21-17, 04:49 PM
