CDNROCKIES

BMW has improved the most and is still has 37% more issues. Audi and MB are not even up to the industry average. 72.5% and 79% more issues than Lexus.

Quoted directly from my originial post. Why you continue to post mis-information is beyond me?

The BMW actually had 164 problems, not 150. I'm curious to know where 37% is not significant when referring to data. Now it appears you're only focusing on the one German brand that has made the greatest improvements. Look again at the numbers for MB and Audi....they aren't even close, although you can argue that they have improved.

What does whatever car I bought have to do with anything?
I actually drove American cars prior to my Lexus'. I was one of the fortunate few who had no major issues with my American brands. Does that mean I should come in here and try to tell everyone that GFC are as reliable as Lexus is? Obviously not, and the same applies to the German vehicles.

I have never once stated that the Germans haven't improved. They have, just like Lexus is improving on the performance/handling side.

Again, though, I will remind you that you started this discussion on the RX:

If you would like to try to argue that a MB ML, BMW X5 or Audi Q7 is as reliable as the RX, I can provide you with boatloads of data to prove otherwise.

The G Man

44 more problem in a 100 cars in 3 years is not much more un-reliable in my book. With that said, I am sure you can sleep better at night knowing that your Lexus have 0.42 less problem than the BMW over a 3 year period.

CDNROCKIES

Dude now you're showing you can't do math either.

I already showed you it's 37%, now you're quoting that it's actually higher at 42%.

Reliability of a vehicle has nothing to do with how I sleep. Just so you know, they're inanimate objects that are just for transportation.

FWIW, I did look hard at German super sedans and now that I'm in the market to replace our current RX we're also looking at the German SUV's. They offer things other than reliability (ie. performance/handling) that might be worth the switch. But again, I know going in, eyes wide open, that the reliability will not be what it is with Lexus.

And for the third post in a row, you have avoided addressing where this thread started. To compare the RX reliability to the German SUV's is laughable.

I have tried to steer this convo back to the RX but you seem unwilling to discuss it. If you want to talk about the RX fine, if not I think we're done here.

Ice350

iTrader: (1)

I've had few problems with my Lexus cars and only one that returned after being fixed. That was the 97 ES300 we had and I consider that car as close to a lemon as Lexus gets. The car wouldn't idle properly and they never fixed it. Other than that, I've never even heard of someone having to take cars back for the same thing....except for the recent rattle problems some members are having.

Look, I like German cars too. I still believe the Mercedes is superior to Lexus in luxury and definitely performance. Nothing rides like a Benz. We had only a lowly C280 but riding in the car always felt special. The materials, the ride...even the smell of the car was unlike any other. My wife loved the ground that car rode on. After it got past 70K miles, it was a miserable piece of crap. By the time we got to 100K miles, more money was spent repairing that car than is humanly expected. I finally had to force it away from my wife. She was actually crying but I wasn't going to allow further drain on our finances. It cost us at least $500 every other month and sometimes more. Especially when the engine overheated and had to be rebuilt. I still have fondness for them but I'm not stupid enough to ignore the problems those cars have.

The G Man

Dude That 0.42 is not percentage, it is the 162 problems that the BMW have for every 100 car in 3 year minus the 120 problems that Lexus have for every 100 car in 3 year according to JD power. Thats comes out to 42 more problem for every 100 BMW in 3 years, which means for every BMW in 3 years time, it has 0.42 more incident of problem than the Lexus. In my book 0.42 more problem in 3 years might as well be nothing.

37% more problems becomes insignificant when the numbers are so low. If I have a penny in my pocket and you have 100% more money than me, does that make you rich. Look back at the JD power long term ratings in the 1990s. The number of issues per 100 car is much higher. The whole industry as a whole have made hugh improvemnet, esspecially the Euro manufacturers. Which is bad news for Lexus since reliability is their bread and butter.

The G Man

Ice350, I hate to tell your wife this, but the MB C280 is a piece of crap Its a poor attempt at a economic MB. The newer C-class is a bit better, but its still not what I would consider a true MB.

CDNROCKIES

You clearly can't read or do math. Wth is 0.42 then? The number is 164, not 162 like you quote in the first part...even though the correct number is right below it where you quote me.

You can't seem to make up your mind what you want to argue about. Your original statement was: "BMW and Audi of today are just as reliable as most Japanese cars."

Being 37% and 72.5% more likely to have problems than a Lexus for BMW and Audi respectively, IS NOT being just as reliable.

Why do you keep avoiding the question of a comparison of the RX to the German SUV's? The reliability of the German's SUV's compared to the RX is not even close, that's why!

Ice350

iTrader: (1)

Have you ever owned one? They are true Benz cars. Ours was made in Germany and behaved just like all the other Benzes I've been around.

CDNROCKIES

Ice350, don't sweat it man...if you've followed the thread it is clear that he has no actual basis for any of his statements. Just keeps throwing his opinions out there.

You've had a tough enough last couple of days with your wheels, don't let this bother you.

RXSF

actually, i have owned a 1994 C280 and it was indeed crap . now i own a 2009 C350 and i must say, they have come a long way

CDNROCKIES

Nice new ride! I came extremely close to buying a C63 and agree with you RXSF.

Now, apparently it's only some German vehicles that are up to his standards.

Ice350

iTrader: (1)

I don't think I'll ever reply to comment by g man again.

The G Man

The 1st C-class was an early attempt for MB to break into the entry level luxury market. They did not impressed too many people, but they did a bit better than BMW 1st attempt. The new C-Class is a bit better but still full of cheap materials inside and out. I guess thats why it is a entry level lexury car.

The G Man

I am not arguing at all, you are the one getting all work up All I am saying is that the late model European cars are very close to the reliability of Japanese cars and you keep bring up the un-reliable history of older Europeans cars. You can argue with me on decimal points until you are blue in the face but you cannot argue the fact that 1.6 problem in 3 years is not extremely worst than 1.2 problem in 3 years. Most of us bought our Lexus because of reliability, but if you own owned Lexus for as long as I have, you would know that the Lexus of today id not as reliable as the Lexus of yester-year. In fact, today's Lexus is not as soild as the old ones and quality is down as well.

The G Man

I am sorry, sometime the truth hurts, the C280 was a piece of crap. They are not made to last like a typical MB, you are smart to get rid of it. Get her a new C350, its a much better car.