ggebhardt

Kalvano is just in denial! If I were selling cars these days I would be too! His crack about Calif and Florida are kinda in bad taste. While I agree there are lot of people out there still buying the higher end cars and SUVs, Lexus is not exempt!

By late this summer the "New Economy" will still be in decline

kalvano

How am I "in denial"?

People still have money, they are still buying things, including cars.

The massive sales drops are due to the terrible economy in Florida and California, which are also, coincidentally, the two biggest volume states for car makers.

But judging from your posts, you seem to revel in the bad economy. You say they will have trouble meeting sales figures, yet you have already put money down to purchase an RX that you haven't driven, don't know for sure when it will be out, and don't know how much it costs.

You're like the guy who complains about the economy while looking at a LS 600hL.

What is this "New Economy" you keep talking about, anyway? Not to derail my own thread, but you do realize that there have been bad times before, and things have worked out fine in the end? Nothing will change...some people will lose their jobs, some will be unlucky, some will be lucky, and sooner or later things will turn right back around. There is nothing "new" about that.

ggebhardt

Well at least you are admitting that the two biggest buyers of the Lexus are Fl and Ca!

The LX600hl was not around when I bought the LS460.

You also need to re-read my posts, I am NOT complaining about the New Economy.

YOU seem to "revel" in the Lexus cost and were in denial when the dealers started discounting to move the older inventory off the lots.

Btmnk21

iTrader: (1)

Jan 2009 vs 2008 sales figures:

% Change
IS250/350/F -29.3
ES350 -34.3
GS350/460/450h -41.7
SC430 -61.6
LS460/600h L -54.4
Total Cars -37.7

RX350/400h -7.2
GX470 -63.6
LX570 -55.6
Total Trucks -21.2

Total Sales -30.3

RX did the best, but probably due to discounting and being the most popular model. However everything else took big hits...

ggebhardt

Wow, I did not think it was that bad yet. I thought that just the upper end cars would be off but seeing the IS, GS and ES units down that much, too.

RXSF

i have to side with kalvano, people still have money out there. they may be more frugal with it, but they still have it, and they will spend it eventually.

back i december, i remember doing my shopping, and stores like Neiman Marcus and Saks were having sales, for like the first time ever, and low and behold, rich people buying up what they would have bought originally, but more cheaper. those places were packed.

Btmnk21

iTrader: (1)

Says the guy from one of the richest parts of the country...

Not sure if you can read, but the stats I posted before do not lie. Lexus sales are down an average of 30% from last year. A subjective story of people shopping at xmas in retail stores is not a good example to back up sales forecasts for luxury vehicles.

Plus even if there is a correlation in your area between retail shopping and car sales, the country is bigger than San Fran. How many high paying financial services jobs have been lost across the US? It's not just blue collar jobs that are being hit hard. Luxury vehicles will take a hit. Granted people making more than $250K will probably buy cars still, but I doubt anyone who lost a job, could lose a job, or is only relatively well-off will be...

Lexmex

True, they do buy at sales, but the bottom line is that that profit margin is diminished and that means stuff like bonuses, salary increases are not likely. Moreover, if there were a chance to buy these luxury items, now would be the chance to do it (or even a bit later if the economy is weaker) as we hope when the economy goes back up, that prices for these items will, too.

The only place where I saw a "sale" work to near perfection was when I lived in Latin America, most recently Mexico and there they do something where all they do is advertise they are having a sale, but they don't actually decrease prices, in fact in some cases they raise them, but amazingly enough there would be enough suckers who would actually go there and buy stuff and think they would be getting a deal. I hope when the Internet really gets to the point in Latin America like we have it here in the U.S., that there are better educated consumers there. I saw too many friends get suckered in down there.

I still think it is a tough market anywhere in this country and in this world. The point being, even in kalvano's case, is to the best job they can in selling their product. That's all that can be done now or in the future. I had a salesman the other day at a Lexus dealer near me, West Kendall, do an excellent job of showing a GX470 to my girlfriend (she loves it) and I, and coming out of that, I didn't feel at all there was an economic issue at hand. He sold it just as well as if it were a good economy.

ggebhardt

I am siding with Kalvano, too! People do have money but many more are electing not to spend it. The package the goverment is putting together is not going to encourage the middle class to run out and spend it on a new Lexus. The bill in it's present form will not pass but if the dems toss the replicans a few bones they will jump on the spending bandwagon, too. For the first time in my life, I fear our goverment has become a major part of our problem. Where were we at when congress was voting to give themselves automatic yearly raises unless they voted against it! If the current administration backs unions like they say they are, well . . .

I agree with your "eventually" but I am betting not soon. Like Kalvano said it WILL get better, but I am saying we will get much worst before that. Lots of things can play out, if Mexico's goverment fails you will have millions of people rushing the southern US borders, nothing will stop them. Over 1/3 of our oil comes from Mexico. Imagine what that will do. The drug cartel will control Mexico.

Lexmex

Also good points.

I think what Lexus needs to do, and more to the point with the new RX model, is really strongly focus on how better this vehicle is over its competition and the preceding RX series. When the economy is bad, the worst thing you can do is not advertise. I have a friend of my father's who is in a unique printing business, they do foil printing (and for a very cheap price), and nobody else really does that in the U.S. (I am not kidding) and they are literally advertising the hell out of it, because their competitors cannot afford to either advertise or get the new equipment to do it. And at the same time, you are stealing the competition's customers.

I am at true believer that if you have a product that is at the forefront of the competition, even in a bad economy, and you advertise it enough and correctly, you can steal sales (even if it is not a lot), but the side benefit is enormous...brand image. Moreover, advertising costs in a depressed market are cheaper, there's no reason not to improve one's image over the competition if they can't afford to advertise or don't think to advertise. I think Lexus is probably in the best position (along with Toyota) to do this. The Toyota Venza Super Bowl ad is an example.

Lexmex

The Mexican issue is confined largely to the northern border. Having lived down there and seen it, the American media hypes stuff so out of proportion.

I think the drug cartel issue right now is that they have are fighting over the American market and have lost a lot of money due to the problems in the American economy. Thus, they are shooting it out against each other. Killing off the competition is one sure fire way to get the drug market share. The drug cartels are getting more desperate and as a result the amount and type of violence has grown more prolific.

ggebhardt

I know families who live far from the border and have watched 1/3 of their local authorities attacked, many were killed. These people do lack coordination but the incentives are great!

Lemex, sorry about all of this and I will try to keep the conversation in the area of Lexus!

Btmnk21

iTrader: (1)

This is a little off topic but I cannot allow you to make such ignorant statements.

1) Toss republicans a bone? Obama and the house dems did exactly that and guess what they all voted no still. It's not about what's in the package its the fact that they did not draft it, they are out of power, and they don't believe they can get back in power by supporting anything Obama does. It's out of the playbook if the Republicans from the Clinton years. Frankly I dont even see why the Republicans should be included. We voted them out in 2006 and in 2008 and they are partly to blame (more so then the Dem's) for the current crisis- no regulations, no taxes, no oversight, spend spend spend. I dont want the people who caused the problem to think they can solve it by using the same methods that caused it- we've seen what their ideas cause time for someone else's.

2) Spending bandwagon? The 6 years with Bush and the Republicans in control of COngress were the highest spending years in US history. The deficit and the national debt skyrocketed. Want to blame most of that on Iraq- go ahead- who started that one by the way? If you want to blame the Dem's for that feel free to try, except remember nothing really got done for 2 years because of something called the filibuster which Republicans used a record breaking number of times.

3) It's sad that you fear the govt now. I guess spying on you, stagnant wages for 8 years, high gas prices, an illegal war, incompentent govt (i.e Katrina, Brownie, Gonzales, Harriet Myers), suspension of habeus corpus, and torture are things you are proud of?

Lexmex

I am going to close this thread as I think we've reached enough points and any further ones, especially political, would belong in our fine debate forum located here, https://www.clublexus.com/forums/the-debate-forum-140/