rx93

I'm no long owner of rx300. Last Saturday, I was heading to nearest lexus dealer and ask them check for oil sludge/gelling. On the way, I saw toyota dealership and I pull in and check see any promtion for end of year sale(since I know my second child coming soon, I always want to get minivan). I never thought they accept my offer, invoice - 11k trade-in(kkb value) plus 0% finance.

I think switch from dino oil to synthetic may caused 1qt short. I checked the oil pan and realize some leaking from gasket, but didn't find anything on the floor. So far, I was very happy with 7 yrs ownership of RX300.
Here is my record/info about RX300:
- bought it september of 1999
- oil change interval 5K mil or 4mo-6mo
- 30K and 60K service from dealership
- both headlight replaced under warranty(moisture buildup)
- replace "D" indicator light under warranty
- replace rear wipe arm under warranty
- fixed the interior noise by dealer, i think they put some plastic/rubber to fill the cabinet door gap.
- original tire wear out around 30K, then Michelin Cross Terrain still 6/32 left
- New break pad around 60K(yes, 60k from original pad)
- New battery @60K
- noise from belt worst during winter
- squezze steering column during winter
- drain n fill ATF around 60K - diy
- switch to synethic around 60K - diy

Carver

I've read that they will do it for free and I've read they charge for it. Is it up to individual dealers or is there a blanket Lexus policy? My car has 54K and perfect records but I want to have it checked...especially after seeing pics of that Toyota 3L with 8700 miles on it (was that here or LOC?).

I don't believe this is something to fool around with and I don't want to pay Lexus 300 bucks to do it so I need some ammunition before hitting them up for the inspection.

salimshah

The question you posted here was in another thread aswell.

My view is that some one has to be paid for its labor and parts. The question is then was the check necessary or not? Lexus says they are warranteing the engine against slude (with maintainance condition).

8700 miles picture ...
I should not be the one to doubt its authenticity, but the condition of the components (rust etc) for sure says no TLC was given.

Once you are the owner (you have the RX) (hopefully without gel inside), your options are to keep or sell. If you keep it, continue with regular maintainance and know that you have the warranty behind it.

Salim

Carver

So, there is no formal inspection program through Lexus. Some people beat it out of them and some pay. Sounds like a plan.

LexFather

Every RX owner should have gotten a notice in the mail about this issue and put it in their glovebox.

Honestly, the issue was with people who DIDN'T change their oil for extended periods and had an issue. I have no sludge issue in my 92 ES or 99RX, none at all. Change the oil every 5k miles.

TunedRX300

People, not just Toyota/Lexus owners, neglect oil changes, but most cars do not develop sludge buildups. Certainly no one ever expected Toyota engines, with a bullet-proof reliability reputation, to be on the sludge list with VW, Chrysler etc...

It is a pity that rx93 could not let Lexus to inspect his 80K RX300 for oil sludge before he sold it. He changed oil for 4 months/5K but reported abnormal amount of oil burning (1/2 to 1 quart) for his last two oil changes.
If you hang around BITOG long enough, you will see many independent UOAs that show even Lexus' severe recommended oil change interval is not enough due to 1mz-fe design flaw, if one uses dino oil.
Just image after 8 year sludge warranty expires, one finds the engine is burning oil, puffing out blue smoke...you can show all those 4 months/ 5K oil change receipts but Lexus has no obligation to pick up the tap.

salimshah

I can understand your view point where you want reassurance with no-cost to you,

BUT

Why should the manufacturer pay for an un-necessary inspection, when they say they will stand behind their product.


Tuned RX has point about what happens when the period/miles run out? Nothing is warranted/gauranteed for ever. When i plunked the money Lexus only promised 60K miles. What milage do we expect out of Lexus 150k, 200K or 500K?

Salim

Carver

If the manufacturer has gone to the extent of setting up a program to replace engines because of a known flaw, I don't think it's asking too much to find out if my engine is affected prior to a failure, perhaps out of the extended warranty.

I don't expect the car to last forever but if it blows at 80K because Lexus couldn't be bothered to check it at 54K I think I will have a right to be upset. I think we can agree, under normal circumstances this engine, with maintenance, will go beyond 80K.

This is like being bitten by a rattler in the Lexus dealership and being told not everyone dies from it so we don't feel it necessary to have you examined because only a certain percentage will kickoff anyway but we'll gladly pay for your funeral if you do unless it takes a really long time for you to die and we can blame old age.

Lexus has an interesting POV about this.

Lil4X

The oil gelling issue has been vastly overblown to the point of becoming an urban legend. Yes, it was an issue in a very few cases, particularly when the 1mz-fe engine was operated primarily on short trips, never reaching operating temp for an extended time, often in a humid climate (moisture accelerates the sludging process), and then primarily to '99 and early '00 engines.

On that same issue of moisture forming sludge, it is possible that this engine might have suffered a head gasket failure that permitted small amounts of coolant to enter the oil passages or the cylinder(s), contaminating the oil system with ccoolant. An oil analysis would help point to the source.

The photos above are extremely suspect, as others have noted - the badly rusted exhaust manifold studs, pitted bolts, etc, would seem to indicate an engine exposed to the weather for a extended period of time, as in a very high mileage vehicle, or possibly in a junkyard. A LOT more documentation is needed to validate those photos.

Meanwhile, if you are concerned about your early 1mz-fe, pull the valve covers, drop the pan, give the engine a good inspection and cleaning, then switch to synthetic oil and change both oil and filter regularly.

TunedRX300

Most of us care not only the time when we own/lease the car, but also how much we can sell it. Longer warranty will prevent resell value decrease due to buyers' legitimate concern of a major design flaw, which could lead to big out of warranty repair $.
I found this article from Center for Auto Safety, it advocates http://www.autosafety.org/article.php?scid=150&did=566
8 year of sludge warranty is better than original powertrain, but it falls way short of Hyundai's 10 year 100K, let alone 10 year 120K.

salimshah

Discussion may be taking a turn away from oil gel issue but still is loosely related.

Lexus does provide the 100k warranty with a increased cost of ownership. I am guessing at a price of 1600 to 2200. I prefer the option to purchase vs built in to price.

I am with all who wish the price was lower, but wish is not reality. The ivoice or suggested retail (different numbers) price is based on lot of things but at the end is based on what the cosumers would pay. There can be no denying that thar the RX brand is the most popular brand.

These are mt thoughts and Lexus corp may tottaly disagree with them:

Once production starts there are three catagories of problems.
Statistically proven [drive ligt indicator etc]
unexplainable (cant narrow down to the failing part) but statistically low (tranny, etc)
Problems aggravated under certain conditions, based on limitation of design. (engine oil gel)

I personally think the right solution to item three would be to assure owners that the manufacturer will not abandon the customer, but provide extneded warranty for free to cover it. Although 100K mile number can be debated ... should be 150k or 200k or what?

Salim