Bought my first Lexus... never again.
#61
Lexus Champion
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I would not say 120 problems in a 100 Lexus in 3 years and a 150 problems in a 100 BMW in 3 years as significantly more reliable.
The fact is that you bought a car that is a tad bit more reliable and a tad bit less performance. Those are the trade offs, you can continue to hand onto the notion that Japanese cars are much more reliable than germans car, but the narrowing gap in reliability from most of the data doesnt not support your thinking.
The fact is that you bought a car that is a tad bit more reliable and a tad bit less performance. Those are the trade offs, you can continue to hand onto the notion that Japanese cars are much more reliable than germans car, but the narrowing gap in reliability from most of the data doesnt not support your thinking.
Quoted directly from my originial post. Why you continue to post mis-information is beyond me?
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The BMW actually had 164 problems, not 150. I'm curious to know where 37% is not significant when referring to data. Now it appears you're only focusing on the one German brand that has made the greatest improvements. Look again at the numbers for MB and Audi....they aren't even close, although you can argue that they have improved.
What does whatever car I bought have to do with anything?
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I actually drove American cars prior to my Lexus'. I was one of the fortunate few who had no major issues with my American brands. Does that mean I should come in here and try to tell everyone that GFC are as reliable as Lexus is?
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I have never once stated that the Germans haven't improved. They have, just like Lexus is improving on the performance/handling side.
Again, though, I will remind you that you started this discussion on the RX:
If you would like to try to argue that a MB ML, BMW X5 or Audi Q7 is as reliable as the RX, I can provide you with boatloads of data to prove otherwise.
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#62
Lexus Test Driver
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44 more problem in a 100 cars in 3 years is not much more un-reliable in my book. With that said, I am sure you can sleep better at night knowing that your Lexus have 0.42 less problem than the BMW over a 3 year period.
#63
Lexus Champion
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I already showed you it's 37%, now you're quoting that it's actually higher at 42%.
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Reliability of a vehicle has nothing to do with how I sleep.
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FWIW, I did look hard at German super sedans and now that I'm in the market to replace our current RX we're also looking at the German SUV's. They offer things other than reliability (ie. performance/handling) that might be worth the switch. But again, I know going in, eyes wide open, that the reliability will not be what it is with Lexus.
And for the third post in a row, you have avoided addressing where this thread started. To compare the RX reliability to the German SUV's is laughable.
I have tried to steer this convo back to the RX but you seem unwilling to discuss it. If you want to talk about the RX fine, if not I think we're done here.
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#64
Lexus Fanatic
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Look, I like German cars too. I still believe the Mercedes is superior to Lexus in luxury and definitely performance. Nothing rides like a Benz. We had only a lowly C280 but riding in the car always felt special. The materials, the ride...even the smell of the car was unlike any other. My wife loved the ground that car rode on. After it got past 70K miles, it was a miserable piece of crap. By the time we got to 100K miles, more money was spent repairing that car than is humanly expected. I finally had to force it away from my wife. She was actually crying but I wasn't going to allow further drain on our finances. It cost us at least $500 every other month and sometimes more. Especially when the engine overheated and had to be rebuilt. I still have fondness for them but I'm not stupid enough to ignore the problems those cars have.
#65
Lexus Test Driver
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37% more problems becomes insignificant when the numbers are so low. If I have a penny in my pocket and you have 100% more money than me, does that make you rich. Look back at the JD power long term ratings in the 1990s. The number of issues per 100 car is much higher. The whole industry as a whole have made hugh improvemnet, esspecially the Euro manufacturers. Which is bad news for Lexus since reliability is their bread and butter.
#66
Lexus Test Driver
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Ice350, I hate to tell your wife this, but the MB C280 is a piece of crap
Its a poor attempt at a economic MB. The newer C-class is a bit better, but its still not what I would consider a true MB.
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#67
Lexus Champion
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Dude
That 0.42 is not percentage, it is the 162 problems that the BMW have for every 100 car in 3 year minus the 120 problems that Lexus have for every 100 car in 3 year according to JD power. Thats comes out to 42 more problem for every 100 BMW in 3 years, which means for every BMW in 3 years time, it has 0.42 more incident of problem than the Lexus. In my book 0.42 more problem in 3 years might as well be nothing.
37% more problems becomes insignificant when the numbers are so low. If I have a penny in my pocket and you have 100% more money than me, does that make you rich. Look back at the JD power long term ratings in the 1990s. The number of issues per 100 car is much higher. The whole industry as a whole have made hugh improvemnet, esspecially the Euro manufacturers. Which is bad news for Lexus since reliability is their bread and butter.
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37% more problems becomes insignificant when the numbers are so low. If I have a penny in my pocket and you have 100% more money than me, does that make you rich. Look back at the JD power long term ratings in the 1990s. The number of issues per 100 car is much higher. The whole industry as a whole have made hugh improvemnet, esspecially the Euro manufacturers. Which is bad news for Lexus since reliability is their bread and butter.
You clearly can't read or do math.
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You can't seem to make up your mind what you want to argue about. Your original statement was: "BMW and Audi of today are just as reliable as most Japanese cars."
Being 37% and 72.5% more likely to have problems than a Lexus for BMW and Audi respectively, IS NOT being just as reliable.
Why do you keep avoiding the question of a comparison of the RX to the German SUV's?
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#69
Lexus Champion
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You've had a tough enough last couple of days with your wheels, don't let this bother you.
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#71
Lexus Champion
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Now, apparently it's only some German vehicles that are up to his standards.
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#73
Lexus Test Driver
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The 1st C-class was an early attempt for MB to break into the entry level luxury market. They did not impressed too many people, but they did a bit better than BMW 1st attempt. The new C-Class is a bit better but still full of cheap materials inside and out. I guess thats why it is a entry level lexury car.
Last edited by The G Man; 01-17-09 at 01:49 PM.
#74
Lexus Test Driver
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I am not arguing at all, you are the one getting all work up
All I am saying is that the late model European cars are very close to the reliability of Japanese cars and you keep bring up the un-reliable history of older Europeans cars. You can argue with me on decimal points until you are blue in the face but you cannot argue the fact that 1.6 problem in 3 years is not extremely worst than 1.2 problem in 3 years. Most of us bought our Lexus because of reliability, but if you own owned Lexus for as long as I have, you would know that the Lexus of today id not as reliable as the Lexus of yester-year. In fact, today's Lexus is not as soild as the old ones and quality is down as well.
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Last edited by The G Man; 01-17-09 at 01:21 PM.
#75
Lexus Test Driver
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I am sorry, sometime the truth hurts, the C280 was a piece of crap. They are not made to last like a typical MB, you are smart to get rid of it. Get her a new C350, its a much better car.
Last edited by The G Man; 01-17-09 at 01:50 PM.