bcrdukes

Hi Folks,

Long time lurker. First time poster. Some of you will recognize my username on other car forums.

I've been looking at transitioning over to a Lexus RC-F in the future (looking within one or two year time frame.) I'm looking to see if anyone here on the forums track their RC or RC-F regularly and if so, what their experience has been so far and if any comparison to other manufacturers?

Just some context - I'm currently driving a street and track prepped Porsche Boxster with my local PCA club for HPDE events. The Boxster has served me well from grocery runs, track days, and daily driving but at some point, I'd like to get into a nicer, more comfortable car. One thing it is not good at are road trips.

Also, if appropriate, I'd like to know if anyone can help answer the following:
1. Which model year of RC-F is the most desirable?
2. Do I "need" the track package? There are a lot of "nice to have" items but nothing I see as absolutely necessary. I'm not looking to do time attacks, win races, or anything. Just fun club-type of HPDE events. I am always the slowest guy anyway.
3. I'm in Canada - Are there known allocations to how many models/trims are available or limited for each country or dealership?

I've browsed the forum, searched, and haven't come across any serious issues that stand out or perhaps I may have missed so I'll take the opportunity here to ask secret question number 4: Any known major problems for RC or RC-F cars? I read a stickied thread or from a search of the forum about something with the wing being a problem.

I can accept this in comparison to any European manufacturer I've owned such as Alfa Romeo, BMW, and Porsche so you can see I am a glutton for punishment. As long as there are no exploding engines or catastrophic electrical or things like timing chains snapping requiring a $30,000 engine rebuild, anything is good in my books. For what it's worth, I grew up with Toyotas my entire life so I know the baseline for reliability and still drive one today.

Any input/comments/guidance appreciated. Thank you in advance!

Regards,

bcrdukes

05RollaXRS

Hi, Welcome.

See response to your questions inline:

1. It depends on your budget. Also, RCFs are very rare in Canada so there are three trim levels available. One is the LSD RCF with moonroof and the 10 split spoke wheels, the carbon fiber/TVD performance package RCF with TVD and CF as well as the 20 spoke hand polished wheels and the 2020+ RCF have the track edition RCF. Anyone of these should be good for taking to the track and doing hotlaps. I have the TVD and it the TVD is an amazing thing to have as it really helps rotate/oversteer rather easily in turns.

2. See before. It is up to your budget, but any of the RCF variants should be good to take to the track. The LSD RCFs are typically the cheapest all things being equal, the RCF CF/TVD is usually around $10K more and the RCF FSW/TE is usually the most expensive especially as they are pretty new. There are many people I know who take theirs to the track and are quite happy. One even wins competition in his class in a near-stock RCF and placed 10th overall out of 50 cars. He told me he just runs a square setup on the wheels with stickier wheels.

3. Where are you located? I am in Calgary, AB. I explained the three trim levels available in all of the years from 2015 - present.

4. Have had my RCF for 5+ years now since 2017. Zero issues. Although, I only have 19,000 KM because I only drive it during spring/summer and it is a hobby car. My IS350 F-Sport and RX450h are the daily commuting cars, but never any issues with the RCF.

bcrdukes

Hi 05RollaXRS,

Thanks for the thorough reply. Please see my response below in the same order to your reply.

1. No budget yet. I'm open to buying new or pre-owned. We were on the verge of getting a 2021 Lexus IS350 or ES350 but decided to hold out due to lack of availability (at the time) and no absolute need to switch cars. We drive a 2017 Toyota Corolla iM with just under 90,000KM on the odometer with zero issues. To sell this car or to trade it in for something else now would be silly given the economic situation and a looming recession.

2. In a perfect world, I'd like to get an RC or RC-F without a sunroof. Ironic given my Boxster is a convertible. I just don't like sunroofs; Never used them and never card for them. Forgive me, but what is TVD (Torque vector differential?) and FSW? Are the seats any different among the various trims including the non-F RCs? I did see the thread on the forum regarding the fellow who took 10th place overall which is pretty impressive.

3. I'm in Toronto but split my time in Vancouver due to work and family, but mostly Toronto. I'm asking the question about allocations because I understand the RC-F is rare and I'm curious whether Toyota/Lexus Canada limits production numbers to the Canadian market, specific to sales territories or not. The perfect example of this is Toyota's GR Corolla.

I ask this question because I've been in the Porsche world for a while now and I am tired of the games the dealers play. I won't get into specific details but you can't buy a specific car even if you had the money. Nevermind the used market. I'd like to replace the Boxster with a 996 or 997 but the market is out to lunch and I don't see it coming down anytime soon. I sold my 996 a number of years ago to move across the country. That was a stupid decision but such is life.

4. Thanks for confirming. I suspect as much any Toyota/Lexus product will live up to its reputation. I'd love to hold on to a car for everyday use and the occasional track day.

Extra question regarding preventative maintenance schedule: Other than the usual oil and fluid changes and wear/tear items (i.e. spark plugs, brake pads, wipers etc,) does the RC or RC-F require kind of unique servicing regime or special procedures/tools at the dealership or can out-of-warranty vehicles be taken care of at any independent garage? Thanks again!

Yri

I do know the spark plugs seem to be quite the job to replace, lots of stuff in the way. Other than that it seems like most stuff is easy to get to.
Also, the RC F comes with good engine cooling equipment from factory, so cooling should never be an issue. I'd say if you're gonna thrash it around on track go for the Torsen, I'm not sure how the TVD deals with extended track temperatures

bcrdukes

Thanks, Yri.

I expect that replacement of spark plugs on a V8 is never a piece of cake and some jail cell grunt labour but only performed at specific intervals, or whichever comes first.

05RollaXRS

2 - I think you are pretty new to the RC/RCF as you are using both RC and RCF in your queries. RC and RCF are pretty much 70% different cars. RC is more of an equivalent of the IS. As a matter of fact, RC350 F-Sport feels similar to my IS350 F-Sport with the same powertrain and 311 HP, but a different chassis. It is mildly more sporty than an IS350 F-Sport. RCF however, feels very different since it has different body panels, different suspension, powertrain, differential (5.0 Liter V8, 472 HP) etc. The chassis is also strengthened for more rigidity. RCF was meant to be an M3/M4 competitor while the RC350/IS350 are like the 335/340/440i competitors. Hope that makes sense. Seats are different for the RCF vs the standard RC. The standard RC has the same seats my IS350 F-Sport has.

Also, RCF without moonroof in Canada would either be the Carbon Fiber/TVD package or the TE/FSW RCF. All standard RCFs have moonroof in Canada with the LSD diff. See pictures of my RCF below and an RCF TE/FSW below with the carbon fiber roof.

Torque vectoring differential (TVD) is like the Porsche Torque Vectoring as might know more about Porsches. Essentially, the differential can split torque side-to-side infinitely in the rear wheels even sending 100% of the torque under braking, accelerating through the turn or carrying speed through the turn to get the car to carry more speed through the turn and to minimize understeer. FSW/TE is the Fuji Speedway or Track Edition RCF have LSD, though like the standard RCF. Only the CF/TVD RCF has TVD.

3 - RCF is a niche market car. That is why it is very rare as they know very few people would buy it. Ontario is a bigger market so you might find more options, but in Calgary, it took me 10 months to find my perfect RCF. There are a lot more RC since they are much cheaper and have AWD with a more llivable/comfortable drive.

martkat

I think I'll be following this post as I am looking into tracking my newly purchased 2017 RC F. My friend that tracks his M4 GTS will be my instructor and he really, really would like for me to add belts to accept HANS so that he can wear his gear and not be worn out by trying to support himself with the door handle and my center console if I were to stay with the factory 3-point belts.

Do you think you'd be upgrading your belts for your RC F?

bcrdukes

Thank you for catching and calling this part out about my liberal use of the RC and RCF. I was not aware that the regular RC and the RCF had different chassis'; I was under the impression they were the same chassis, just a different trim package altogether. Appreciate the detailed explanation behind that; I never would have known otherwise as I haven't dived very deep into this territory yet.

Truth be told, I've seen only a small handful of RCFs on the road and every time I see one, it captures my attention. Not to mention, I follow the Vasser Sullivan Lexus race team who is known to have competed very successful campaigns in the IMSA program. There is a follow in our neighbourhood who stops by to visit his family members who has a white RCF and it is stunning. I've never been able to catch him in person to ask him about his car unfortunately. I'm really looking forward to seeing one up close and personal and having the ability to test drive one.

Trunk space - How is it for a vehicle of this pedigree? I would use this vehicle for small road trips and be able to pack a few bags or carry-on luggage, a cooler or two and whatnot for the occasional track day or out-of-town jaunt. Thanks in advance!

Thanks for this. Feel free to piggyback off my thread as this would be useful information to me as well.

Yes, ideally I would like to be able to use a harness and if possible, a HANS device. I don't run them in my Boxster now but have hopped into instructor vehicles or folks with race/track-prepped vehicles using a harness and it makes a huge difference. I would also be curious how much headroom there is when one puts on a helmet. As it stands, my Boxster has been forgiving in terms of having a helmet on with the roof up but could also use more clearance for those "oops" moments when getting in/out of the car.

I'd like your feedback on the seats when you hit the track with your instructor. Would be curious if there is any need to swap out or to upgrade the seats. As mentioned above, I've never seen an RCF up close so I'm not sure how engaging the factory seats are. I get the impression they will hold you in for the most part for when it comes to serious turns at high speeds, I suspect it may leave something to be desired

Upon doing my preliminary research here on the forums, I found a thread where someone mentioned a harness would not work properly with the factory seats and would require a harness bar or possibly even a seat upgrade. I can't find the thread (I'll update this post when I find it - Found it: https://www.clublexus.com/forums/rc-...s-options.html) but it's floating around somewhere on the forum. Without having done extensive research, I would be curious to know what the aftermarket support is for the RCF. By the way, if I may ask, where is your home track?

05RollaXRS

I think you misunderstood. I did not say RCF and RC have a different chassis. I said, the RC feels similar to IS as they have the same powertrain, interior and have similar suspension components. Though, RC and IS have a different chassis where RC is a bit more livelier from my experience. RC and RCF share the same base chassis, but RCF was strengthened for more rigidity. The RCF and RC still are 70% different because the suspension components are different, body panels are different, the powertrain is different, the interior has some significant differences. Hope that makes sense.

Trunk space is quite decent. I can put a baby stroller in the back and even groceries etc. I would say, trunk space is similar to my IS350 F-Sport.

bcrdukes

Ah, I stand corrected. Appreciate the clarification on the bit about the chassis and differences between the RC and the RCF. Consider me educated on that subject.

I'll have to stop by my local Lexus dealers to take a look at the cars sometime soon to get a better understanding of what the art of the possible is with the RCF. I don't expect to throw in an entire set of wheels in the back but I've managed to use every inch of space in my spartan Boxster for track days packing in chairs, coolers, track day gear and whatnot. What I haven't been able to do is pack an EZup tent/canopy for those hot summer days.

Do the rear seats in the RCF fold down or have a pass-thru in the middle?

05RollaXRS

One of the things I mentioned about strengthening, is the rear section of the chassis. There is a 10-point chassis brace (steel in the RCF and carbon fiber in the FSW/TE RCF) that is bolted on behind the rear seat. As a result of that, the rear seats cannot fold down. However, there is a pass through.

bcrdukes

Neat that it has a pass thru. It would make sense that the seats would not fold down given the chassis brace. This was an annoying bit in my old E36 M3 sedan where there was no pass thru. The littlest things make all the difference.

martkat

I've seen pictures of others tracking their RC F with a helmet, factory 3-points and there doesn't seem to be any issues. Options are always available but budget money and willingness to modify the factory interior are my limiting factors.

That forum link was my recent post as I continue my search for harness options.

The track closest to me is Barber Motorsports Park in Leeds, AL (Birmingham, AL area).

brendanf

I haven't tracked any other cars so no comparision but when I do track, it is with the local Porsche group (PTN) at CTMP.

The car is HEAVY so don't expect it to corner like your Porsche. I would highly recommend getting some wider tires all around as the factory sizes have a bit of stretch to them causing the sidewalls to roll over a bit during high G turns. .

1. I would try and find a newer model year with an updated info-tainment. Im not sure which year they upgraded it but the early versions of it are 'okay' but many people complain about the interface. It isn't the end of the world and works fine once you get used to it but Lexus did make improvements to it later.

2. You do not need the track/performance package. I have (2015 model year) with the performance package and TVD and the TVD while 'neat' doesn't add that much improvement IMO. I find it does a better job of making the car rotate in Normal mode VS any other of the modes when going around a track. You also have to be over 4k RPM to get it really do anything. Lower RPMS the system seems to not activate it, but as you are aware, your typically downshifting with some light braking prior to your turn in so the revs should be high enough anyway but you'll want to apply some power through the entire turn instead of just after the apex.

Some RCFs have had the valley plate leak which is a known issue on the IS-Fs, otherwise the car is extremely reliable. #1 comment I get at the track from the BMW guys is always "I had an IS-F and I wish I never sold it".

For tracking purposes, I highly recommend upgrading the tires as I mentioned, and upgrading the lower control arm bushings. The OEM LCA bushing is very soft and allows a lot of deflection causing the inside of the tires to wear pre-maturely.

Ah, the old admin fee of $150k for a GT3 and you basically have to wait, and wait, and wait and hope the dealer gives you an allocation. I hear you. I'd love a GT3 or a GT4 but the prices are nuts-o, even used. The 991.1 with the questionable engine with the warranty about to run out on the early ones should be relatively 'cheap' considering it is potentially a ticking time bomb but like you mentioned, $30k for an engine. The 996/997 GT3 from what I hear are super reliable but too "raw" for track duty as they don't have the nanny tech to keep you from going sideways. LOL

Actually the plugs are not hard to do. The back one on the passenger side involves taking out the battery to get to it but otherwise they are all very accessible.

How tall are you? I am 5'10" and have no head clearance issues with a helmet. Occasionally I do bounce the side of my helmet off the grab handle but otherwise no clearance issues. As for a HANS device they have those hybrid ones where you can wear a really tight chest harness and hook the helmet to that. It will achieve the same effect if you don't want to go with a full 5 point harness.

As for the seats, they are leather so expect to slip and slide a bit in them depending on your choice of clothing. I wouldn't mind upgrading the seat for a better bucket for track use but then you lose the heating/ventilation, plus also have to get the air bag light disabled. I know someone who successfully managed all this and it made a big difference but if your not going wild around the track I don't think you will notice. Some people have a product called a G-lock (i think??) that allows you to cinch down factory belts more tightly. They aren't made anymore but sometimes they come up used on eBay.

It is huge. Plenty of room. I bring all my track day crap plus 4 25L jerry cans of gas with me to the track.

Where in Toronto are you?

Picture of me heading down T1 at Mosport

bcrdukes

How are PTN track days? I do HPDE with the PCA UCR group.

As I would imagine, this will be a huge difference compared to a tiny 986 Boxster. Which tires do these cars come with stock and what are you running on the track? Is it safe to assume your car does double duty on the same set of tires both on the street and track?

I got some cheapy Federal summers but switching over to Hankook RS4 this season.

This is good to know and I will keep this in mind.

Thank you. I did a trim comparison and when going to the track edition, you lose out on a lot of the comfort creature items.

How long have you owned your RCF for?

Is your RCF upgraded with the LCA bushings? If yes, which ones did you get? Or are you running the stock suspension otherwise?

Hahaha so you know how the game works as well (I assume yes since you track with the PTN group)

My Boxster is pretty spartan and it has the same "feel" as the 996, albeit lighter in so many ways and nowhere near as much power. I'd love to get back into a 996/997 NA or GT3 but prices are just so ridiculous. I've never driven a "modern" car around the track so nanny aids / tech are foreign to me other than ABS.

That doesn't sound too bad! When I think of V8s, I think of the Audi A6/A8 or the Audi S cars while holding my vomit in.

I'm 5'7. Are you using the Hybrid HANS by I think Simpson? I'm still using my factory 3-point belt in the Boxster.

I'm slipping and sliding in my Boxster and have done ride-alongs with instructors who have a bucket sea and always keep thinking how I want it but two seats and labour can cost more than the damn car haha

Wow, okay, that is massive. My typical haul in the Boxster is a chair or two (fold out camping style) a cooler or two for food/drinks/snacks, my helmet and any other crap or gear. I can't fit in jerry cans in the Boxster and relegated to buying as at the track.

I am in Mississauga south not far from Square One!

Very nice! That RV in the background is often at our PCA UCR track days. Looks like he also tracks with the PTN guys.

Are you doing any track days this season?