Da Hapa

I did feel a slight tug on the FWD RX300 I drove and I can definitely feel it in the FWD RX330's that I've had as loaners.

Although I live in Sunny So. Cal. I was happy that my parents bought AWD with the rear LSD (we bought our RX from my parents). It doesn't rain all that much here but when it does the roads are for crap and the AWD is rock steady.

I have also taken the truck snowboaring several times and it performs like a champ.

I have to imagine the FWD gets at least 1-2mpg better in the city and highway and in today's world of $2.50/gallon gas (at least here in So Cal) that might make a difference to you. Personally, we avg. 19mpg in mixed driving and for a permanent awd truck with all the goodies we have I think that aint half bad.

Lil4X

After driving my 300 AWD for three years the lease expired, and as no 330s with AWD were being imported into the sunbelt states at the time, I settled for a FWD, loaded. The FWD is a little squirrelly under heavy applications of power from a low-speed suburban corner, particularly when the TRAC steps in and snatches the steering wheel left, then right, then left - to the accompaniment of squealing tires and thudding brakes. Wet roads only magnify the ham-handedness of the TRAC. While the RX is never going to be mistaken for a sports car, there is no substitute for AWD in spirited driving or bad weather. Powering out of a wet corner requires attention and finesse with the FWD. The AWD? Point and punch!

On the interstate, there is no discernable difference, but for the slight mileage penalty of the AWD. After a year, I miss that AWD - it was completely smooth and effortless - much more in keeping with the Lexus image. If you have to give up the RSES or the ML to get the AWD, do it and don’t look back. Next time I'll hold out for the AWD even if I have to drive the mommy van for six months.

pfsacer

Thanks all, AWD it is going to be for sure.

DURSO

I second that.....It was my determining factor to going AWD as well

MellonC00

Let me offer a different oppinion. I drove an RX300 FWD last year until I sold it and bought an RX
Silversport with AWD. So I think I can comment fairly on both types. BTW. my FWD RX didn't have TRAC.

With FWD you do have to be "careful' if you are "punching" it in rain or accelerating out of a corner. AWD RX never needs any attention. Just give it gas and go. However, the benefit of AWD start disappearing fast once you reach speeds over 20 MPH. I feel the weight penalty of approxmmately 250LBS has negative effects on handling. Just think. Its like you are driving a FWD car with a linebacker sitting next to you.

To offset this penalty, AWD has gearing that is a little lower. Thus, when are traveling around 60 mph, your AWD car is turning 2450 rpm where as your FWD is only turning around 2180 RPM (manual has the specific figures). So there is additional engine noise you have to deal with. Around LA where I travel around 75 mph on the freeway, there is noticeable difference with the engine noise.

The second problem is handling in the "twisties." As you can tell by my signature line below, my AWD is the Silversport model with stiffer suspension, however, I tell you based on comparing the two models, my non-silversport model with FWD handled better than the AWD silversport. There is an easy explanation for this. Even when you adjust for the weight difference with bigger shocks, there is no escaping the additional weight. Some years ago, Car and Driver had a feature called "best handling cars over 30K". In tthat test, the M3 beat out the Ferrari Testarossa to take the first place. The main different CandD attirubted, of course, is the 400 lbs wieght difference between the two cars. As someone who drives like a maniac on twisty road to get my "fix", there is a slight advantage to having a lower weight car.

The third problem comes from braking. Yes, I know that the AWD models have bigger brake pads in the rear but it still doesn't compensate for the weighty feel of addtional heft. So while the braking distance may be similar, the feel of braking from FWD's ligher model is not duplicated in the AWD.

Lastly, there is the driveline drag. This one is hard to explain. There is somewhat of a drag or feeling of gentle pull by having a center differential. This is a different feeling than, say, driving an MDX or a Pilot with AWD (those cars does not have viscous coupling - they have a disengaged clutch pack that engages based on need). You can feel it when you take your foot off the accelerator and let the car slow down by itself. The AWD model definitely slows much quicker.

If someone can make AWD without the weight penalty, I would consider it. But driving my car in a warm climate like SoCal, I'd think twice about getting an AWD. Of course, if you like to look "cool" turning an urban street corner while accelerating the heck out of your car with an AWD, it's your choice. Just realize that better driving skills can compensate for the same thing the AWD was supposed to help with you.

pfsacer

MellonC00, thanks for the very clear explanation, you got me wondering.

Since you have ample experience with both, how would you describe the Torque Steer.

Light, medium, tenacious.

Some cars I have driven with FWD, have the tendency to really pull from site to site when you (really) take off in a straighline.

Example : Nissan Maxima and similar high HP front drivers.

The turns I can live with and I am not going to use the RX as a trackcar (I'll wait for the new GS for that)

Since the RX looking at weight and HP, cannot be directly compared to the Maxima I would like to know if the Torque Steer in a straight line could become irritating

Appreciate your feedback

MellonC00

(this comment not directed at pfsacer - just the general public)

One more comment about torque steer. It's pretty silly that you guys are talking about this car with torque steer. With the kind of driving that people do around town with an RX, you won't find much torque steer. , I'd say that on a scale of 1 to 10 with Volvo R60 being the worst and Audi A6 being the best, RX FWD ranks around 3. Also, the kind of torque steer that you guys are referring to is what I call "teenage" torque steer coming from dangerously rounding off urban streets while giving huge amounts of gas. In a serious dirivng situation where you are correctly doing 7 or 8/10 of the lateral G's, you won't feel much torque steer in this car. In fact, both of your hands will be on the steering wheel at 9 and 3 o'clck position looking for the next apex.

Rather than investing in an AWD or 22 inch rims, may I suggest a two day course at Bob Bondurant School of High Performance Driving School? http://www.bondurant.com/pages/home.html

You will have 10 times more fun with your RX than having AWD.

MellonC00

This is in response to Pfsacer.

For me, both nissan and volvos have high torque steer. Both have torque peaks that come up pretty early in the rpm. I think volvo's peak is only around 1900 RPM due to the turbo charger. Not sure about nissan.

Don't worry RX is no where near those cars.

pfsacer

MellonC00,

Thanks for ranking the RX, problem I have here (Aruba) the dealer has no car to testdrive.

Last time I was in the States I drove an AWD, but never had the opportunity to drive the FWD.

I agree driven normally (8/10) you should not have a problem with a ranking at 3
I'll just drive it till my new GS-V8 comes in

After that my wive will take it instead of her Exploder (sorry Explorer)

Thanks again

vonburkleo

Not sure why some people think Torque steer only reveals itself with irresponsible driving styles...but I would agree that torque steer tends to really only manifest itself at street driving speeds.

Again, I find it most noticeable when making 90 degree turns while giving the vehicle gas (say, making a left turn from a green light (one of the trickier things to do in LA) or just basic quick accelerating in a straight line up to about 20-30 mph.

I test drove both extensively and I prefer the AWD. Your opionion may vary, especially if you are coming from a FWD drive car... but don't believe it's only noticeable if you drive like a lunatic...

MellonC00

BTW. If you have any dirt trails around your area, you might realize some benefits from the AWD. I took mine up to a dirt road in SoCal one day and had a blast!!!

rdollie

Ummm...what? The Volvo S60R is an AWD car and doesn't have torque steer (it does have the only performance oriented AWD system that distributes power based on acceleration though.)
Perhaps you meant some other FWD version of a Volvo? I've driven all of the current Volvos and unless they're misaligned (which is quite common for them when they come off the ship for some reason) they don't really have torque steer problems. If you want torque steer try a Saab Aero from about 2002 or earlier - that's torque steer.

Thanks.

MellonC00

I think I had the model name mistaken. It was a 2001 volve S60... my father has that car. It has a turbo charger with very low end torque. You have to keep the wheel really firm to go around turns... especially entrance ramps to highways.

fyi. did you know you can have torque steer with AWD cars? As long as there is some torque going to the front wheels there can theoretically be torque steer. A rear drive cars like Bimmers, however, would be exempted from that.

My argument is that getting the AWD RX just because of torque steer from FWD doesn't make too much sense. If you have some fun dirt trails around you or have that impossible hill to climb during winter time however..... AWD makes huge sense, I think. (snow tires too)

pfsacer

Thanks all for your feed-back.

Ordered my RX330 yesterday and got a great deal locally (Aruba)

Ordered RX330-AWD Breakwater Blue Metallic, Black Leather, Wood steering wheel, HID headlamps, Power Rear Door, Sunroof, Additional Wood Trim, 18" Rims, Rainsensing Wipers, Mark Levinson Stereo upgrade (free of charge added by dealer)

Should have the car by end of July

HarrierAWD

That's possible with part-time AWD drive system, such as the one on the old Acura MDX. It uses the front wheels only until it detects a slip, then sends some power rearward. Acura has since modified the system so that it uses all 4 wheels for "lead-foot launch" to eliminate torque steer.

No torque steer on my AWD RX300. The RX300 sends power equitably to all 4 wheels, all the time, until it detects a slip then cuts back power to that wheel. Not sure how the new RX330 AWD system works.