Toyota highlander and RX 330
03-10-05, 11:57 AM
#31
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here's theory#2 then...
OK - theory#2:
The RX330 had the 3.3 liter drivetrain about 8 months before the Highlander got it. When I took delivery of my RX330, the highlander hadn't even announced they were upgrading to the 3.3 engine.
So Toyota had a chance a few extra months to apply any TSBs or unpublished fixes to the drivetrain on the Highlander since they had 8 months of lead time with the RX330.
(translation - Lexus owners beta tested that drivetrain for Toyota)
The RX330 had the 3.3 liter drivetrain about 8 months before the Highlander got it. When I took delivery of my RX330, the highlander hadn't even announced they were upgrading to the 3.3 engine.
So Toyota had a chance a few extra months to apply any TSBs or unpublished fixes to the drivetrain on the Highlander since they had 8 months of lead time with the RX330.
(translation - Lexus owners beta tested that drivetrain for Toyota)
03-10-05, 11:58 AM
#32
Lexus Champion
Originally Posted by Lexusfreak
There you go blue! I agree & that's my whole point to this 
Problems come out of any plant sometimes no matter what country the vehicle is built in. Robot's mostly put these vehicles together with the help of humans......Japanese or Canadian makes no difference.
If the RX plant in Japan was so great & the RX (or any Lexus model for that matter) was so well put together (read: Perfect) these forums would be almost empty with only comments of praise & questions of maintenance & colours.
Problems come out of any plant sometimes no matter what country the vehicle is built in. Robot's mostly put these vehicles together with the help of humans......Japanese or Canadian makes no difference. If the RX plant in Japan was so great & the RX (or any Lexus model for that matter) was so well put together (read: Perfect) these forums would be almost empty with only comments of praise & questions of maintenance & colours.
That's just one car. I know someone who had a Dodge Neon with zero defect for 6 years, even though it is rated one of the least reliable cars in the market."Teething" problem cannot be used as an excuse for RX330's decline in quality and reliability. I believe that I have refuted that claim by using the new-gen Highlander as an example. It has excellent reliability rating and it is built in the same Kyushu plant as the Japanese-built RX330. Apparently the "non-Japanese-built" (Hope this is more politically correct.)
RX330 is bringing down the rating. No improvement can be made unless people first acknowledge there is a problem that needs fixing. I believe the "non-Japanese" plant will eventually be up to the usual Toyota standard, like the Kentucky plant. It's just not there yet. Once the Kaizen approach is fully applied, it can do wonders for its workforce.
Last edited by HarrierAWD; 03-10-05 at 12:19 PM.
03-10-05, 12:08 PM
#33
Lexus Champion
Originally Posted by blue_rx330
OK - theory#2:
The RX330 had the 3.3 liter drivetrain about 8 months before the Highlander got it. When I took delivery of my RX330, the highlander hadn't even announced they were upgrading to the 3.3 engine.
So Toyota had a chance a few extra months to apply any TSBs or unpublished fixes to the drivetrain on the Highlander since they had 8 months of lead time with the RX330.
(translation - Lexus owners beta tested that drivetrain for Toyota)
The RX330 had the 3.3 liter drivetrain about 8 months before the Highlander got it. When I took delivery of my RX330, the highlander hadn't even announced they were upgrading to the 3.3 engine.
So Toyota had a chance a few extra months to apply any TSBs or unpublished fixes to the drivetrain on the Highlander since they had 8 months of lead time with the RX330.
(translation - Lexus owners beta tested that drivetrain for Toyota)
Also note that the powertrain came from different sources. The "non-Japanese-built" (again, trying to be PC here.)
RX330 get its powertrain from a Toyota plant in the "Appalachian Mountains." The new-gen Highlander and Japanese-built RX330 get its powertrain from Japan of course.I believe Toyota's game plan is to eventually build all the 3.3L engine only in the North America since it's offered in North American market only. Europe and Asia get a 3.0L engine. Of course rumor has it that the RX will get the 3.5L engine to get back in the horsepower race with Infiniti and Acura.
03-10-05, 01:29 PM
#34
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Tranny TSB
>>Though I don't think the tranny fix was out before the new Highlander came out. Some in CL also claimed continued problems after the fix was applied.
================
Make : LEXUS Model : RX330 Year : 2004
Manufacturer : TOYOTA MOTOR NORTH AMERICA, INC.
Service Bulletin Num : TC00503 Date of Bulletin: AUG 11, 2003
NHTSA Item Number: 10003558
Component: POWER TRAIN
Summary:
ECM CALIBRATION SHIFTING ENHANCEMENT. *TT
================
The shifting enhancement went public in early August 2003. I'm fairly sure August was the same month or a month before the 2004 Highlander went on sale to the public with the 3.3 drivetrain.
================
Make : LEXUS Model : RX330 Year : 2004
Manufacturer : TOYOTA MOTOR NORTH AMERICA, INC.
Service Bulletin Num : TC00503 Date of Bulletin: AUG 11, 2003
NHTSA Item Number: 10003558
Component: POWER TRAIN
Summary:
ECM CALIBRATION SHIFTING ENHANCEMENT. *TT
================
The shifting enhancement went public in early August 2003. I'm fairly sure August was the same month or a month before the 2004 Highlander went on sale to the public with the 3.3 drivetrain.
03-10-05, 10:48 PM
#35
Pole Position
Originally Posted by HarrierAWD
Don't get so excited buddy. That's just one car.
I know someone who had a Dodge Neon with zero defect for 6 years, even though it is rated one of the least reliable cars in the market.
That's just one car. I know someone who had a Dodge Neon with zero defect for 6 years, even though it is rated one of the least reliable cars in the market.
"non Japanese plant" lol 
Well said krpster & I agree with you!
But yet others accused you of "personal attacks"? But yet you get on the ignore list? 
03-11-05, 06:52 AM
#36
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Originally Posted by HarrierAWD
Not to hurt the Canadian pride, but I pay attention to the product, not how well the factory looked. FWIW, the Saturn and Corvette plants look fantastic, but the cars' quality & reliability are PoS.
Browse the RX forum in the past, you'll see many posts about performance mods, appearance package, big size wheels, etc. After the Canadian RX330 arrived, the RX forum has turned into whining sessions about tranny shift, rattles, suspension noise, etc.
Toyota/Lexus manages its quality control by the Japanese Kaizen approach. In business management terms, the Kaizen approach dictates that the quality of the workers must improve first, then the product or service. It will take a while for Canadian workers to buy into Kaizen. There's no shame in that. When Toyota first built Camry in Kentucky, it took about 3 years to get the workers in line with the management. Toyota obviously don't want to push the workers too hard too soon. They don't want to see a repeat of the "Gung Ho" movie where cultures clash.
Browse the RX forum in the past, you'll see many posts about performance mods, appearance package, big size wheels, etc. After the Canadian RX330 arrived, the RX forum has turned into whining sessions about tranny shift, rattles, suspension noise, etc.
Toyota/Lexus manages its quality control by the Japanese Kaizen approach. In business management terms, the Kaizen approach dictates that the quality of the workers must improve first, then the product or service. It will take a while for Canadian workers to buy into Kaizen. There's no shame in that. When Toyota first built Camry in Kentucky, it took about 3 years to get the workers in line with the management. Toyota obviously don't want to push the workers too hard too soon. They don't want to see a repeat of the "Gung Ho" movie where cultures clash.
When the first Yaris came out of the new plant, they had minor but real assembly and quality problems. It took a year or so to get the french plant up to the level of the Japanese production. Now problems are behind us and the quality is of a top level.
It is not a matter of skills, culture or method. It is about launching a new industry project and this can't be done in a day. Moving the production of a car from one plant to another one is a difficult exercise. If on the top of this the model is a new model, you get the exercise even more difficult .the company succeeding with no mistakes would be very lucky
03-11-05, 02:04 PM
#37
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Originally Posted by TED_FR
It is not a matter of skills, culture or method. It is about launching a new industry project and this can't be done in a day. Moving the production of a car from one plant to another one is a difficult exercise. If on the top of this the model is a new model, you get the exercise even more difficult .the company succeeding with no mistakes would be very lucky
03-11-05, 06:03 PM
#38
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Originally Posted by blue_rx330
OK - theory#2:
The RX330 had the 3.3 liter drivetrain about 8 months before the Highlander got it. When I took delivery of my RX330, the highlander hadn't even announced they were upgrading to the 3.3 engine.
So Toyota had a chance a few extra months to apply any TSBs or unpublished fixes to the drivetrain on the Highlander since they had 8 months of lead time with the RX330.
(translation - Lexus owners beta tested that drivetrain for Toyota)
The RX330 had the 3.3 liter drivetrain about 8 months before the Highlander got it. When I took delivery of my RX330, the highlander hadn't even announced they were upgrading to the 3.3 engine.
So Toyota had a chance a few extra months to apply any TSBs or unpublished fixes to the drivetrain on the Highlander since they had 8 months of lead time with the RX330.
(translation - Lexus owners beta tested that drivetrain for Toyota)
On the topic of assembly quality @ TMMC, in the 03 Corolla and Matrix which are built on the same line, the JD power score was very good for Corolla but very bad for Matrix.
This proves it is not TMMC but engineering problems when the car was designed.
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